Albanianization in Macedonia

[Goran-Skopje]

Ova se slucuva zatoa sto ja uzivaat celosnata poddrska od zapadnite zemji + USA,taka da,nase e da ocekuvame i da se nadevame oni da im svrtat grb,a toa nekogas mora da se sluci,pa posle toa da vidime "cija majka crna volna ke prede" ! Nemoj da zaboravis deka od Aracinovo vo 2001-va bea izvadeni so amerikanski avtobusi,pridruzuvani od amerikanska vojska kako zastita !!!

[DraganOfStip]

Albanians are taking over because Macedonians have given up in every instance. The ventilator is a terrific example of how weak Macedonians are. Like it or not, it is a symbol of national weakness.

I think things might change if Macedonians START with the flag.

The ventilator as a symbol never appears in Macedonian history OR as a symbol of Macedonia.NEVER!So why would something like this become our national flag?To start with,the Kutlesh sun was an excellent choice for our flag.It is one of the oldest symbols of Macedonia and it's found in various sites throughout it's territory.But since the Greeks have it "branded" as a Greek symbol,any external use (as it was shown) is regarded as a real-life version of "copyright infringement".So the best solution (historically speaking) would be the next best thing,another symbol of our country.I think that the next best solution (in my opinion at least) would be the yellow lion on a red shield,a symbol for Macedonia since the 15th century onward (even though in some drawings Alexander the Great is shown bearing it on his shield,which places it even as back as Ancient Macedonia).However,since the symbol has been abused by political parties with the "VMRO" in their name,it is unlikely that leftist and center-orientated parties will ever accept this symbol (moreover,the lion was proposed to be Macedonia's official coat-of-arms replacing the old commie one,but SDSM and other parties voted against it,so the only change to the coat-of-arms was taking off the red star from it's top).Other countries have included symbols from their history (Russians and Serbs have the white eagle,Croats their chessboard etc.) so I don't see why would a ventilator displayed as a sun as a cover-up would represent ANY country,let alone Macedonia.It's a damn shame that Macedonians left out the lion because of political reasons.

[Niko777]

eve gi slikite od moja ekskursija

prvo selo debreste, ovde ziveat torbeshi, ama se pravat siptari.
dzamiata mu e so tursko zname

Macedonians should take a good look at these mosques, because if they don't change their attitude soon, their churches will also turn into mosques in the near future!

But since the Greeks have it "branded" as a Greek symbol,any external use (as it was shown) is regarded as a real-life version of "copyright infringement".

I'm sure if Macedonia tried (they have never attempted so far) they could fight this on many grounds: 1. How can a modern country hold a copyright on a symbol thousands of years old or 2. that this is a Macedonian symbol and therefore every part of divided Macedonia has a right to use this symbol, or 3. it can argue that the symbol has also been found on its territory at many archaeological locations so what makes Greece so special to exclusively own this symbol?

[Niko777]

These new mosques kind of remind me of Aegean Macedonia where for the last 20 years there has been a significant trend for villages and cities to raise money and build new churches, except in Greece it was the Greek church driving this trend for the purpose of making people proud of their Christian and "Greek" identity. This is what the Albanians are doing, they are showing us that they are proud Albanian Muslims and are challenging the legitimacy of a Macedonian state in general.

[Vangelovski]

Ova se slucuva zatoa sto ja uzivaat celosnata poddrska od zapadnite zemji + USA,taka da,nase e da ocekuvame i da se nadevame oni da im svrtat grb,a toa nekogas mora da se sluci,pa posle toa da vidime "cija majka crna volna ke prede" ! Nemoj da zaboravis deka od Aracinovo vo 2001-va bea izvadeni so amerikanski avtobusi,pridruzuvani od amerikanska vojska kako zastita !!!

Prvo i osnovno, ova se slucuva bidekji ja uzivaat celosnata poddrska od Makedonskata Vlada, a vladata od mnozinstvoto od narodot! Nitu Amerika, nitu Evropa moze da ima tolkavo vlijanie ako Makedonskiot narod ne mu dozvoluva. No ova e tugja i nerazbirliva misla za mnogu Makedonci.

[Goran-Skopje]

Prvo i osnovno, ova se slucuva bidekji ja uzivaat celosnata poddrska od Makedonskata Vlada, a vladata od mnozinstvoto od narodot! Nitu Amerika, nitu Evropa moze da ima tolkavo vlijanie ako Makedonskiot narod ne mu dozvoluva. No ova e tugja i nerazbirliva misla za mnogu Makedonci.

Na makedoncite iskreno im e preku glava od zastitata na siptarite,koja sto (vo pravo si),doaga od makedonskata vlada,ama sigurno ne po nivna volja i keif,nego pod pritisok od zapadnite sili (inace sleduva voen konflikt,ili vojna,so garancija)...Samo da Ve potsetam na incidentot na Kale,pred godina dena.Ucestvuvaa 60-na makedonci i 300 siptari...Denes imame 20 osudeni makedonci (po brza postapka) na uslovni kazni,i isto tolku albanci,a soodnosot e 1:5,plus,makedoncite napadnati od albancite.Vtoro,posle ubistvoto na makedoncite kaj Smilkovsko ezero,na protest izleguvaat 1000 makedonci pred vlada (doaga do neznacitelen sudir so policijata),den posle toa,privedeni preku 20 makedonci...Sledniot den,1000 albanci pred istata taa vlada protestiraat (baraat osloboduvanje na albancite - ubijci),nema nieden pripadnik na specijalnite policiski sili,ima mal incident,ama nieden ne e priveden na informativen razgovor.Vo meguvreme se pojavuvaat razno-razni stranski diplomati (pa duri i amerikanski ambasador),koi sto,pazete,baraat pravicna istraga vo slucajot "Ubistvo kaj Smilkovsko ezero".

