International Court of Justice - Macedonia and Greece

[Bill77]

The solution is simple.
End the negotiations and begin restoring some pride in the Macedonian identity.
It is the only solution even though it may not be enough.

I agree........

[Risto the Great]

More lies from Gruevski

http://www.emg.rs/en/news/region/175334.html

Macedonia's EU and NATO membership priority, but not at identity price, Gruevski tells "Die Welt"
27. February 2012. | 09:47

Source: MIA

According to Gruevski, EU membership is important for the country's economy, but one cannot compromise over the country's defining and statehood.

NATO and EU membership is in Macedonia's national interest and we are doing everything to achieve this. However, our accession has been delayed for too long due to the name row. Macedonia is ready for talks in settling this dispute, but they require two sides. The solution should not harm Macedonian identity and statehood, Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski says in an interview with German daily "Die Welt".

"Our NATO and EU accession has been delayed for too long due to the name row. This is vital for our economy, but also for peace on the Western Balkans. However, our identity is at stake here. Greece disputes our right to name ourselves as we see fit - Macedonia. The International Court of Justice is on our side, ruling that we can join all international institutions under our name, which we chose after the breakup of former Yugoslavia, one in line with our history", stresses PM Gruevski.

Asked if something has changed since the Papademos government has taken over in Greece, Gruevski says there have not been any changes.

"Unfortunately, I have to say no. The new Greek PM has clearly said that the name settlement is not in his agenda. He probably has enough problems as it is. Nothing is budging. But, we continue to have hopes", says the PM.

Gruevski adds there is no other plan for the dispute's settlement besides talks.

"The Americans attempted to do something within their Balkan policy, but failed. There were also contacts on the part of the United Nations. However, there is no breakthrough on the horizon", he says.

According to Gruevski, EU membership is important for the country's economy, but one cannot compromise over the country's defining and statehood.

He says Germany is Macedonia's main economic partner, providing enormous assistance, and added, "we are successfully exporting wine, agriculture products, metals and textile, because we are price-competitive".

Gruevski stresses the name row has no effect on economic relations with Greece, which is Macedonia's third business partner.

"Increasing number of Greek companies want to invest on our side of the border. This is based on lower salaries, but also due to the lack of bureaucratic barriers, which halt industrial development", underlines PM Gruevski in the interview with "Die Welt".

The ICJ ruling did nothing of the sort. No wonder so many naive Macedonians celebrate the stupidity of that court case win.

Oh, and the idea that Macedonia has hopes the Greeks will continue with a name settlement is so demeaning to me personally. I hope the world becomes a better place. I know I am Macedonian. I wish he did.

[Soldier of Macedon]

The International Court of Justice is on our side, ruling that we can join all international institutions under our name, which we chose after the breakup of former Yugoslavia, one in line with our history", stresses PM Gruevski.

Are the citizens of Macedonia that naive that not a single person has questioned Gruevski about this BLATANT LIE?

[Vangelovski]

Are the citizens of Macedonia that naive that not a single person has questioned Gruevski about this BLATANT LIE?

I think the vast majority of people don't bother reading the court documents because the either don't care or don't understand English. Those that do just don't understand what's happening. I would not be suprised if Gruevski changed Macedonia's name and then created a North Korean style bizzaro world in which people in Macedonia are told that they didn't change the name and the entire world has now recognised it. Imagine trying to bring them to their senses then!

[Risto the Great]

Where are all the supporters of the ICJ case?
They got what they wanted and the supposed positive results were supposed to have flown immediately.

Here is a tip for the naive, you were wrong. If you want Macedonia, by all means fight for it in any and every way ... but please fight for Macedonia not FYROM.

[George S.]

it still defies logic of how a country cannot be named macedonia just because greece holds a portion which greece calls it a province.It's all a joke.Greece hold's their portion by stealth & stealing.!

[Risto the Great]

Slovenia: Macedonia should get invitation for NATO as FYROM

http://www.focus-fen.net/index.php?id=n274882

Slovenian ambassador to Skopje Alan Bergant said that after the ruling of the International Court in The Hague and the recommendation of the European Commission (EC) for launching the pre-accession negotiations, there is a need to discuss the Macedonian issue at the NATO summit in Chicago, writes Macedonian Vecer daily.
“Slovenia thinks that the Chicago summit should give Macedonia an invitation under the name of Former Yugoslavian Republic of Macedonia (FYROM),” Bergant said.

Yay ... I can hear the cheering. Such good friends those former Yugoslavs.

[Vangelovski]

The idea that the key political parties in Macedonia (Macedonian and Albanian) form a coalition government and take the country to a referendum for a name change is floating around again. The idea is that they would all be to blame for the name change and would hold elections immediately afterwards and start from a 'level playing field' in terms of the treason they just undertook.

http://sky.mk/makedonija/20605-%D0%9F%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B2%D1%80%D0%B5%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8-%D0%B8%D0%B7%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B8-%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B3%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B7%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8-%D0%BE%D0%B4-%D1%88%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%BA%D0%B0-%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%B0%D0%BB%D0%B8%D1%86%D0%B8%D1%98%D0%B0.html

[Vangelovski]

They're really coming out before the NATO summit. We'll need to keep statements like this so when the Gruevski brigade tries to deny them like they did last time, we can point back to these. Gruevski wants a compromise that will be acceptable to the 'majority' (50+1 per cent) of the citizens of Macedonia.

