Tsar Samoil - Самоил седна на тронот на Плоштад Макед

[indigen]

So you would deny that a Slavic people ever existed?

I stand by what I stated above. What do you mean by "Slavic" people?

That is just being ignorant to historical fact

What is this historical "fact"?

they did exist historian's have theories

Lots of different theories floating around and most based on conjectures and inspired by a desire to serve some political agendas of a given time.

that the origin of these nomadic people is probably from the Balkans originally who returned centuries later after their exile.

Who says they were "NOMADIC"?

Now there is evidence of their settlement in the Balkans whether they resettled or came from a far away land as they travelled evading wars is irrelevant

Actually, there apparently is NOT very much MATERIAL (archaeological) EVIDENCE to back up any of the mass invasion theories at all.

either way they would have developed their own ways of doing things being Nomadic they would have been able to adopt to the indigenous customs.

The general thesis of the mass invasion theory proponents is that they (Sklavnoi, i.e. rebel political formations) were farmers and NOT nomads!

They would have developed their own distinct ways of doing things own dialects etc enough to make them a separate ethnic group I mean one day we all would have been one ethnic group which would have separated into various other groups creating distinct cultures and races.

I see you want to have some "Slav" heritage and thus let your imagination go a bit wild on the subject.

The following is just another theory worth knowing, IMHO:

Author: Jacques Bacid, Ph.D. Columbia University, 1983, has taught [Macedonic] languages, Balkan, and East European history at the University of Oregon. He writes and lectures on these subjects. Jacques Bacid is a chairperson of the Illyrian Committee. He is an American Croatian.

Jacques Bacid: "In the sixth century, the Paeones, now called [Skalvnoi], came back and captured all of Macedonia from the East Romans, with the exception of a few coastal cities. Macedonia maintained its independence and resisted attacks by the Armenian and Syrian dynasties who held power in New Rome (Byzantium) and by the shamanist and nomadic Bulgars who roamed the steppes of the Dobrudja with their herds. Since the sixth century, the native Macedonian language had been the dominant speech of the land. It was first systematized in the middle of the ninth Christian century by SS. Cyril and Methodius, the apostles of the [Macedonians and Macedonic speakers] who were born in Thessalonica, Solun. The Macedonian language has functioned as the principal literary, liturgical, and colloquial language of Macedonia ever since."

NB: Text in square brackets [...] is my amendment to language I do not want to propagate.

[vojnik]

I stand by what I stated above. What do you mean by "Slavic" people?

What is this historical "fact"?

Lots of different theories floating around and most based on conjectures and inspired by a desire to serve some political agendas of a given time.

Who says they were "NOMADIC"?

Actually, there apparently is NOT very much MATERIAL (archaeological) EVIDENCE to back up any of the mass invasion theories at all.

The general theses of the mass invasion theory proponents is that they (Sklavnoi, i.e. rebel political formations) were farmers and NOT nomads!

I see you want to have some "Slav" heritage and thus let your imagination go a bit wild on the subject.

The following is just another theory worth knowing, IMHO:

Author: Jacques Bacid, Ph.D. Columbia University, 1983, has taught [Macedonic] languages, Balkan, and East European history at the University of Oregon. He writes and lectures on these subjects. Jacques Bacid is a chairperson of the Illyrian Committee. He is an American Croatian.

Jacques Bacid: "In the sixth century, the Paeones, now called [Skalvnoi], came back and captured all of Macedonia from the East Romans, with the exception of a few coastal cities. Macedonia maintained its independence and resisted attacks by the Armenian and Syrian dynasties who held power in New Rome (Byzantium) and by the shamanist and nomadic Bulgars who roamed the steppes of the Dobrudja with their herds. Since the sixth century, the native Macedonian language had been the dominant speech of the land. It was first systematized in the middle of the ninth Christian century by SS. Cyril and Methodius, the apostles of the [Macedonians and Macedonic speakers] who were born in Thessalonica, Solun. The Macedonian language has functioned as the principal literary, liturgical, and colloquial language of Macedonia ever since."

NB: Text in square brackets [...] is my amendment to language I do not want to propagate.

Do you not understand English I just went on about how they never said there was a mass invasion all I am saying is you ca't deny that there were small settlements of these people identified as Slavs it's fact denying any settlement of Slavs throughout the Balkan is being ignorant claiming that Slavs never existed as a small nomadic tribes that settled the Balkan all the awy through Greece assimilating into the local popultions is propaganda. You can't claim that you are of some sort of a pure anceint Macedonian that again is ignorance making you worser then the Greeks which claim pure Ancient Greek heritage no nation no people of this Earth are descendants of a pure line of an ancient civilisation with no mixture what so ever. I am not trying to make an argument to claim Slavic heritage I am clearly making an argument about who the Slavs were and that no race is pure everyone has some sort of a misture in them it's the way they choose to live and the heritage they claim what makes them different me being born in Australia and having Macedonian parents makes me Macedonian by heritage a few genenerations down the track there might be mixtures lets say I had a grand daughter who married an Italian for instance they had grandchildren who had grandchildren those grandchildren would most probably claim Italian heritage and forget that there ever was a Macedonian blood line running through them etc. Whether you or anyone else likes it or not we are most likely to have a Slavic or even Roman or Vlach DNA in us who knows

[Volk]

Come on Volk, you claimed that it did not matter that "warrior on a horse" is in Skopje because you still know who it "really" is.

