Kosovo: News, Politics & Issues

[fyrOM]

Do you really need to ask that question….mmm.

Did I not say a Tibetan has a natural right to self governance in Tibet and a Turk in Germany does not. What part of this do you not understand so I can know where tostart to explain.

As to myself seeing that you ask I am a person of Macedonian origin living in Australia. I also see myself as an Australian. I do believe I have a right to vote and in doing so influence the course Australia takes. I do not believe I have a right to drum up the macos in Melbourne to one suburb in the west and declare independence from Australia.

Any other questions or will you be still shouting about rights when the Albanians in Macedonia try to secede next.

[Vangelovski]

OziMak,

WHY don't the Turks in Germany have the right to self-government? WHY is it that you believe this community does not have an inherent natural right that others do? Do you understand what a natural right is? Do you understand that all humans have natural rights by virture of them being humans?

I'm not the one who began the discussion about 'rights' and undermined our own right to self-government. Not only that, but you also undermine the right of Macedonians in the occupied territories to self-government.

However, I was the one to note that we have already lost most of western Macedonia and the question now is will we excercise our competing right of self-defence and defend our territory and reintegrate these regions back into the Macedonian state?

[fyrOM]

You are either saying things to just be provocative or are very mistaken. What I have said is self explanatory.

[makedonin]

You are either saying things to just be provocative or are very mistaken. What I have said is self explanatory.

I perfectly understand you OziMak.

Turks in Germany don't have the natural right of self governing, cause they are not in their indegous theritory, they are not the natural inheritors of the given theritory. Period.

To be more precise, the Turks in Germany can have it two ways:

• Be on working Visum, which allows them to work and stay as long as they want in Germany, but they don't have the right to vote. If they break the law, the Visum is no more valid and they will be thrown away from Germany.

• To take German citizenship and take whole part into the German society underlieing on German laws and regulations. If breaking the law, they will be judged as any other German according to the German law. That can't be counted as self governing. All they can do is join to one of the existing German parties or create own, as they did in 2008, but it is still under German law, and if they get the votes, will have representatives in the German Bundestag, speak German and obay German laws.

So, they don't have the right to self govern them in Germany, which is absolutely reasonable and acceptable. If anyone else says something else, so he should go to the German chancellor Merkel and tell her about it, and than post her reply here. I know exactly what kind of reply that will be.

That should have been the case with Kosovo, but that does not apply on the Balkan, as we can see from the beginning post on this thread.

Got bewahre, dass hier die Balkanregelung angewandt werden soll. Dann haben wir gleich den dritten Weltkrieg.

[Prolet]

Makedonin, I totally agree with you

This is what we have to deal with, the Governor of Kosovo has been arrested and charged with Corruption and money laundering. This created a big problem for us, thats for sure.

Гувернерот на Централната банка на Косово Хашим Реџепи денеска е упасен. Полицијата го сомничи за злоупотреба на службената должност, примање мито, прикривање данок, трговија со неговото влијание и перење пари.

[fyrOM]

Don’t get me wrong. I couldn’t care less if both Kosovo and Serbia got blown to pieces. I have no love for either as both have been against the Macedonians and still pose a threat albeit probably Serbia less so now but mainly out of not being able to do anything rather than truly not wanting to harm Macedonia. The problem is an independent Kosovo sets a dangeras precedent for the Albanians in Macedonia.

The land in the Balkans like Germany is not terra nullius so lets form countries wherever we please and occupation and free will to self determination are justification for this. You are the new commers whether it was by imigration or by historical occupation if you want to join the collective good then ok but in no way does it mean just setup your own collective good. When the Albanians in Macedonia can say they are Macedonian too and trully mean it then there will be peace otherwise there will always exist the threat of war as in 2001.

The government should be demanding from the west a peace keeping force to oversee the restoration of land to the Macedonians who fled in 2001.

This is why Kosovo is significant for Macedonia. Do not see events as being soley in themselves. It sets the sceen that a concentration of people in one part can just declair their independence when they feel like it. 2001 was all about extending the territory under their control. At no time did they seriously think they could win militarily total separation. I cant remember the guys name but he was a wanted drug trafficker by Interpol in many western countries who was finally found in Macedonia. It was reported he was funding with his drug and prostitution and human trafficking money the litteraly overnight construction of houses on land previously owned by Macedonians so now to become an Albanian village. The Ohrid aggreement is one step closser to a federation which is one step closer to separation. In the near future the agreement should be torn up on the basis it is discriminatory and creates multiple types of citizens where as in western countries the law is one for all citizens regardless of race religion ect. Use the wests own laws against themselves.

