Mustafa Kemal Atatürk and his Macedonian ancestry

[Soldier of Macedon]

Onur, I have copied and pasted your post from this thread: http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum...?t=6557&page=2

I found this one from google. Ataturk wrote this poem in 1905;

BEŞİKE HÂDİSESİ İÇİN
Çıkıyor gönüllere istimdadı
Sâmiamda vatanın feryâdı
Çıkıyor gönüllere istimdadı
Yaralı bir ananın evlâdı
Etmesin mi anaya imdadı?

Rumeli can veriyor yok mu ilaç.
Edelim sıhhatini istimzaç;
Etmeyelim kimseyi izaç?

Zırhlılar her yeri tehidt ediyor,
Makedonya bunu tes'it ediyor.
İnkırazı bize teyit ediyor.

Yemenin purişi malumu cihan
Ne için eyledi millet isyân?
Zulme ister mi bu yoldan burhan
Turuşkalar bile aldı meydan

Hani kânun-u adaâlet nerede?
Mülk-ü millette himâye saadet nerede?
Haricen mülk-ü himaye nerede?
Bizde evvelki şecaat nerede?

Gelse Ertuğrul şöhret-i pervas
Eder elbette tahayyür ibraz
Vatanın feyzine kâdir olamaz
Yeniden fethine verseydi cevâz...

Yıldırım görse şu ahvâlimizi
Ateş kahrı yakar hâlimizi,
Af eder mi bizim efâlimizi,
Mahveder cumle-i emsâlimizi,

Ey büyük Fâtih'i İstanbul'un...
Bu revş olmadı mı makbulün
Sây ile toplanılan mahsulün
Berhava oldu fakat meçhulün...

Yazık oldu Vatana âh yazık...
Her ağızdan çıkıyor: Eyvâh yazık!..
Acısın bizlere, âh yazık!

MUSTAFA KEMAL
· Sinop 25 Kânunu Evvel 321 (1905)

http://guldeste.blogcu.com/mustafa-k...-siirler/63163

Green colored verses;

Rumelia is dying, perishing with it`s soul, there is no remedy?
Lets mend it`s welfare
and do not dishonor anyone.

Armored panzers are crushing and crumbling everywhere
and Macedonia is cheering for that,
but it`s decadence and dissolution day by day, gives us the power of resistance.

*****
*****

Our motherland is becoming ruined and spoiled
And everyone says; Alas!, too bad.
(God) mercy to us, oh, what a shame!

In 1905, Rumelia only means Macedonia and Thrace because other parts were already separated from Ottoman empire earlier than that. He is talking about armored panzers and dissolution, so he meant Macedonia at that time, not Thrace. Probably he wrote Rumelia at first and then Macedonia for more vocabulary variety in the poem.

While he says "motherland" in the last verse, he meant Macedonia again, not Anatolia.

[Soldier of Macedon]

In Turkey nobody questions your background, there are many Turks with Albanian or Macedonian roots in Turkey, these people are just Turks because they only speak 1 language and live one culture.

Replace the term 'Turk' with 'Greek', and that sounds like something an ignorant Greek would say If you think all Turkish citizens of Macedonian, Albanian or whatever descent speak only 1 language (Turkish), or that people in Turkey don't raise the matter of ethnic background during conversations and discussions, then you're either naive or you're being deliberately misleading. By the way, the above doesn't quite gel with what you said on the other thread http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum...ead.php?t=2448 (in which you addressed a post to yourself, an action that raised the question over whether or not you are the same user as Voltron):

Turkey is a melting pot of cultures and peoples, nobody is pure......

Do you remember writing that? Or was that somebody else?

[SirGeorge8600]

In Turkey nobody questions your background, there are many Turks with Albanian or Macedonian roots in Turkey, these people are just Turks because they only speak 1 language and live one culture.

like in the vast majority of other countries....

[Ottoman]

In Turkey nobody questions your background, there are many Turks with Albanian or Macedonian roots in Turkey, these people are just Turks because they only speak 1 language and live one culture.

[Soldier of Macedon]

There are no quotes what so ever by Ataturk himself claiming ethnic Macedonian background. With no evidence except for secondary accounts I have no other option then to believe Ataturk being half Macedonian is propaganda.

You won't find Cyril and Methodius referring to themselves as Macedonians either. That is not the point. And I am not sure if you understand our point - nobody is trying to claim him for the Macedonian nation, we just want the facts to be acknowledged. Dismissing what other sources have written for the reasons you have is simply incorrect.

He himself claimed his heritage to be 100% Turkish on both sides........

Like I said before, others have also claimed the same. Quote him where he says 100% of his family are Turks.

Even if she was they obviously showedd no compasion to it she wanted him to become a Muslim extremist leader.

Where does it say she wanted him to become an extremist of that nature? I would dare say that such extremists hate Mustafa Kemal and the policies he enforced when he took control of Turkey.

[Bratot]

Kemal Ataturk Memorial House to be constructed in native village of his father

Debar, August 16 (MIA) - A corner stone was laid Sunday in the village of Kodzadzik - Centar Zupa municipality - marking the start of a construction of Memorial House of Kemal Ataturk - the founder of modern Turkey.

