Macedonian Orthodox Church - News & Updates

[Bill77]

we still remain part of the SPC Hierarchy.

Do we? and what power do they have over us?

[Prolet]

What do you mean by autonomous Serb? Are you implying that Stefan is openly in favour of the Nish Accord??

SOM, Technically the way things stand at this moment we are an Autonomous SPC church just like the MonteNegran Orthodox church is for example. I cant speculate about ArchBishop Stefan however three of his Bishops signed the Nish Accord and he didnt sanction them or at least nothing was given out in public so i'll let you make up your own mind.

I will say that i dont like how things are going at the moment, because the Nish Accord was never implemented and the Serbian ArchBishop is pushing for it which doesnt give us Aftokefalnost at all, we still remain part of the SPC Hierarchy.

[Rogi]

Osiris, I disagree with the sentiment against faith and religion itself, as opposed to making the distinction between Churches run by men and Religion, Faith or Belief in God.

I see the Church as very important and much needed, if and only if, it is and remains completely undeviating from it's original purpose.


Consider reading Machiavelli's "Discourses on Livy" to see his views on the importance of religion in the State, despite his personal non religious views. It is very interesting.

[Vangelovski]

i am not sure you need faith, what you need as a human being is knowledge.

this is in relation to?

[Soldier of Macedon]

SOM, Did you know that before the Ottoman Empire, the main city for the Pravoslavije was in Ohrid?? Just like Carigrad is now for example, it was Ohrid before that.

It was for many people, but not for everybody. And Constantinople (Tsarigrad) has always been the centre of Eastern Christianity in general, as what Rome is for the Catholics. However, given the autonomous nature of the Archbishopric of Ohrid for centuries on end, and its uneasy relationship with both Rome and Constantinople (often playing both sides against each other when it suited them), it did become the spiritual centre for Macedonians above other religious 'hubs'. Therefore, when Samuel rose up in the 10th century and Marko in the 14th century, it was Ohrid's religious institutions that backed these expressions of local rebellion and solidarity in Macedonia, not the Orthodox Rome known as Constantinople, and certainly not the Pech Archbishopric (it wasn't even in existence during Samuel's reign).

I got no problem with ArchBishop Stefan going to Belgrade to congratulate ArchBishop Irinej however he should do so as a foreign ArchBishop not as an Autonomous Serb.

What do you mean by autonomous Serb? Are you implying that Stefan is openly in favour of the Nish Accord??

[Prolet]

You are dead right Osiris, i'd rather use that money to build child care facilities,nursing homes for our old and social clubs where people can gather up and socialize, be friends,look after eachother etc

SOM, Did you know that before the Ottoman Empire, the main city for the Pravoslavije was in Ohrid?? Just like Carigrad is now for example, it was Ohrid before that. They should be asking us, not the otherway around. We gave them a religion an Alphabet, a Pismo,Traditions and what did we get in return?? I got no problem with ArchBishop Stefan going to Belgrade to congratulate ArchBishop Irinej however he should do so as a foreign ArchBishop not as an Autonomous Serb.

[osiris]

i am not sure you need faith, what you need as a human being is knowledge. prolet do you think that spending millions of dollars on legal costs is a reasonable and productive activity for our church. i dont.

[Soldier of Macedon]

And these two shupelki of ours are there congratulating him? The famous Nish Accord, back again, and good old Petarche, back in the same picture again. How much faith can the Macedonians have in Stefan when he is seen 'holding hands' with the apparent bishop that wants to sign over Macedonian churches from Australia into his own name?

I wonder if Serbian priests and bishops are taught that the Pec Archbishopric is basically the child of the Ohrid Archbishopric in Macedonia? I wonder if they are taught about all of the literature that came from our land to theirs? Using this sort of 'logic' by historical right, they should belong to us, not the other way around.

[Prolet]

SOM, Sure if there is an English version i will post it

SOM, You missed out the most important part of this post and that is why the Serbian ArchBishop pushing to implement the Nish Accord?? We have three Bishops who signed it and Bishop Timotej was one of them.

[Soldier of Macedon]

SOM, Thats because i posted the video version, i expect people to watch the video on sitel. As for the non Macedonians, well they can translate it for themselves if they cannot speak or read Macedonian.

No, you will provide it in an English version when possible also (and this time it was certainly possible), because there are many Macedonians who cannot read Macedonian yet, and others (Macedonian and non-Macedonian) that don't know how to speak or read it properly. This is a Macedonian forum but we want to encourage as many people as possible to read, and as the English language is the lingua franca of the 21st century, it will most often be used. Do me the courtesy Prolet, I promise that it will take less than a minute of your time, when it is not feasible, at least provide a short translation or summary in English so readers get the jist. Ajde, ne se prai inaetchija

Because most of you got no idea when it comes to church questions but you see it as some political party and political question.

No Komita, it is the Serbs who see it that way. Every Orthodox nation has their own 'national' church, why should we not? Tell me where you stand in this situation, do you think the Serbs should or shouldn't relinquish their imaginary 'rights' to our churches, should or shouldn't they recognise the MOC? Apparently they never will, and if they do, it is supposed to make it easier for the 'helpless' weaklings in Moscow and Constantinople to take the next step. I am interested in your opinion and view on this matter, as I would like to know the Orthodox brotherhood perspective and how it relates to their non-recognition of the MOC, so I would appreciate a response.

Seeing as Salvation comes ONLY through Jesus, and not through church membership, let alone "recognition" of your church by another church, I'm not quite sure why the MOC is obsessed with being "recognised" by the SOC??

Good point, and much aligned with my earlier assertion that we were fine without their 'support' in the past and we will be fine in the future. That being the case, the MOC should start cutting ties with all those unprepared to acknowledge us as human beings, rather than subjecting us to humiliation by watching Petre and Stefanche sucking up to someone who doesn't even want to respect their right to exist.

[Vangelovski]

As a Christian, I see the role of the Church as spreading the Good News (the Gospel) - Salvation through Jesus. Seeing as Salvation comes ONLY through Jesus, and not through church membership, let alone "recognition" of your church by another church, I'm not quite sure why the MOC is obsessed with being "recognised" by the SOC??

[Prolet]

Osiris, You do make a point that the church dispute has cost millions, we are not properly organized and that is a problem. The reality is that we have to be strong in order to gain recognition, a strong MPC is good for the faith of our people however we need to clean up our backyard first before we tackle the opposition.

[osiris]

the churches of the world not just the orthodox churchers are in the hands of charlartans and oppourtunists. religion when it organises seeme to attract nobodies who are happy to serve god so their own interests are then served by god.
there is no church worth supporting my fellow macedonians, look at how destructive the church of macedonias representative in australia was, costing the communities lose to 8 million dollars in legal terms. dont make me laugh. i am surprised at how you guys can seriously consider organised chruches as anything but selfserving power hungry beauracracies. more harm was done to the macedonian nation by fellow orthodox christian nations than the so called tursko robstvo of the ottoman empire.

[Prolet]

SOM, Thats because i posted the video version, i expect people to watch the video on sitel. As for the non Macedonians, well they can translate it for themselves if they cannot speak or read Macedonian.

SOM, This is a Macedonian Forum treba nashite da znat Makedonski da zborvat ako ne znat ke nauchat ili samite neka si idat na Google za prevod, nie kako gi prevedvame shiptarskine i Grckine sajtoj?

SOM, Back to the topic, Why does ArchBishop Irinej insist on implementing the Nish Accord?? I thought that document was invalid?? At least thats what Bishops Petar and Timotej said.

[Komita]

Because most of you got no idea when it comes to church questions but you see it as some political party and political question.