Ние сакаме да се дојде до решение за името, тоа решение може да биде компромис, но не може да биде диктат со кој што ќе се менува идентитетот и нешто што со векови се градело, се почитувало, се негувало и се живеело за него. Ние сакаме решение што ќе биде прифатливо за мнозинството граѓани на Република Македонија на организиран референдум. Ова го изјави премиерот Никола Груевски одговарајќи на прашање на пратеникот Тито Петковски за тоа дали има подготвеност за единствен државнички став пред Самитот во Чикаго.

Full article available at http://www.vest.com.mk/?ItemID=AA0F7...302CE35025EEC2

[Phoenix]

The idea that the key political parties in Macedonia (Macedonian and Albanian) form a coalition government and take the country to a referendum for a name change is floating around again. The idea is that they would all be to blame for the name change and would hold elections immediately afterwards and start from a 'level playing field' in terms of the treason they just undertook.

Sneaky bastards...that would be an extremely gutless move requiring no political responsibility or accountability...I'm no longer sure if any strategy or slight of hand is out of reach for a government and opposition totally fixated on EU and NATO membership at any cost.

[United MKD]

Македонија повторно ќе ја тужи Грција во Хаг?!
Македонија се спрема за ново обраќање пред Меѓународниот суд на правдата во Хаг против Грција за нејзиното однесување на штотуку завршениот самит на НАТО во Чикаго и лобирање нашата држава и понатаму да остане надвор од Алијансата, велат за „Дневник“ дипломатски извори.

Како што наведува дневниот весник, повикувајќи се на свои извори, правниот тим кој го подготви веќе добиениот случај во Хаг, ќе го извести истиот суд ако пронајде аргументи дека Грција со настапот во Чикаго не го почитувала барањето на Судот да не го повтори однесувањето од Букурешт.

-Проценката дека јужниот сосед не се однесувал согласно пресудата на Меѓународниот суд најмногу би се темелела на однесувањето на грчките претставници за време на дискусијата на Самитот посветена на заклучоците. Имено, како што велат дипломатските извори, иако Грција се пофалила дека во Чикаго имала дипломатски успех во однос на Македонија, сепак грчката дипломатија била сериозно изложена на жестоки притисоци, а дискусијата по однос на заклучоците од Самитот во делот за Македонија била жестока и маратонска, објави Дневник.

Весникот во својата анализа пишува дека Турција, зад која застанале уште неколку пријателски земји меѓу кои Албанија, Хрватска, Унгарија, Холандија и Словенија ја покренала дискусијата за Македонија при формирањето на заклучоците.

-При тоа, дискусиите на моменти биле толку жестоки што дури се одржувале и одвоени билатерални средби меѓу турските и грчките претставници. Грците силно се противеле и се заканувале со вето, се повикувале и се криеле позади консензусот, за било каква промена на заклучокот од Букурешт, напиша Дневник.

Главна порака која претседателот Иванов сакал да ја пренесе во Чикаго била Mакедoнија да добие покана за членство во НАТО на следниот самит на Алијансата, независно дали до тогаш ќе се реши спорот со грција за името.

-Клучниот аргумент кој го користел шефот на државата покрај ланската пресуда на Меѓународниот суд во Хаг била дека Грција се однесува неодговорно кон обврските од Времената спогодба и пресудата, но исто така и во преговорите за изнаоѓање на взаемно прифатливо решение во спорот за името. Иванов посочувал дека тоа е единствениот начин Грција да биде соочена со последици кои на одреден начин ќе ја примораат конструктивно да се однесува во разговорите за името и да се придржува до рамката. Ако тоа не се случи тогаш, велел Иванов, Македонија да биде примена под времената референца, а пресудата од Хаг да биде нотирана во заклучоците, пиштува весникот.

Дипломатските извори на Дневник велат дека Македонија ги повратува симпатиите на партнерите во НАТО, а за очекување е истото да се случува и во контекст на ЕУ интеграцијата.

http://kurir.mk/makedonija/vesti/71949-Makedonija-povtorno-ke-ja-tuzi-Grcija-vo-Hag

[Makedonska_Kafana]

Gruevski responds bluntly to NATO's decision

http://setimes.com/cocoon/setimes/xhtml/en_GB/features/setimes/features/2012/05/23/feature-01

Gruevski responds bluntly to NATO's decision
23/05/2012

NATO's decision not to invite to Macedonia to join the Alliance during the just-concluded summit in Chicago sparked a volley of strong reactions, perhaps the most stinging from the prime minister himself.
By Misko Taleski for Southeast European Times in Skopje -- 23/05/12

Macedonia Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski gave NATO a stinging rebuke on Tuesday (May 22nd) after the organisation passed on the option to extend membership to his country due to Greece's longtime objections.