Ofcourse it matters, in fact I challenge you to show where i said this?
But of course you cannot, because your an expert in putting words and concepts into peoples mouths... its very tiresome and manipulative, you either have some sort of agenda or your predispositioned to being unable to understand basic points of view.

My point has always been it matters, but what matters more is that Alexander the Great has a grandiose statue in the center of our capital, and everyone in the world and Macedonia knows who it is. The benefit to the Macedonian psyche is already evident if you wish to check the relevant thread and read the posted articles.

[Vangelovski]

Ofcourse it matters, in fact I challenge you to show where i said this?
But of course you cannot, because your an expert in putting words and concepts into peoples mouths... its very tiresome and manipulative, you either have some sort of agenda or your predispositioned to being unable to understand basic points of view.

My point has always been it matters, but what matters more is that Alexander the Great has a grandiose statue in the center of our capital, and everyone in the world and Macedonia knows who it is. The benefit to the Macedonian psyche is already evident if you wish to check the relevant thread and read the posted articles.

No, what matters is a solid ideology. I'm glad you highlighted your own acceptance of the lapdog mentality - it saved me a few seconds. You should change your name to "go with the flow"...at the moment your psudonym is demeaning to wolves.

[Volk]

So what your actually saying is, its better not to have a statue of Alexander the Great?

YES or NO

[vojnik]

It's great that there is a statue of Alexander the Great in Skopje it's a shame the choice of name for the statue isn't so great. Yes everyone knows it's Alexander etc but when your spending 9.5 million Euros on a statue of a historical figure which the people feel a connection to because there is a connection you would expect said statue to be named correctly according to who it is I mean why was there no naming issues on the other statues.

If your going to call Alexander the Great-Warrior on horse you might aswell rename the statues below.
Kiril i Metodij=two teacher brothers
Samoil-King on Throne
Goce Delcev-Revolutionary on horse
etc

They had no issue renaming the highway, the stadium and airport so why is there an issue with the statue? It's the fact that every other statue could be named properly yet Alexander didn't I mean come on if your going to spend so much money in giving Skopje a make over then do it properly.

[Risto the Great]

So what your actually saying is, its better not to have a statue of Alexander the Great?

YES or NO

It is Tito on Horse as far as I am concerned until the Government puts a plaque on it Volk.

I would say NO if it is put there for the wrong reason.

[Vangelovski]

So what your actually saying is, its better not to have a statue of Alexander the Great?

YES or NO

It's not a statue of Alexander the Great, its a statue of a warrior on a horse. You get your fundamentals wrong and then you go off on a tangent from there.

But basically, NO, I would rather not have a warrior on a horse. I want a statue of Alexander the Great, which is not what we have.

[Niko777]

A new plaque was installed beside the Gotse Delchev statue

[indigen]

It's not a statue of Alexander the Great, its a statue of a warrior on a horse. You get your fundamentals wrong and then you go off on a tangent from there.

But basically, NO, I would rather not have a warrior on a horse. I want a statue of Alexander the Great, which is not what we have.

Are you sure you want one with that title and what is significant about that? We have an airport already called "Alexander the Great", so it would seem that this name is not taboo for use by the Vassal ruling elites in Skopje because it is a generic name used to "honour an international historic figure" who happened to originate from our region.

[Vangelovski]

Are you sure you want one with that title and what is significant about that? We have an airport already called "Alexander the Great", so it would seem that this name is not taboo for use by the Vassal ruling elites in Skopje because it is a generic name used to "honour an international historic figure" who happened to originate from our region.

Yes, I would want the English version of the plaque to say Alexander the Great and the Macedonian Aleksandar Makedonski or Aleksandar III Makedonski.

[indigen]

A new plaque was installed beside the Gotse Delchev statue

IMO, the English translation is of inadequate quality and the information of the Macedonian version could be improved as well.

[Volk]

until the Government puts a plaque on it

that we can agree upon.

However when the Mayor of Skopje comes out and saying "its Alexander of Macedonia" (the city of Skopje is responsible for the project)- your trying to say its Tito of a horse? please...

No one in the world doubts who and what it is except the two of you.

[Risto the Great]

IMO, the English translation is of inadequate quality and the information of the Macedonian version could be improved as well.

Would have been nice to see him actually described as a Macedonian. Too much to ask nowadays apparently.

[Risto the Great]

that we can agree upon.

However when the Mayor of Skopje comes out and saying "its Alexander of Macedonia" (the city of Skopje is responsible for the project)- your trying to say its Tito of a horse? please...

No one in the world doubts who and what it is except the two of you.

The Mayor of Solun has said things in the past too.
The Greek government distances itself from some of those things.

Do you think "Tito on Horse" looks good?