The greatness of Ataturk's deeds, a man who was the founder and first President of the Republic of Turkey, is being recognized in Turkey and beyond its borders, Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski said.

Many memories connect Ataturk with Macedonia, including the fact that the house of his parents is located exactly here in the village of Kodzadzik. This memorial is of special significance for the Turkish state, Turkish community in our country and for Macedonia, Gruevski said at the ceremony.

Culture Minister Elizabeta Kanceska-Milevska and Turkish Deputy Culture Minister Nihat Gul also addressed the event, referring to the good cultural cooperation and friendly relations between the two countries.

The memorial will be build on the foundations of the old residence of Ataturk's father - Ali Riza. The project - worth about EUR 650,000 - will be realized by the local authorities of Centar Zupa municipality and the Government of Macedonia.

http://www.idividi.com.mk/english/macedonia/545321/index.htm

[Volk]

nothing to criticize vojnik, you dont need to ask for approval.

simply stated there is no need for a "big statue" of Ataturk in Bitola. The question is what is 'big' and where is it planed for? the korzo? that would be embarrassing...

[vojnik]

What you need to do is spend some time using the search function on this forum. Check the below link for more sources regarding Kemal and his Macedonian background:

http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=457&highlight=mustafa+kemal&page=8

Really? Can you refer me to a link in the same way that I have done above?

That is not the same thing. Kemal was born in Macedonia and the Macedonian element in his culture and genes would be monumentally more significant than some monarch from England. I think the statue should be considered as a gesture of goodwill towards our Turkish minority.

I agree with you to a certain extent. Can you tell me what Mustafa Kemal has done in his lifetime that was detrimental to Macedonia? What exactly are your arguments against this statue?

http://www.allaboutturkey.com/ata_speech.htm

There are some quotes by Ataturk the majority show that he felt very strongly about him being a Turk. There are no quotes what so ever by Ataturk himself claiming ethnic Macedonian background. With no evidence except for secondary accounts I have no other option then to believe Ataturk being half Macedonian is propaganda. He himself claimed his heritage to be 100% Turkish on both sides that both his Mothers and his fathers side were Turkish people that settled around the area in the 16th century. A lot of famous people might have a Macedonian heritage who knows it's no reason to erect a statue it's bad enough we have statues of Albanians being erected in our capital.

I like the idea of preserving the military academy or his house in Bitola or whatever it was that's fair enough great tourist attraction but a statue of Ataturk goes a bit to far. Fair enough we have statues of Alexander, Samoil, Kiril i Metodij, Delcev Cento or whatever but then you have the statues of these Albanians and now Ataturk come on. understand there is a minority a very little one but they have enough Mosques and a memorial house of there founder in Bitola.

I can't find anything the Ataturk did that was detrimental I quite like his as a leader but I just really dislike the idea of Ataturk in Bitola because he went to school there and his mother was supposedly Macedonian. Even if she was they obviously showedd no compasion to it she wanted him to become a Muslim extremist leader. If they were Macedonian they didn't give a shit about it they chose to lead Turkey and did nothing for Macedonia.

I wrote this out quickly and didn't put much thought as I rushed it so please criticize so I can correct if I went a bit wrong

[Ottoman]

Yeah there is, he was born there when it was Ottoman territory, I visited it once.

[fatso]

Well mate thats something thats very hard to do, Turkey is full with statues of important Greek persons, we Turks are very proud of this, why? because the land we call Turkey has a great and long history, those statues reflect that feeling.

Ataturk was educated in Macedonina, nobody can deny this, ask every Turkish person in Turkey about Macedonia and they will answer the place where Ataturk was educated.

I think there is a memorial house of Ataturk in Thessaloniki

[Ottoman]

Well mate thats something thats very hard to do, Turkey is full with statues of important Greek persons, we Turks are very proud of this, why? because the land we call Turkey has a great and long history, those statues reflect that feeling.

Ataturk was educated in Macedonina, nobody can deny this, ask every Turkish person in Turkey about Macedonia and they will answer the place where Ataturk was educated.

[Volk]

only statues of ethnic Macedonians should be erected on the main walkways of the major cities.

give Ataturk a statue at his memorial house, not some grand statue in the middle of bitola.

[Ottoman]

That Ataturk his mother was Macedonian is still a debate, because Ataturk was cited that his roots lay in Karaman, Central Anatolia.

I dont know what to believe but one thing is for sure, I dont care what his background was, he was important for Turkey.

[Ottoman]

A statue of Ataturk in Macedonia is ridiculous he regarded himself as a Turk fought and died for the Turkish nation and just went to school in Bitola he has no place for a statue to be dedicated to him in our country. I can't find any source about him being half Macedonian besides Time Magazine his mother was a radical Muslim woman who wanted Ataturk to be some sort of a Muslim fanatic like herself. Even if she was Macedonian Muslim that means she is a Torbesh you know the people that sold their religion for higher rankings in Ottoman society.

There is even a Ataturk statue in Cuba, Ataturk was not only important for Turkey but for the whole world as he wanted world peace.

You as a Macedonian should be proud of Ataturk because he was educated in your land, be proud, dont twist.

[Ottoman]

Turkey is already full with Ataturk statues, let Macedonia have one too lol.