Greek and Bulgarian Music and culture

[Onur]

In Greece we love it, yet I understand it's anti-Turkish and reflects our brothership towards Armenians.
Onur,
I haven't seen more than 5 or 6 Turkish movies. Can you give me a list of Turkish movies that have Greek interest, minor or major references to Greeks, from any historical period of our common past?
I don't mind if they're negative towards Greeks, as long as they're good films.

Ohh yes. I call it "unholy alliance" for the Greco-Armenian diaspora in USA. If you guys can discover anything common besides Turkish hate, then i can maybe call it "brotherhood" because all they do is spending millions of dollars for anti-Turkish propaganda, nothing else. You know the last one was J-Lo issue in Cyprus. They didn't gain anything proper so far and they cant either, even if they spend billions.

It`s a bit weird but in Turkey, literally anything related with our bad history with Greece is totally ignored for about half a century. It was like nothing happened and like you guys never existed.

Some Greek singers was famous here tough, like Roza Eskinazi and few others and i know that there was some Greek artists in 1960-1970s Turkish movies. I cant even remember any Turkish movie related with our past with the Greeks atm.

So, the situation here was so different then Greece or Armenia. I know that there are evil-Turk image in all of your books for primary school kids but contrary, it seems like Turkish policy preferred to ignore anything related with Greeks.

In the last 5-10 years, there is a strong interest among Turkish people for all over the Balkans tough, especially for Macedonia and Bosnia but most of people still see Greece as a spoiled kid of the EU and mostly ignores.

Yeah shows how money talks in Ellada we will screw anyone over but we'll sly them in to get your business. Onur their invites does sound like a political move to maybe sway people over its probaly a political tatic to get in bed sort of with turkey see if you guys would crack

Greek tourism office even giving advertisements to the Turkish tv channels nowadays but most people here is already aware of why they call us now and i don't think many Turkish people goes to their islands. Few of my friends gone to these islands and they say that there are only old people around and it`s mostly deserted except Mikanos. Maybe even Mikanos is deserted this year too, after economic crisis, dunno. Already these are small islands, far away to Greece mainland. It cant be as good as our facilities in Turkey, so why i should go there anyway. We got same Aegean sea and sun already and definitely better sights. Maybe Greek islands can be attractive for other people in but not for us.

[Makedonetz]

Onur thats true should of picked it up by that building in the background but greeks claim similiar buildings probaly as they were "their own" so its hard to distinguish the real truth!

Its odd they like to harrash you but on the other hand they like to come over to turkey where is the democracy hopefully one day turkish cost guards will hunt them down.

Yeah shows how money talks in Ellada we will screw anyone over but we'll sly them in to get your business. Onur their invites does sound like a political move to maybe sway people over its probaly a political tatic to get in bed sort of with turkey see if you guys would crack

[Onur]

Onur they picked a great selection to shoot that video it looks like San Francisco with that huge bridge. It sure looks nice there Is Chios a heavily Turkish Pop Island?

Hehe, this place is not Chios, Makedonetz. This is Istanbul-Turkey and it`s bosphorus bridge back there. You can also see the roof of Hagia Sophia at background. This is just middle of a street in a district called Ortakoy, at European side. The opposite side of the bosphorus is Asia.

Chios island is one of closest Greek islands to Turkey`s shore. We can see the car lights in Chios from our coast at Cesme, Izmir-Turkey but I don't think there are Turkish people living in there. When we set sail on little boat to catch some fishes, Greek coastal guards try to terrorize us by claiming that we violate Greek waters!!! ofc, if there is no Turkish coastal guards around. Then people calls Turkish coastal guards by phone and then Greek ones escapes. Sometimes, Greek-Turkish bickering is as stupid as that. Most of the local people in Chios are frequently coming to Turkey tough, even for shopping in groceries since it`s that close. Most of them can speak Turkish too, especially older ones.

But all these bickering was b4 their economical crisis. Now, they promote Chios in Turkey and invite us to go there. Their mayor even invited Turks to buy houses and settle in the island but Greek media branded him as traitor then

[Makedonetz]

Both Raki and Ouzo are grape based alcoholic drinks. Aniseed and mastic are just added aromas to them. Traditional Turkish Raki is always with aniseed. It`s colorless like water and has %45 alcohol. We add cold water and ice when we drink it. It immediately turns white in color when you add water to it. We also have a Raki with mastic aroma. Probably thats what you call Mastika.





Thats what i heard as well.






The different taste comes from the amount of aromas used in them, otherwise the preparation style is same on both drinks. The ıngredients are quite same as well. I am not sure about the alcohol level in Ouzo tough. Even if Vodka has about same alcohol level as Raki, Raki knocks you down much faster than Vodka. We usually observe this on tourists here . They try Turkish Raki and they drink it like Vodka by ignoring our warning, then they feint by dropping on the floor, lol

Raki is meant to be drink slowly with meze and seafoods or at least with muskmelon. That`s the proper way.

