Albanianization in Macedonia

[KingMac]

They were terrorists and should have been dealt with accordingly.

[Droog]

.... dealt with accordingly.

That may be your own way to explain your desire, but in the Hague(and every international court) that's called a war crime.
for a reply to my question :Which rights were given to Albanians in expense of the Macedonians?

[George S.]

Droog the macedonian government is losing sovereignity all the time .The government just caves in to them.there's lot's of examples.The albanians are building mosques without approval right under the noses of macedonians.If it isn't for a handful of selani protesting & physically stopping them .The govt has proved it doesn't care.The skopje kale fiasco case in point the macedonians are building by day & the albanians are wrecking at night.
There's other examples where languages & rule of law etc applies in villages percentage rule.Macedonians have been kicked out eg aracinovo.The list of grievances are enormous.the albanians do not respect us.They want to ultimately secede from us with their bit of Macedonia.Haven't you heard the terrorists of 2001 are getting memorials by tearing the macedonian ones.Also the terrorists are going to get pensions,seats on parliament/allready?the list is endless.It's basically capitulating to these people i think the politicians are giving in for votes ehink they got that & they asked to have their own passports as wel one point the albanians even asked for their own degrees from their own university .SO they have totally no respect for macedonians & they want their own way.They are prepared to get it any way to buy. cheat,any old way to destroy the macedonian sovereignity.It's in your face attude.Remember the flying of albanian flags & how they refused to remove them
That has got to be virtually No respect at all. How about the macedonians forced to learn the albanian language.I could go on...

[George S.]

if can add about the albanians & how they are cheating on the census 2011,By saying how turks are albanians & getting otside of macedonia albanians to come on holidays to vote in the census.That will tell a fake picture & inflate the figures.This just proves what the albanians are upto to errode the macedonian sovereignity.

[Droog]

Droog the macedonian government is losing sovereignity all the time .The government just caves in to them.there's lot's of examples.The albanians are building mosques without approval right under the noses of macedonians.If it isn't for a handful of selani protesting & physically stopping them .The govt has proved it doesn't care.The skopje kale fiasco case in point the macedonians are building by day & the albanians are wrecking at night.
There's other examples where languages & rule of law etc applies in villages percentage rule.Macedonians have been kicked out eg aracinovo.The list of grievances are enormous.the albanians do not respect us.They want to ultimately secede from us with their bit of Macedonia.Haven't you heard the terrorists of 2001 are getting memorials by tearing the macedonian ones.Also the terrorists are going to get pensions,seats on parliament/allready?the list is endless.It's basically capitulating to these people i think the politicians are giving in for votes ehink they got that & they asked to have their own passports as wel one point the albanians even asked for their own degrees from their own university .SO they have totally no respect for macedonians & they want their own way.They are prepared to get it any way to buy. cheat,any old way to destroy the macedonian sovereignity.It's in your face attude.Remember the flying of albanian flags & how they refused to remove them
That has got to be virtually No respect at all. How about the macedonians forced to learn the albanian language.I could go on...

a)Do you have any proof about the illegal mosques? I like neither mosques nor churches, but unless there is some proof to back up your statements you're repeating the same old school Balkans propaganda.
b)What does "Macedonians have been kicked out eg aracinovo." mean? Did someone force them out of the settlement or did they sell their houses and just left?
c)Everywhere where minorities are respected they're allowed to wave their own flag? What's so wrong with that?
d)Macedonians forced to learn Albanian? If you actually spent some time on learning what's going on in Albania instead of imagining a widespread persecution of Macedonians by Albanians, you'd know that Macedonians of Albania have their own Macedonian schools.

[julie]

Droog, what is your ethnicity?

[Droog]

Droog, what is your ethnicity?

Albanian, isn't it a bit obvious by now?

[Voltron]

^ haha, I was going to ask the same as Julie in another thread. She beat me to it.

It was obvious today though. In the beginning I wasnt quite sure. In any case good to see an Albanian on board.

[julie]

Voltron and Droog, would like to ask you both something in general, and am off topic here so sorry
It interests me into why/how Albanians, Greeks, and other ethnicities are on forums that are not pertaining to their own ethnicity. I certainly have no issue with anyone here other than they are respectful and follow the forum rules. I have not been on any other forum, bar one once, and they I shall refer to as maggots on the web. They have so much vitriol and hatred toward all people and do not acknowledge the existence of any one. I did not last very long, I could not cope with the vitriol and poisonous venom and direct curses to myself and even my own family.
Why are you not on other forums pertaining to your own ethnicities, and why basically, are you here
As I said, I have no issue whatsoever with anyone, and it interests me , if you guys dont mind me asking

[Droog]

Well, interethnic and intercultural discussions are always interesting because you actually get to form your opinion about your neighbours and not just base it on something you watched/read.

