Kosovo fans burned Macedonian flag

[Stojacanec]

What you want is segregational rights. Well, I dont wish that on anyone.
You can do what you want in your homes, neighborhoods, blocks, villages, etc.
You dont need a governmental decree, exclusive lobbies or committees to express yourself.

Are Greeks, Serbs, Macedonians etc in Australia for example, seeking segregational rights when schools albeit on week nights or weekends are set up to teach people their native tongue?

Are they too seeking their segregational rights when they errect their own churches to prey in?

Why would the average Greek regard these actons as segregational.

Btw I have read some articles where the Island of Corfu and even Crete want to declare themselves independent from mainland Greece.
Shouldn't you be more conserned about this? Why do you think so many factions in Greece are looking for separaton?

[ProMKD]

What stopped the Serbs? Nothing they hadn't even left yet. JNA tanks were already in Skopje, as they had been for decades before. It was Kiro Gligorov who negotiated a peaceful retreat of the JNA from Macedonian territory. Why would Serbs attack their fellow Orthodox Christian neighbours? They might have done so to massacre the Albanians in Macedonia, but not the Macedonians. The Serbs also could not fight on so many fronts at the same time, so they left Macedonia peacefully. Yes there were some murmurs about an 'Autonomous Serbian state of Karadak' in Skopska Crna Gora by Seselj's supporters, but this went nowhere.

Onur, can you please explain why you think Turkey would go to war over Macedonia. What is in Turkey's interests to do so?

Well put.

Turkey is officially a friendly state, with much cooperation, but it couldn't give two shits about Macedonia if it ever came to serbs and greeks rolling over borders. Who are you kidding Onur!!! That is a joke! No nation would ever stick it's hands in such a dirty shitpile if that ever happened. Even Russia doesn't have the balls to really say much about kosovo, although it was threatening and threatening in the beginning.

As for 1991 and the serbs entering Macedonia, that is retarded, as mentioned above, tehy were already there, and adding another front to their already doomed war would be fatal to them. They arranged with Kiro Gligorov to basically take whatever they want (and they did, not only weapons and equipment paid for by Macedonian taxpayers, but literally the electrical outlets from every military barracks). We let them take it all, and we started fresh.

As for 1991 and greeks entering Macedonia, please, don't make such a fool of yourself. The greeks have played the victim card since they decided to play a card at all. How stupid would they look if they invaded a country of 2 million people, that just got all of it's military ripped right out of it? Use some logic my friend. Speculation is useless.

[Risto the Great]

We let them take it all, and we started fresh.

Ahhh, the Macedonian mindset. Always grateful for small mercies from their benevolent master(s). Imagine if Macedonia actually fought for independence.

[ProMKD]

Ahhh, the Macedonian mindset. Always grateful for small mercies from their benevolent master(s). Imagine if Macedonia actually fought for independence.

huh? I stated a fact. We gave them everything. They took the outlets for God's sake. We had no choice but to start fresh.

Which part of my post was wrong? Which part of it was opinion, because it seems like you think I posted an opinion?

[Onur]

Why would Serbs attack their fellow Orthodox Christian neighbours?

Well, if being the so-called "orthodox bros" solves anything, one might ask why you are bothering with Greeks then? Arent they your orthodox bros too? Actually, it`s pointless to speak with you after this sentence but ok, i`ll try;

Onur, can you please explain why you think Turkey would go to war over Macedonia. What is in Turkey's interests to do so?

It`s crucial for Turkey to maintain status quo in Balkans because any change in it might result in favor of Greece and it`s vital for Turkey to prevent it happening.

No need to mention about the security of Turkish minority in Macedonia either. There was no Turkish people in Croatia, Slovenia but there was in Macedonia. As you said above here, Serbians might have try to massacre Turks in Macedonia. There is no difference between Albanians or Turks for them. Serbian fascists are usually religious freaks, brainwashed by their church and considering all muslims as one. As you know, Mladic was killing Bosnians by calling them Turks. I am sure chetniks would enjoy spilling Turkish blood in Macedonia too.

but it couldn't give two shits about Macedonia if it ever came to serbs and greeks rolling over borders. Who are you kidding Onur!!! That is a joke! No nation would ever stick it's hands in such a dirty shitpile if that ever happened. Even Russia doesn't have the balls to really say much about kosovo, although it was threatening and threatening in the beginning.

Greeks would roll in Macedonia or Albania, anywhere else, you name it, and Turkey would do nothing? Haha, wanna bet? First of all Greeks cannot dare to do such a thing because they know that what might happen to them laters. Turkey kicks the shit out of Greece if they decide to enter any adventure in Balkans or in mediterranean/Aegean, period! Not that i am pampering myself with my own country, it`s just this is the century old politics of Turkey against Greece.

Ofc Russia doesn't do shit for Serbians because Russians totally shifted their focus out from Balkans after USSR collapsed. They have no connection except the so-called orthodox brotherhood and that doesn't worth shit for them. The proof is their current actions for Syria. Why do you think Russia is even more active for Syria than they were for Serbian Kosovo issue? Because Syria is more important for them, for their profits.

[Risto the Great]

No, I wasn't questioning your observation. I was merely pointing out the fact that Macedonians didn't feel like they deserved to keep anything. If someone takes something of mine, they will know how unacceptable it is to me.

[chentovist]

Well, if being the so-called "orthodox bros" solves anything, one might ask why you are bothering with Greeks then? Arent they your orthodox bros too? Actually, it`s pointless to speak with you after this sentence but ok, i`ll try;


It`s crucial for Turkey to maintain status quo in Balkans because any change in it might result in favor of Greece and it`s vital for Turkey to prevent it happening.