All of this seperation action stems from the notion that the Albanians are newcommers and so are the Macedonians as they are not related to the ancient Macedonians but a kind of Macedonian which has evolved on this land as the Albanians have evolved on this land so splitting it between two newcomers and no owner should not be a problem. That is why Northern ect Macedonia can never be allowed to happen. The west is litteraly setting up a if this then that and if that then the next thing. Give one up and you give everything up. There is no room for negotiation and compromise. Anybody thinking there is any suitable compromise is delusional.

The west tries to convice everyone that Macedonia changing her name will only benefit the Macedonians. By becoming a kind of Macedonian we get the eu and the freedom for Macedonians to migrate to some western countries while we are assured Macedonia will remain intact. I don’t belive the usa.

[Prolet]

Kosovo is the only state thats openly attacked us in 2001 with their terrorists illegally entering our country and shooting at our people. What we've seen in the past few years with criminal activities,we've even had terrorists commit crimes in Macedonia and then finding safe haven in Kosovo.

Out of the list of 75 wanted people hiding in Kosovo, the Kosovar Police could only manage to arrest one person and extradite them to Macedonia if thats not a banana country i dont know what is.

YouTube - Hague Biased? Kosovo independence 'legal'

[Risto the Great]

The problem with Kosovo is not the right of self govern.

They were Authonomus even under YU. They had University to learn in Albanian, had their local Government in Albanian. All towns in Kosovo were bilingual, from shops to road shields. They just didn't want the Serbs there that is all.

So the dispute is about how this came into being!

In short, there were almost equal numbers of Serbs and Albanians in Kosovo.

Than they started to fight for independence. Their butt was kicked, and NATO came in, and Albanians were the winners. Than the retribution begann, while NATO was just watching! Serbs were killed on the streets in front of NATO soldiers. I was there, have seen it with my very eyes. NATO was raiding the Serb villages for guns, while Albanian villages were left out. Albanians kept their arms, were even supplied by foreign handlers.
Cause the retribution and unarmed situation tounsands of Serbs fled from Kosovo, while NATO was still watching.

So, now there is the situation, Albanians are majority in Kosovo and they can peacefully take over Kosovo.

But the win over situation is not to be credited to the Albanians, weather to NATO.

And that is the whole problem.

Is that legal, that is the question? That self-government is delivered on the plate by the powers! The other question is why only the Albanians are deserving that credit to be gifted by the powers!

There are many other smaller nations who want to self govern, why aren't they not threated the same way as the Albanians?

Somebody does not have interest interests in the others, that is why!

Yes Makedonin. This is my disappointment in this issue.
Vangelovski mentions a nation's competing right to defend itself. It seems hollow when other nations are assisting one side only.

As evidenced in Kosovo and also in Macedonia in 2001.

I do deny the Kosovar's their right to self-government, It makes me feel hypocritical towards the Ohrid agreement to feel any other way about it.

The Albanians were the "chosen ones" in the Balkans because they are significant in population, they have no friends in the Balkans and are grateful for the favour of the world powers. Islam has nothing to do with it.

[Frank]

There are so many twists to this, all that can be said

Kosovo has self Government, its other features of a State be in coaxed by nanny support

But Kosovo isn't Independent that is for sure and never will be

The ICJ decision would not have helped Serbia even if it went the right way neither does it help the Kosovo-Albanians as much as they think either

All I care is for Macedonia

[Uskana]

How can anyone compare the Albanians in Macedonia to the Turks in Germany? The Albanians are natives to the Balkans and have been living in what is today known as the "Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia" since it's creation. I'm not endorsing the Albanians right to secede, but the comparison made is utterly ridiculous.

[Risto the Great]

I would not make that comparison.
Nor would I endorse a right to secede for Macedonia.
What would you endorse for ethnic Albanians in Macedonia Uskana?

[Uskana]

I would not make that comparison.
Nor would I endorse a right to secede for Macedonia.
What would you endorse for ethnic Albanians in Macedonia Uskana?

As an Albanian from Macedonia, I would advocate co-existence with the Macedonian state. Easier said then done with considering the ultra-nationalist on all sides.

[Risto the Great]

As one of the minorities in Macedonia, do you feel that ethnic Albanians have gained far too many concessions in Macedonia as a result of the Ohrid Agreement and constitutional amendments? Can you list any other countries with such concessions?

[Risto the Great]

The Albanians are natives to the Balkans and have been living in what is today known as the "Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia" since it's creation.

It is also knows as Macedonia by the way. I am wondering why any Macedonian national would feel the need to use any other name? Please refrain from using it again.

[Uskana]

Hmmm I can sense some hostility already. Concessions, well off the top of my head I would say Canada, Switzerland and Bosnia are similar. When a country has over 25% of a minority it is natural for them to ask for rights.

If the roles were reversed, Macedonians would've asked for the same.