Kosovo fans burned Macedonian flag

[chentovist]

FoM - what do you think about the rights of the Macedonian minority in Greece? Should Greece recognise this minority, and accord them the human rights they deserve eg., the ability to learn their language in schools, practice their religion in the Macedonian language etc..

[George S.]

i think like all minorities they should get the basic human rights.

[Voltron]

The exclusive 'Greek and Serb Orthodox brotherhood' club is a flimsly concept built on a foundation of collective hatred and disregard for Macedonians. Prior to the 19th century it was non-existent. It is quite funny when people try to make more of it than there actually is.

No its not. Cmon as if the Macedonians are the top of the list between Serbs and Greeks. Serbs recognized ROM while we still held fast and did not recognize Kosovo. We did not sell them out. That is friendship, actions speak louder than words. The only other people that critisise our relations are Albanians. They will use examples of some incidents of basketball games or something stupid. As if fighting between individuals is a case example of relations between peoples and countries. Retarded...

FoM - what do you think about the rights of the Macedonian minority in Greece? Should Greece recognise this minority, and accord them the human rights they deserve eg., the ability to learn their language in schools, practice their religion in the Macedonian language etc..

Here we go again

[Risto the Great]

Here we go again

Voltron,
I have been there numerous times. Macedonians in Greece have no rights as Macedonians. If they do have rights, it must have happened in the last couple of years because I missed it completely the last time I was there.

Greeks are more like your Youtube hero when it comes to treatment of Macedonians. (Only in groups though)

[Voltron]

What you want is segregational rights. Well, I dont wish that on anyone.
You can do what you want in your homes, neighborhoods, blocks, villages, etc.
You dont need a governmental decree, exclusive lobbies or committees to express yourself.

[Risto the Great]

What you want is segregational rights. Well, I dont wish that on anyone.

No, not at all. I would say not being persecuted for being Macedonian is a start. It is all part of bringing Greece into the 21st century.

[George S.]

you come to a full circle again it's to do with human rights.The government still hasn't recognised it's ethnic minorities typically macedonians.Human rights in greece is very much lacking.Do you think that greece is going to recognize them now??

[Soldier of Macedon]

To be completely honest with you, I'm pretty ignorant with regards to the affairs of our churches.

You should learn more about it if you want to understand where some of the animosity comes from.

If hypothetically Macedonia and Serbia were to unite, I wouldn't be opposed, but only if both peoples were in majority consent (ie. a referendum).

Both Macedonia and Serbia should remain independent and continue to develop their own individual cultures. I would much rather (if there were no outstanding issues) see a regional economic arrangement which would be equally beneficial for all parties involved, but certainly not to the extent of establishing a federation.

I live in Canada but I'm from Kosovo.

What could Serbia have done to prevent the loss of Kosovo?

Yeah I've never really heard of any problems between Serbian and Macedonian fans/holligans, from what I hear they're pretty friendly towards each other.

In Australia, many Serbs support their so-called Greek 'brothers' in sporting events against Macedonians.

No its not. Cmon as if the Macedonians are the top of the list between Serbs and Greeks.

Don't be so naive. This so-called 'brotherhood' began when the chauvanistic aims of both Greece and Serbia began to align, largely at the expense of Macedonia. There is no such 'brotherhood' prior to the 19th century. In fact, it was quite the opposite. The dominant grecophone element in the Patriarchate of Constantinople treated the Serbs in the same way they treated Macedonians. They supported the Ottoman abolishment of the Patriarchate of Pec in Serbia and the Archbishopric of Ohrid in Macedonia, during 1766 and 1767 respectively, which consequently led to all churches in Macedonia and Serbia (and elsewhere) coming under the complete rule of the Patriarchate of Constantinople and Greek-speaking clerics. Propaganda and influence were then free to reign in lands where Greek was a foreign language to the overwhelming majority of people. Consequently, as late as 1810 there were only two elementary schools in the Pashalik of Belgrade and in both the language of instruction was Greek. Even after independence, Serbian townsmen in Belgrade dressed in an apparent 'Greek' style, the newspapers included the rubric 'Greciia' and the Christian leadership spoke Greek until 1840.

http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1610&highlight=history+modern+serbs

Serbs recognized ROM while we still held fast and did not recognize Kosovo. We did not sell them out. That is friendship, actions speak louder than words.

By the same reasoning, they sold you out. I guess actions do speak louder than words.

[Bill77]

Serbs recognized ROM while we still held fast and did not recognize Kosovo. We did not sell them out. That is friendship, actions speak louder than words.

You went opposite to what Serbia wish to do them selves (recognise Pristina) for the sake of EU integration. Serbia's actions is No different to what Macedonia did.

I wander what Greece will do when Serbia eventually officially recognise Kosovo.

The referendum organised by four Serbian municipalities in North Kosovo riaffirmed their refusal to accept Pristina's authority. As expected, the vote was rejected by the Kosovo government and international authorities. But the referendum marks a turning point in the relationship between North Kosovo and Belgrade, which opposed it fearing repercussions on its EU integration process http://www.balcanicaucaso.org/eng/Re...ristina-112518

FriendofMacedonia, You must be gutted at the lack of backing coming from Belgrade.

