Mustafa Kemal Atatürk and his Macedonian ancestry

Ottoman · 12-02-2010, 06:09 AM

Yeah please show us.

Daskalot · 12-02-2010, 04:32 AM

Originally posted by Agamoi Thytai View Post

Greece as a state may have not existed before 1832 as you said but Greek people and Greek culture existed continuously from ancient till modern time.Greek culture influenced to a great degree the culture of all the neighbouring people (and was in turn influenced by them,that's normal) so that you use today a Greek nickname,daskale.And most Greeks may have called themselves Romioi and their language romeika in modern time,however there existed always an intellectual class that was aware of their real origin and so they used the terms Hellenes and Hellenic for their language long before 1832.

Can you please give us a rundown on the continual presence of as you call it 'Greek people/culture' from the ancient city states to the creation of the modern Greek state in 1832 in that geographical area which the state encompassed in 1832. Please break it down into years. Also would you be so kind to enlighten us to where this intellectual class whom as you say went by the name Hellenes long before the creation of the modern Greek state lived, their geographical locations please.

sf. · 12-02-2010, 04:30 AM

Originally posted by Agamoi Thytai View Post

Greece as a state may have not existed before 1832 as you said but Greek people and Greek culture existed continuously from ancient till modern time.Greek culture influenced to a great degree the culture of all the neighbouring people (and was in turn influenced by them,that's normal) so that you use today a Greek nickname,daskale.And most Greeks may have called themselves Romioi and their language romeika in modern time,however there existed always an intellectual class that was aware of their real origin and so they used the terms Hellenes and Hellenic for their language long before 1832.

A turd by any other name (or two) is still a turd.

SoM, how often do we need to deal with the stench that wafts in from time to time?

julie · 12-02-2010, 04:24 AM

Greek people and Greek culture existed continuously from ancient till modern time.

really??
welcome to the MTO
Macedonian people and Macedonian culture has existed continuously from ancient till modern time. In fact, Macedonian culture influenced the culture of all of its neighbouring people. The Macedonian language has also been existence in its current form for hundreds of years. Almost back to the time of our Macedonian king, Alexander the Great

Agamoi Thytai · 12-02-2010, 04:17 AM

Originally posted by Daskalot View Post

Seriously people, get your terminology correct. Greece did not exist before 1832 when the modern state was created. The same goes for the people speaking a hellenic tongue and who were Orthodox Christians, they did not call themselves for Greeks(Hellenes/Ellines) or their language for Greek(Hellenic/Ellenika) but rather Romans(Romeois) speaking Roman(Romeika). They only started to call themselves by their new name post creation of the modern state. What you are doing is to paint history in modern Greek colours which is the greatest lie ever told. So please get your terminology correct.

Greece as a state may have not existed before 1832 as you said but Greek people and Greek culture existed continuously from ancient till modern time.Greek culture influenced to a great degree the culture of all the neighbouring people (and was in turn influenced by them,that's normal) so that you use today a Greek nickname,daskale.And most Greeks may have called themselves Romioi and their language romeika in modern time,however there existed always an intellectual class that was aware of their real origin and so they used the terms Hellenes and Hellenic for their language long before 1832.

George S. · 12-02-2010, 03:52 AM

I agree daskalot that people assume that greece was allways greece as a state.It only became into being since 1832.Prior to that greece had various names & it's only because of the west creating greece after 1832 do we see all the different terminology used.Greece is one big fake lie as the modern greek state has no connection with the ancient city states the language is not even close.

Daskalot · 12-02-2010, 03:44 AM

Seriously people, get your terminology correct. Greece did not exist before 1832 when the modern state was created. The same goes for the people speaking a hellenic tongue and who were Orthodox Christians, they did not call themselves for Greeks(Hellenes/Ellines) or their language for Greek(Hellenic/Ellenika) but rather Romans(Romeois) speaking Roman(Romeika). They only started to call themselves by their new name post creation of the modern state. What you are doing is to paint history in modern Greek colours which is the greatest lie ever told. So please get your terminology correct.

Prolet · 12-02-2010, 01:25 AM

Atatürk`s family was one of the immigrants who moved from central Anatolia to Debar, Macedonia after 14th century and they moved in to Salonika city center shortly before Kemal Atatürk born. So, Ataturk`s ancestors was from Debar, not Salonika city center. Atatürk born in 1881 in Salonika and he got educated in Bitola military school.

Onur, His family is from Centar Zhupa which is very close to Debar. This is where Ataturk's home is currently being built.

Bill77 · 12-01-2010, 05:47 PM

Originally posted by Agamoi Thytai View Post

Hey,Bill,I see you quoted the most unbiased source one coulf find regarding this topic...Türk Tarih Kurumu!
[url]http://www.google.com/search?

No i did not. Nice try.

The source i quoted from was David Howarth and his book called "Greek Adventure"

David Howarth (1912 – 1991) was a British historian and author, Who was a graduate from Cambridge University.

Greeks cannot endure books that show them in a bad light. One of the books that make them furious is the "Greek Adventure" written by the English author David Howarth. Howarth examined the 1821 revolution on the scene of the event and wrote this book after examining one by one the books, articles and journals written by British, Italian, French and German officers and journalists after returning to their respective countries.

Ottoman · 12-01-2010, 05:15 PM

Our Greek friend is not happy about the current situation of Greece, maybe he should just move to another country then.

Greece changed in every aspect since the Ottomans took over, just accept this, do yourself a favour and stop trolling.

Agamoi Thytai · 12-01-2010, 04:59 PM