The rejection was expected by observers, but that didn't keep Gruevski from bitterly criticising NATO in an interview Tuesday with the Macedonian Information Agency (MIA).

"Such a policy of double standards, unprincipled-ness and moving away from the values they themselves publicly proclaim, I have not seen in a long time as is the case with Macedonia. They are ignoring the International Court of Justice ruling," Gruevski said, referring to a December 2011 decision in which the court concluded that Greece had violated a 1995 Interim Accord when it vetoed Macedonia's bid for NATO membership in 2008.

Gruevski's unusually frank language reflects the disappointment for Macedonians, where recent polls showed that 85% of the population wanted the nation to be a NATO member. Newspaper headlines in Macedonia called the two-day Chicago summit a "disgrace."

"Finally, somebody expressed that which the people think, being fully aware about the inequalities and realities of international politics. The choice NATO gives Macedonia to appease Greece, is no choice; we will never change nor should change our name. If NATO does not want us in as Macedonia, we should reconsider our commitment to the alliance," Borche Ristevski, 32, a resident of Skopje, told SETimes.

While criticising some of the Western leaders, Gruevski said the sole culprit is Greece, which he said has used all means at its disposal over the past two decades to slow Macedonia's development because of the longstanding disagreement over Macedonia's name.

"These countries [NATO members] I consider our friends, but they are at the same time greater friends of Greece. That is how it was in the past 21 years and that is why Greece succeeds at harassing Macedonia to the maximum, without facing serious consequences," said Gruevski. Macedonians say anything but the name "Republic of Macedonia" denies the nation's right of identity. Greece has said the name is an implied threat towards its province of the same name.

Macedonia has been recognised by more than 100 countries and was admitted to the UN in 1993, but in that body -- and most other international organisations -- is identified as "the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia." Macedonia applied for NATO membership in 2005 and believed that it would be accepted in 2008, but Greece blocked a formal invitation

Despite the latest disappointment, Gruevski stressed that Macedonia remains committed to eventual membership. "We will remain dedicated to materialising our strategic goal for NATO membership and will work towards it. If somebody tells the truth, it does not mean he is picking a fight with the strategic partners," Gruevski concluded.

Most analysts said the speech was a call to unite the country politically and that Gruevski –without question -- succeeded.

"Gruevski has struck a chord with the people because he is the first Macedonian leader to state things as they objectively are, despite a potential threat to his position. The interview channeled the pain Macedonians feel while affected in every way possible by Greece's blockages and obfuscation internationally," Vladimir Bozhinovski, analyst at the Institute for Political Research, told SETimes.

"The speech also lays the ground for Macedonia to define its 'red line' regarding the Greek-imposed name issue," he added.

Current and former policy makers expressed support, particularly praising the importance domestic policy continues to place on the rule of law as well as international law tenants.

"If Macedonia sends most soldiers to NATO missions per capita; if its soldiers fight terrorism in Afghanistan and Iraq with high-level professionalism as NATO allies; if we have satisfied all standards and criteria, achieved all reforms and are not getting anything in response, then Macedonia is right to be critical about the processes and the behaviour of some states," Slobodan Chashule, Macedonia's former foreign minister, told SETimes.

"In the case of Greece, it appears here that NATO and the EU are rewarding bad behaviour. Such an approach is already very costly for the EU, and we hope it will not be similarly costly to NATO," Chashule said.

[George S.]

all the more not to join.

[Vangelovski]

Everything has been said and done in relation to the ICJ case where Macedonia sued Greece in order to have the Interim Accord validated by the international judicial body and claim the right to be called FYROM. Some were saying this was the 'master stroke' with which Gruevski would get us into the EU/NATO as 'Macedonia'. It goes without saying that they neither read the ICJ application nor wanted to. Some, like Meto Koloski from UMD, still haven't worked it out. They are still promoting the ICJ case as a 'win' and still supporting the full implementation of the Interim Accord - Macedonia's acceptance into international organisations like NATO under the FYROM terminology:

In 2011, the International Court of Justice (ICJ) ruled that Greece violated Article 11 of the 1995 United Nations Interim Accord by objecting to Macedonia's membership into NATO at the 2008 Bucharest Summit. Instead of taking this ruling into consideration, NATO leaders yielding to Greek pressure have yet to extend a well-deserved invitation to Macedonia. Greece has an obligation not to veto Macedonia's membership in international bodies under the 1995 United Nations Interim Accord.

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=15826

Gruevski spent millions of dollars to legitimise the IA and the FYROM terminology. At least he has been unsuccessful to-date in embedding Macedonia into those racist institutions. But how many more millions of dollars will he waste trying to do so?

[George S.]

with the interim accord we haven't won anything.WE have lost the case especially lots of millions of $$.Greece has said if Macedonia persists it will get a greek blockade & we have seen the damage that did Macedonia.The icj should have been rejected outright as its vey damaging to Macedonia.