[lavce pelagonski]

This is what is happening in my village:

New mosque causes ethnic rift in southwest Macedonia

11/06/2012

Plans by an Islamic community to build a new mosque in southwest Macedonia is causing an ethnic rift.

By Goran Trajkov for Southeast European Times in Skopje -- 11/06/12

A village mosque that is to be built in Lazec, near Bitola, in southwestern Macedonia, has been creating tension for years in the ethnically mixed village, where 120 Macedonians and 80 Albanians live. The two groups cannot agree on the location of the new mosque.

Lazec Macedonians said the original planned location that the Islamic community wants to build coincide with the foundations of the St George Orthodox Church.

Tensions further escalated after the municipality council of Bitola decided to approve the mosque at the village entrance. Macedonians from Lazec said that they are not against the construction of religious buildings, but they oppose the planned location.

"We want the mosque to be built next to the church, which will satisfy the request of the Macedonian people from the village, and will send a message that the village is multi-ethnic, where Macedonians and Albanians live together. Albanian residents again asked that the mosque be located at the village entrance, which hurts the Macedonians who say that if the mosque is built at the entrance to the village it will signal that only Albanians live here," Orce Dandushevski, Lazec community president, told SETimes

The representative of the Islamic religious community from Bitola, Mufti Plumi Veliu, said that the community is waiting for a suitable moment to start the mosque construction.

"The technical documentation is complete and sent to competent authorities, so the construction work should start soon. Reactions as always will be present, but everything is ready to start the construction work. We hope there will be no problems, because the location is determined by the state," Veliu told SETimes.

Meanwhile, multi-ethnic co-existence in Lazec has significantly diminished. Both communities cut contact with each other -- even in everyday needs. The village now has two shops, one so-called Macedonian, the other Albanian.

"The mosque … started damaging interethnic relations in Lazec six years ago …. Now everyone abides by the rule that everyone shops in their own store, even for bread. … The residents of Lazani blame politics for the situation," Orthodox priest Father Oliver told SETimes.
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"It's nice to have a religious object in this village, no matter where the location because we will have a place in the village to pray and to bury our dead. Until now we were going to the village Kisava, 5km away," Lirim Rusidoski, an Albanian Lazec villager, told SETimes.

Macedonian residents of Lazec say that they will either move out of the village and leave everything behind, or go abroad.

Vasco Despotovski, a village resident, said that half the village is already planning to emigrate.

"Another family left the village two days ago. We knew the family and we lived [side by side], but because of the mosque dispute they left. The pressure is huge," Despotovski told SETimes.

http://www.setimes.com/cocoon/setimes/xhtml/en_GB/features/setimes/features/2012/06/11/feature-02

[Risto the Great]

Macedonian residents of Lazec say that they will either move out of the village and leave everything behind, or go abroad.

That'll show them.

[Risto the Great]

Instead of getting heard and voted for on the municipal council, they will move out.

Macedonia, where the meek shall inherit the dearth.

[Niko777]

This is our future:

Macedonian residents of Macedonia say that they will either move out of the country and everything behind, or go abroad.

[lavce pelagonski]

It is simple build the mosque next to the church and have one religious center for everyone. If not then dont build at all. Why is the municipality council of Bitola allowing this.

[DraganOfStip]

Macedonian residents of Macedonia say that they will either move out of the country and everything behind, or go abroad.

Uhhh...and what exactly is the difference between "moving out of the country" and "going abroad"?

[George S.]

Guys i have lived in the selo Lazec when i was a small boy i rember the albanians wanted to build a zamija but the locals wouldn't let them.But now everyone has left & there aren't that many people that oppose them.The locals beleive they should have one but not in your face in the middle of the stretzello.THey are getting weaker & now they are saying that they may have to leave & go somewhere else.When i went in 2006 the locals were just a handfull of people determined to fight it out to the end but now i think they are just getting tired & wanting to let them have it.This is a sign that the albanians are taking over.Nearby villages of velushina & other villages that were busling with macedonian people in the 60's & 70's now are becoming desrted with just a couple of old people families.The young have gone overseas.The villages are just ripe for an albanian takeover.THe inhabitants cannot oppose the albanians because they are few & are too old.Despite that the govt has been always weak kneed & caves in to albanian demands all the time.Locals have said that they can't fight the govt & albanians at the same time.It's an ever losing battle.It's inevitable that the townspeople worst fears were seen that the albanians would one day take over & without a whimper.

[Risto the Great]

Uhhh...and what exactly is the difference between "moving out of the country" and "going abroad"?

No, Niko misquoted it slightly. The text said "Macedonian residents of Lazec say that they will either move out of the village and leave everything behind, or go abroad."

Which means they will move out of the village to a Macedonian stronghold or go abroad. Either way Dragan, if you look at Macedonia with fresh eyes (as though you weren't there) you would say it is going downhill at an alarming pace.

[Risto the Great]

Not many comments about this. I am surprised. It pretty much says everything about the negative aspects of the RoMacedonian mentality in my opinion.