[Voltron]

Voltron and Droog, would like to ask you both something in general, and am off topic here so sorry
It interests me into why/how Albanians, Greeks, and other ethnicities are on forums that are not pertaining to their own ethnicity. I certainly have no issue with anyone here other than they are respectful and follow the forum rules. I have not been on any other forum, bar one once, and they I shall refer to as maggots on the web. They have so much vitriol and hatred toward all people and do not acknowledge the existence of any one. I did not last very long, I could not cope with the vitriol and poisonous venom and direct curses to myself and even my own family.
Why are you not on other forums pertaining to your own ethnicities, and why basically, are you here
As I said, I have no issue whatsoever with anyone, and it interests me , if you guys dont mind me asking

Perfectly legit question Julie. Its actually quite simple for me. I have no interest in being in an enviroment where everyone agrees with each other. I prefer to be in an enviroment where opinions are different than mine. Ive been on the MOTW, they are not maggots and I dont know what has transpired with you on that site. This forum has often times mirrored MOTW with its hardline positions and opinions. I wasnt exactly welcomed here either.

[julie]

Voltron, no on has attacked you personally and sworn they will come after you and your children will be killed bla bla bla, I was apalled, by simply stating I am Macedonian and where my origins are from. It sickened me , and it was also directed at a couple of others as well who had stated they were Macedonian.

If everyone can converse without personally denigrating then that is a good thing.

I have learnt so much from others here, and Onur has been awesome with providing a lot of information as well. Many of our archived records were destroyed, kept in the village churches in Aegean Macedonia which is terrible, during the 1948 Civil war.

Droog, if the Macedonians in the Aegean had been afforded the same rights and equality,as Albanians in Macedonia then Macedonians would be equal, recognised as they should be.

My maternal side, not only did they suffer as so many did persecution, beheadings, and dreadful atrocities I dont wish to mention at that time (I call it extermination and cultural genocide for those that did not accept enforced conditions) but they had villages renamed and were renamed!

Droog, the parallel here is the Albanians have equality within Macedonia.

I can understand if the Macedonians started burning mosques and places of your worship, renamed you all with Macedonian names and forbade you to speak Albanian or you would be murdered, this is what happened to my family, my beloved Macedonian brothers and sisters in the Aegean, and yet Albanians in Macedonia continue to make greater demands upon us, why is it that Macedonia needs to continue to acquiesce to these enforcements upon its own soil? Albanians enjoy the same conditions as my people there!

[Droog]

...

Julie in the extremely short time we have on this planet spending too much energy on some issues is a waste of time so the best thing is this:

Do not do unto others what you do not want others do unto you.

In the past attrocities have been committed, but they shouldn't be repeated because that simply eternalizes all the suffering.

P.S I'm not Muslim, so mosques aren't my places of worship

[Belomorec]

Yeah I love how this all degenerates in PC nonsense.

There is a massive difference between hardline greeks, hardline Albanians and hardline Macedonians.

greeks: a false history, a false nation and a hatred towards Macedonians because of a foundation of lies. The greeks themselves know yet they continue -- probably because without Egej they would starve and die. BUT it's not there's to being with!

albanians: where do we start? these people DO NOT belong in Macedonia. Simple. If they want to stay then they learn some respect. I mean, they should consider themselves very, very lucky: were it not for America and the powers most of them would be dead.

Macedonians: countless years under oppression and finally, when there is a chance we may rise again, the powers won't let us and turn our people against each other and set our (fake) neighbours out to kill us.

See the big difference?

[indigen]

a)Do you have any proof about the illegal mosques? I like neither mosques nor churches, but unless there is some proof to back up your statements you're repeating the same old school Balkans propaganda.

And what will you do if there is proof?

b)What does "Macedonians have been kicked out eg aracinovo." mean? Did someone force them out of the settlement or did they sell their houses and just left?

Do you read this forum (this topic)? The practice of clearing out non-Ghegs in Kosovo and Western (and North-Western) parts of Macedonia follows a formula and is (and has been) systematic. How is it possible that all the villages around Skopje that were once (certainly before WWII) predominantly Macedonian and Orthodox are now almost exclusively Gheg and Muslim?

c)Everywhere where minorities are respected they're allowed to wave their own flag? What's so wrong with that?

Not if those minorities are not loyal to the state and have treasonous and separatist tendencies and engage in seditious activities!

http://i995.photobucket.com/albums/af80/inidgen2010/articles_1990s/guardian_17_11_1992.jpg

d)Macedonians forced to learn Albanian? If you actually spent some time on learning what's going on in Albania instead of imagining a widespread persecution of Macedonians by Albanians, you'd know that Macedonians of Albania have their own Macedonian schools.

Only in one small area, only to a limited capacity and with very little to no Albanian state support. In Golo Brdo, Gora and major urban centres where Macedonans live, they enjoy no minority rights.