And with a music like this;

YouTube - Hüsnü Şenlendirici ve Trio Chios - Gel Gel Kayıkçı

This is Greek band from Chios island. Only the klarinet player and the girl is Turkish but it`s OK, since it`s same music

Onur they picked a great selection to shoot that video it looks like San Francisco with that huge bridge. It sure looks nice there Is Chios a heavily Turkish Pop Island?

Ouzo has a strong Black Lickerous (sp) taste i can't stomach it.

[Onur]

Gasp! I don't know much about cousin, but the rest of Greeks had great music also. The music of the 20th century, was formed in the big cities (Athens and Thessaloniki) and most Anatolian immigrants were there and had a huge impact. That was our "low-life" Eastern influence and by 1950s it was already considered respectable. The Western influence, was closer to Italian or (generally) European songs. Below, you can see an example of it.

Well. The video you linked is just represents the popular trends in music at different time periods. In 1950s, French or Italian style was popular in Turkey too;

YouTube - Semiramis Pekkan Saklambac

BUT this doesn't represent our own music culture. This just shows French and Italian influence in our musics at 1950s.

Now, tell me which type of music represents Greece? "Sophia Loren, Tonis Maroudas" OR my video "Kayikci"? You got my point now?

Do you have a link of the original song or turkish version?

I cant show you the record of first original version because most of these songs composed at 19th century(some even earlier, like 18th century) while your grandparents was still living in Anatolia.

You can find the vinyl records of these songs in this youtube channel. Most of them are recorded by Anatolian immigrants at 1920s in USA.;

http://www.youtube.com/user/romeikos2#p/u

************************************************** ***********************







This channel is owned by a member of a Greek band "Thria". They got 15-20 men orchestra and they play original Anatolian music, the classic songs of 18-19-20th century. They play as exactly as Turkish classic music orchestras. This means no buzuki, nor sirtaki. There are Turkish oud, kanoun, kaval, baglama instead.

http://www.youtube.com/user/mpoulgari

Here are some videos of their orchestra;

YouTube - smirneikos ballos (Σμυρν�*ικος Μπάλλος)
YouTube - milo mou kai madarini- koniali (Μήλο μου και μανταρίνι - Κόνιαλι)

This is pure old style music of Ottoman era. Only difference is, they sing in Greek but they sometime sings with original Turkish lyrics too... They are quite good, even as good as our own Turkish orchestras.

[thessalo-niki]

This is Greek band from Chios island. Only the klarinet player and the girl is Turkish but it`s OK, since it`s same music

This is a very popular song in Greece (Καϊξης, credited to Apostolos Hatzichristos), but I've heard it's a rip-off from a Turkish opera (or something). Is it so? Do you have a link of the original song or turkish version?
_________________________________
Odysseas Elytis - Our name is our soul

[thessalo-niki]

All these dances are some kind of variation of Turkish zeybek(zeibekikos in Greek) dance of Aegean Anatolia. Anatolian immigrants bring this dance to Greece along with all the instruments and music style too. Then they created a faster and more vibrant dance called "Sirtaki" by using zeybek dance figures as base.

No, this is far from zeibekiko. You can see one (the MOST famous one) in Post#9 (in the first page of the current thread). The mood and meaning of the zeibekiko dance is also totally different.

I always wondered if current Greeks would have any music and food culture today if there wouldn't be Anatolian immigrants. Probably not.

Gasp! I don't know much about couisine, but the rest of Greeks had great music also. The music of the 20th century, was formed in the big cities (Athens and Thessaloniki) and most Anatolian immigrants were there and had a huge impact. That was our "low-life" Eastern influence and by 1950s it was already considered respectable. The Western influence, was closer to Italian or (generally) European songs. Below, you can see an example of it.
While cities were divided between these two types of songs, that were bound to be combined and extended, in the country, people were listening and dancing with the local traditional music.
YouTube - Sophia Loren, Tonis Maroudas - Ti 'ne afto pou to lene agapi (1957)
_________________________________
Odysseas Elytis - Our name is our soul

[Onur]

Ouzo is made from Aniseed, we have the same thing called Mastika if you want to know more just take a look at the forum member Mastika's avatar thats what the bottle looks like.

Both Raki and Ouzo are grape based alcoholic drinks. Aniseed and mastic are just added aromas to them. Traditional Turkish Raki is always with aniseed. It`s colorless like water and has %45 alcohol. We add cold water and ice when we drink it. It immediately turns white in color when you add water to it. We also have a Raki with mastic aroma. Probably thats what you call Mastika.

Onur, I have heard that the Zorba 'dance' itself was first concoctocted by someone in Anthony Quinn's movie, 'Zorba the Greek'. Can anybody else confirm?

Thats what i heard as well.

Raki and Ouzo don't have the same taste, Raki is stronger like the Macedonian Rakija, whereas Ouzo is not as 'overbearing', more like the Macedonian Mastika I think.

The different taste comes from the amount of aromas used in them, otherwise the preparation style is same on both drinks. The ıngredients are quite same as well. I am not sure about the alcohol level in Ouzo tough. Even if Vodka has about same alcohol level as Raki, Raki knocks you down much faster than Vodka. We usually observe this on tourists here . They try Turkish Raki and they drink it like Vodka by ignoring our warning, then they feint by dropping on the floor, lol

Raki is meant to be drink slowly with meze and seafoods or at least with muskmelon. That`s the proper way.