[Voltron]

You went opposite to what Serbia wish to do them selves (recognise Pristina) for the sake of EU integration. Serbia's actions is No different to what Macedonia did.

I wander what Greece will do when Serbia eventually officially recognise Kosovo.

Dont confuse the Serb people with their politicians. If you visit other forums you would see Serbs calling them traitors for not helping their people in Northern Kosovo. The Serbs had been blocking UN and Albanians from implementing any type of power in those Serb inhabited areas in Kosovo. I hope they stay strong and vigiliant. The polticians on the other hand can go to hell.

We dont take it personal Serbia recognising ROM considering what they had to go through and still go through today. As far if Greece will recognise Kosovo, well we probably could at your expense but I dont think that will happen.

[Phoenix]

No its not. Cmon as if the Macedonians are the top of the list between Serbs and Greeks. Serbs recognized ROM while we still held fast and did not recognize Kosovo. We did not sell them out. That is friendship, actions speak louder than words.

Bullshit!

The so called serb - greek 'friendship' is based more on rhetoric than anything of tangible substance.

When serbia was being bombed back to the Stone Age by NATO in 1999 the 'greeks' sat passively on the sidelines of that conflict.
Once Kosovo was lost to serbia, the 'greeks' participated in KFOR to drive the final nails in serbia's heart with their (greek army) 501st Mechanized Infantry Battalion comprising some 1000 men, to this day there's some 200 'greek' soldiers participating in the Multinational Battle Group North (MNBG-N): - deployed in the northern region of Kosovo and headquartered in Novo Selo.

Well done Voltron...that's a great show of "friendship" toward the serbs...lol

[Voltron]

Sat passively ? you nuts ? Aside from the public outcry here by the people and aside from the everday NATO protests and aside from having our balls busted for not being a team player in NATO youre God damn right we were passive. We werent going to take any part in that bombardment. The only thing we could of done since we were in NATO was to send humanitarian aid. You really have a warped view of things. No Greek soldier would do anything ever to harm Serbs or Serbia. In fact we are guilty of the exact opposite.

This thread certainly took a strange twist. Like women arguing how they should treat Sally....im done.

[Phoenix]

Sat passively ? you nuts ? Aside from the public outcry here by the people and aside from the everday NATO protests and aside from having our balls busted for not being a team player in NATO youre God damn right we were passive. We werent going to take any part in that bombardment. The only thing we could of done since we were in NATO was to send humanitarian aid. You really have a warped view of things. No Greek soldier would do anything ever to harm Serbs or Serbia. In fact we are guilty of the exact opposite.

This thread certainly took a strange twist. Like women arguing how they should treat Sally....im done.

...lol

Voltron you're fuckin' deluded my friend...the reality is that greece has aided in the surgical removal of Kosovo from serbia proper, your military has actively participated in KFOR to protect the shiptar population from the serbs and by default creating the environment for Kosovo independence.

Voltron, forget about Sally, you're sounding more like that crack whore Brian...

[Onur]

There are so many wrongs here, i don't know where to start.

"surgical removal of Kosovo from serbia proper"?!
On what base Kosova belongs to the Serbians? When Ottoman empire annexed it in 1370s, there was a renegade and weak 40-50 year old Serbian state in there and after a single battle, it became part of the Ottoman empire for more than 500 years. Kosova has been awarded to the project of south slavs state, just as Croatia, Macedonia, Slovenia. If you say that Kosova is a Serbian proper then some other comes up and say Macedonia and Croatia are Serbian too and you wouldn't say any proper answer against this claim. Tell me whats the difference between Macedonia, Croatia, Slovenia, Kosova? Zero, none! Why Macedonia is not a part of Serbian proper if Kosova really is theirs? The answer is; neither of them belongs to the Serbia.

Don't tell me that Kosova is Serbian because Serbs lives there. There was huge population movements during yugo regime, coordinated by Serbians. They forcibly expelled so many people, you cant even know if Kosovar Serbians are local or came from other parts of former Yugoslavia between 1920-50s. Not even the north of Belgrade, Banat region belongs to Serbia because current population of Banat is a result of Hungarian and Bosnian exodus between 1920-1950.


Serbian people are responsible of their own doom. They committed horrible crimes upon their muslim kinsmen and upon the Albanians. They have been encouraged to create a pretext for NATO to intervene and they fall in to that trap stupidly. And not only because of their politicians, most of Serbian people supported their state`s genocidal policy.

They created mass graves inside dam by massacring 1000s Bosnians and Albanians, throwing their bodies inside the lakes. I recently read that;

http://www.balkaninsight.com/en/article/more-than-160-perucac-victims-identified

You Macedonians should be happy that they couldn't do that to your people by allying Greeks from the south. They were about the enter Macedonia with tanks and heavy artillery in 1991 and about to massacre people in Skopje. Only Turkey and few other countries was able to stop that happening but Greeks would probably jump in joy if that would be realized. I wouldn't be surprised that if Greek politicians encouraged them to do so in 1991.

[Voltron]

Onur, I heard that rumor that Milosovich offered to meet us in the middle. It was the Greek government that turned the offer down (if this is even true). I think you give Turkey to much weight. Turkey cannot threaten a fellow NATO member even if it thinks they are in the wrong.