Census' in the Republic of Macedonia

[Pelister]

Take a look at the problem with the 2002 census data for the village of Brest, located in the Sandevo Muncipality north east of Skopje.

This village was occupied by Albanian insurgents in the 2001 war.

Take a look at the 2002 census data. There is a real problem with it I think.


According to 2002 census data:

Brest

Households: 111
Dwellings (Stani): 179
Total population: 569
Albanians 564, Serbians 1, Other 4

Source: www.stat.gov.mk/Publikacii/knigaX.pdf
p. 60 and p.191

That suggests that there approximately 5 Albanians per household which seems reasonable.

But take a close look at a satellite view of Brest!

I counted a total of 54 dwellings, basically everything that had a roof I counted. The 54 would include all of the households as well.

Either the satellite view is lying, or the census data is wrong.

What has happened here is that Albanians from Kosovo have filled in separate census forms, and listed themselves as occupying dwellings that actually do not exist.

The actual number of Albanians living in Brest is probably half.

If this distortion is true, then it has probably happened throughout the region exaggerating artificially the number of Albanians.

It would be interesting to compare it to other census results.

[AMHRC]

Dear all,

Here is a link to leaflets in Macedonian and English on the Australian census prepared and issued by the AMHRC (officially ABS approved), in February this year: http://www.macedonianhr.org.au/wip/i...d=38&Itemid=96

These leaflets have been read out on all the major Macedonian radio programs; they have been sent to every major community group in Australia; they have been physically distributed to Macedonian pensioner groups (people who generally don't have access to the internet); they were posted months ago on all the major Macedonian online forums, including MTO etc.

The ball has been rolling for quite some time.

AMHRC.

[AMHRC]

Bump as a reminder.

[Mastika]

Dear all,

Here is a link to leaflets in Macedonian and English on the Australian census prepared and issued by the AMHRC (officially ABS approved), in February this year: http://www.macedonianhr.org.au/wip/i...d=38&Itemid=96

These leaflets have been read out on all the major Macedonian radio programs; they have been sent to every major community group in Australia; they have been physically distributed to Macedonian pensioner groups (people who generally don't have access to the internet); they were posted months ago on all the major Macedonian online forums, including MTO etc.

The ball has been rolling for quite some time.

AMHRC.

It is a good cause. I didn't mean to say that the ball hasn't been rolling for a while, however this is the first time I am hearing of a Facebook campaign, which seems to be working very well. It is extremely effective, especially in targetting younger people who dont listen to Macedonian radio, newspapers and who dont participate in Macedonian social life.

The guide on how to fill out the census properly is very good, and hopefully this will be posted on the Facebook group (with close to 2,500 members now) a few more times now so that people are 100% sure of how to fill out the census.

IMHO, the approach that AMHRC has taken seems to be targetting those who already would be writing that they speak the Macedonian language at home or are members of the Macedonain Orthodox Church. I think the main issue here is with younger people, who statistically do not write this information as much as people in the 50+ age bracket.

Take language used at home for example, statistically many second generation households would write 'English' rather than 'Macedonian', and it is for this reason that these people need to be targetted.

[Bill77]

Good work Mastika

We've had our downs before, but now happy to call you brother

same goes to you guys at AMHRC. Fantastic work as usual.

[Daniel the Great]

Good work Guys. Message to all those Macedonian sell outs (Grkomani) who will mark them selves as Greeks, stop hiding your Macedonian heritage and your mother tongue, it's time to wake up and realize who yous are.

[Soldier of Macedon]

There's no point in having multiple threads on the same topic, so I have merged Mastika's thread together with the one by the AMHRC, who actually began spreading the word over 6 months ago.

[makedonche]

A timely reminder to fill out the census forms correctly!
I just did my mum's and she couldn't be happier being able to write Macedonian as her language, Macedonian as her ancestry and Macedonian Orthodox as her religion!

[Mikail]

Done! Macedonian was placed in all the appropriate places for all family members!

one comment I'll make though is Australia needs to stop the Greek game of making Orthodoxy an ethnic identifier. Just as Catholic is Catholic, Orthodox should be Orthodox

[makedonche]

Done! Macedonian was placed in all the appropriate places for all family members!

one comment I'll make though is Australia needs to stop the Greek game of making Orthodoxy an ethnic identifier. Just as Catholic is Catholic, Orthodox should be Orthodox

Mik
So true, nothing shits me more than hearing or reading "Greek Orthodox", like they invented it or something! It should be written as just "Orthodox".

[Phoenix]

Mik
So true, nothing shits me more than hearing or reading "Greek Orthodox", like they invented it or something! It should be written as just "Orthodox".

...what shits me is "greek Easter", "greek yoghurt", "greek coffee"...come to think of it, everything "greek" shits me...

da mu go ebam plemeto gjupsko...

[Mikail]

...what shits me is "greek Easter", "greek yoghurt", "greek coffee"...come to think of it, everything "greek" shits me...

da mu go ebam plemeto gjupsko...

Yes guys....... its bullshit!

the only thing that came out of Greece is racism and anal sex

[Mastika]

I do agree with Pheonix about Greek Coffee, greek yogurt, etc.

However, I disagree with what people are saying about the Greek Orthodox having a seperate box. For this reason only, Greek Orthodox reinforces to many people who would otherwise simply write "Orthodox" that the churches are NOT the same thing.

We need only to look back to the last census. 48,156 wrote that they were simply "Orthodox". What does this mean? Writing this is as good as writing that you are "Protestant". No "Protestant Church" exists, neither does a single "Orthodox church". Therefore the c. 50,000 people who wrote that they are simply Orthodox do not assist any Orthodox church directly at all in terms of showing the true number of adherants or in terms of government assistance.

My opinion is that it is necessary to have an identifier reinforcing the seperateness of the Orthodox churches, however I don't believe that it should have "Greek Orthodox". I however, don't see anyother way of reinforcing the fact that there is not one single orthodox church, without using Greek orthodox, given that they are the largest Orthodox church in australia. It is a catch 22.

Another issue is that many people who are not Greek Orthodox tick the box, thus leaving the number of Greek orthodox adherants inflated. Take the 2001 census, 2,409 born in Macedonia claimed that they were adherants to Greek Orthodoxy, when in reality this is not the case.

[Bill77]

one comment I'll make though is Australia needs to stop the Greek game of making Orthodoxy an ethnic identifier. Just as Catholic is Catholic, Orthodox should be Orthodox

Brother, i'll disagree with you here.

Greek Orthodox are a different breed and should be separated from the Eastern Orthodox. You can't put them in the same group with us and the Serbs etc etc, because they sold their religion to the Catholic Church and celebrate Christmas with the Catholics. So even though the GOC celebrates Easter with the majority of other Orthodox religions, they should not represent Orthodox when it comes to Christmas.

[Zarni]

<check box> Orthodox

Origin: <field box>

i.e

Orthodox

Origin: Macedonain

Orthodox

Origin: Ukranian

Easy solution how hard can it be

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Austraians are more ignorant then Americians trust me