And with a music like this;

YouTube - Hüsnü Şenlendirici ve Trio Chios - Gel Gel Kayıkçı

This is Greek band from Chios island. Only the klarinet player and the girl is Turkish but it`s OK, since it`s same music

[thessalo-niki]

He might be a good director but this movie is just one of countless materials of anti-Turkish propaganda.

I watched this movie for a long time ago and i don't know where they filmed it but i remember that the Turkey was looking like Arabia.

In Greece we love it, yet I understand it's anti-Turkish and reflects our brothership towards Armenians.
Onur,
I haven't seen more than 5 or 6 Turkish movies. Can you give me a list of Turkish movies that have Greek interest, minor or major references to Greeks, from any historical period of our common past?
I don't mind if they're negative towards Greeks, as long as they're good films.
_________________________________
Odysseas Elytis - Our name is our soul

[thessalo-niki]

Onur, I have heard that the Zorba 'dance' itself was first concoctocted by someone in Anthony Quinn's movie, 'Zorba the Greek'. Can anybody else confirm?

Yes, I can confirm. Lately, the credit is attributed to an unknown choreographer (George Provias) who trained them at Athens, but was not present at the shootings. Yet, both Quinn and Cacoyiannis have tried to take credit. It seems that the exact dance (which was later named syrtaki) was concocted this way at Crete, because Quinn had a problem with his knee!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrtaki

_________________________________
Odysseas Elytis - Our name is our soul

[Soldier of Macedon]

All these dances are some kind of variation of Turkish zeybek(zeibekikos in Greek) dance of Aegean Anatolia. Anatolian immigrants bring this dance to Greece along with all the instruments and music style too. Then they created a faster and more vibrant dance called "Sirtaki" by using zeybek dance figures as base.

I always wondered if current Greeks would have any music and food culture today if there wouldn't be Anatolian immigrants. Probably not.



P. S: Btw, our national drinks are same too. Turkish one is "Raki", Greek one is named "Ouzo" but they are same. I wonder if there was "Ouzo" in Greece at 19th century? Or Anatolian immigrants bring "Raki" there and they just changed the name as "Ouzo"?? Raki is made by grape and grape means "�z�m" in Turkish. Maybe they derived the name "ouzo" from Turkish "�z�m" cuz it`s similar sounding.

Onur, I have heard that the Zorba 'dance' itself was first concoctocted by someone in Anthony Quinn's movie, 'Zorba the Greek'. Can anybody else confirm?

Raki and Ouzo don't have the same taste, Raki is stronger like the Macedonian Rakija, whereas Ouzo is not as 'overbearing', more like the Macedonian Mastika I think.

[Prolet]

Onur, Do you know that Zorba is buried in Skopje? I've seen his grave.

Ouzo is made from Aniseed, we have the same thing called Mastika if you want to know more just take a look at the forum member Mastika's avatar thats what the bottle looks like.

By Raki do you mean Rakija? Thats made from grapes and its very traditional. Its usually white but we like to make it yellowish, the white rakija for me is used for cleaning windows. When i was in Monte Negro i tried their rakija it was over 50% alcohol and it was white, three shots of that would have put you on the floor, its ideal for cleaning windows lol

[Onur]

Something about Asia Minor, the relation between Greeks, Turks and Armenians. A great introduction, but look especially the part between 5 to 8 minutes.
This is the most "Greek" movie by Elia Kazan, America, America (1963) telling the story of his family and how they ended up in America.

He might be a good director but this movie is just one of countless materials of anti-Turkish propaganda.

I watched this movie for a long time ago and i don't know where they filmed it but i remember that the Turkey was looking like Arabia.

[Onur]

Thessaloniki, can you tell me who invented the Zorba dance? When?

All these dances are some kind of variation of Turkish zeybek(zeibekikos in Greek) dance of Aegean Anatolia. Anatolian immigrants bring this dance to Greece along with all the instruments and music style too. Then they created a faster and more vibrant dance called "Sirtaki" by using zeybek dance figures as base.

I always wondered if current Greeks would have any music and food culture today if there wouldn't be Anatolian immigrants. Probably not.



P. S: Btw, our national drinks are same too. Turkish one is "Raki", Greek one is named "Ouzo" but they are same. I wonder if there was "Ouzo" in Greece at 19th century? Or Anatolian immigrants bring "Raki" there and they just changed the name as "Ouzo"?? Raki is made by grape and grape means "�z�m" in Turkish. Maybe they derived the name "ouzo" from Turkish "�z�m" cuz it`s similar sounding.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Something lighter. Zorba the Greek (1964) the best Greek film of the 60s and an international hit. This is the famous uplifting ending and what Kazantzakis (copying Nietzsche), Cacoyiannis and Theodorakis present as tragic optimism.
(In English language)
YouTube - Zorba's Dance, Including The Barbecue Party
_________________________________
Odysseas Elytis - Our name is our soul

Thessaloniki, can you tell me who invented the Zorba dance? When?