No need to mention about the security of Turkish minority in Macedonia either. There was no Turkish people in Croatia, Slovenia but there was in Macedonia. As you said above here, Serbians might have try to massacre Turks in Macedonia. There is no difference between Albanians or Turks for them. Serbian fascists are usually religious freaks, considering all muslims as one. As you know, Mladic was killing Bosnians by calling them Turks. I am sure chetniks would enjoy spilling Turkish blood in Macedonia too.

So Turkey would go to war to protect the Turks of Macedonia who are a mere 77,959 people?? C'mon what else motivates the neo-Ottomans??

[ProMKD]

No, I wasn't questioning your observation. I was merely pointing out the fact that Macedonians didn't feel like they deserved to keep anything. If someone takes something of mine, they will know how unacceptable it is to me.

I agree with you. Yes, there was a lot of valuable equipment taken away, including some fighter planes, and obviously artillery and vehicles, but that's not the point. The point is, they only took the electrical outlets as a 'screw you' and it's a matter of principle.

We have been raped too many times in the past, and continue to let it happen. It's time for the individual Macedonian to see history correctly and also have their own sense of determination and national pride. Without the power of the individual, we can't have any national progress.

I think the Macedonian psyche has been beat down so many times over the centuries, and most of it has happened recently. Foreign and domestic propaganda has proven very strong and effective in Macedonia.

[Risto the Great]

It's time for the individual Macedonian to see history correctly and also have their own sense of determination and national pride. Without the power of the individual, we can't have any national progress.

I agree and will say that any kind of progress is not possible without an awakening at an individual level.

[Komita]

NATO are establishing the so called "green route" from Bosnia to Turkey.



And it's all thanks to christian fertility rates on the Balkans. Both macedonians, serbs and bulgarians see shrinking populations and birth rate numbers. If something wont change drastically the christians will become a minority on the Balkans, and all of this in our lifetime.

[chentovist]

NATO are establishing the so called "green route" from Bosnia to Turkey.



And it's all thanks to christian fertility rates on the Balkans. Both macedonians, serbs and bulgarians see shrinking populations and birth rate numbers. If something wont change drastically the christians will become a minority on the Balkans, and all of this in our lifetime.

I would add Thrace (Greek and Bulgarian) to that route....

[ProMKD]

Where is this from Komita? Does it literally mean an interstate, or is this a figurative matter? I don't understand it.

[Onur]

NATO are establishing the so called "green route" from Bosnia to Turkey.

This is becoming more and more stupid day by day. Whats got to do with Turkey and your fertility rate? Why you blame Bosnians, Turks or NATO if you don't have kids?

Komita, are you married? Why don't you get a Russian wife and start making lots of slavic orthodox babies? It`s not that difficult thing to do. If you don't do it, why you blame Turkey for that?

[ProMKD]

This is becoming more and more stupid day by day. Whats got to do with Turkey and your fertility rate? Why you blame Bosnians, Turks or NATO if you don't have kids?

Komita, are you married? Why don't you get a Russian wife and start making lots of slavic orthodox babies? It`s not that difficult thing to do. If you don't do it, why you blame Turkey for that?

He didn't blame turkey for it anywhere. He said that macedonians and the others are stupid for not having enough children.

I think what he was saying is that the muslims are more than keen on overtaking Europe as a whole, and the balkans obviously as well.

This is no secret! The muslims want Europe, and are working hard towards this goal. Christians are helping them with "multiethnic societies" and declining birth rates.

[FriendofMacedonia]

Thats not true, my friend. Avars settled your people around Belgrade in 8th century. Then you were part of the Bulgar empires, Hungaro/Austrians, Eastern Romans. During that times, some of you have been christianized by the eastern Romans (aka Serbians), some by the Franks/Latins (aka Croatians) and finally some of you have been islamized by the Turks (aka Bosnians). Today`s Serbia, Bosnia, Kosovo was in totally ruins because wars between Bulgars, eastern Romans, Austro-Hungarians. Also crusaders totally desolated the place too, by massacring orthodoxes and bogomils. These all written in crusader chronicles. Serbia was independent only for few decades before 1370-1380s.

Yes, Serbia officially became part of the Ottoman empire in 1450s but you were just vassals since the battle of Kosovo. Serbian princes like Lazarevic and Marko was the best allies of the Ottoman sultans between 1380-1450 AD, providing them armies of 10.000s soldiers for Ottoman wars against Persia, Timur, catholic Austro-Hungarians. All Serbian rulers was personally participating Ottoman campaigns.



Then why Serbia attacked Croatia and Slovenia in 1991 as soon as they decided to go for a referendum of independence? Both Slovenia and Croatia has been bombed by Serbian airforce, tanks entered Slovenia, dubrovnik ports has been demolished etc. Macedonia did the same, Serbian army was about to enter Macedonia too but you have been stopped.

If you're actually going to claim that Serbian pre-Ottoman statehood consisted of 40 - 50 years you word ain't gonna do it mate, I'm gonna need A LOT more than that. Our statehood is pretty well documented.

The Slovenian war lasted 10 days before the JNA realized its futility and pointlessness. Croatia was attacked in support of the RSK. Again, who stopped us? Macedonia posed no military threat to Serbia, there was a very small Serbian minority, and it would be a hugely unpopular war with the Serbian people. We had no reason to go to war with Macedonia, so we didn't.