Macedonian Presidential Elections - 2019

[Gocka]

They've already done this But they're doing it out of pure laziness, not opposition to RNMK. We really need to fit the words "Democratic" and "People's" into this name - that will make it more North Korean sounding...isn't that what we're going for here?

In hindsight I see the the humor in my statement. Maybe they can kick it up a notch.

[Vangelovski]

I wonder what kind of mental gymnastics that same kind of person would have to do when looking in the mirror to convince themselves that their Macedonian and their country is still Macedonia.

500 euros a month's worth

[Tomche Makedonche]

Tomche,

We wont understand the new anthem, it will probably be in Albanian

Yep, it probably will.

I wonder how much pride those European northerners will display when they have to stand with their hand on their hearts singing about Macedonia, their anthem, in Albanian. I wonder what kind of mental gymnastics that same kind of person would have to do when looking in the mirror to convince themselves that their Macedonian and their country is still Macedonia.

[Rogi]

Tomche,

We wont understand the new anthem, it will probably be in Albanian

[Tomche Makedonche]

Denes nad Demokratska Evropska Narodna Republika Severna Makedonija....

Its catchy

Speaking of the elephant in the room, I wonder how they are going to go about changing the anthem?, will they just amend the existing lyrics?, or go with a new tune entirely?

Perhaps now amending the second verse as follows may be considered fitting to the establishment?

Odnovo sega znameto se vee,
na Severnata Republika!
Zoran Zaev, Ali Ahmeti,
Talat Xhaferi, Dimitrov!

[Phoenix]

Denes nad Demokratska Evropska Narodna Republika Severna Makedonija....

Its catchy

...just like antibiotic resistant gonorrhoea.

[Vangelovski]

I think the word European should be in there as well:

The Democratic European People’s Republic of North Macedonia

Just makes you want to sing songs about it...

Denes nad Demokratska Evropska Narodna Republika Severna Makedonija....

Its catchy

[Phoenix]

Interesting. I like it. Have you seen this seeded by some locals? They’ll need leaders to rise and shape such a movement.

...and that's where every good idea comes unstuck in Macedonia...an appalling lack of leadership.

[Tomche Makedonche]

They've already done this But they're doing it out of pure laziness, not opposition to RNMK. We really need to fit the words "Democratic" and "People's" into this name - that will make it more North Korean sounding...isn't that what we're going for here?

I think the word European should be in there as well:

The Democratic European People’s Republic of North Macedonia

Just makes you want to sing songs about it...

[Vangelovski]

If people want to boycott something, stop going to work, stop paying taxes, bring the country to a standstill.

They've already done this But they're doing it out of pure laziness, not opposition to RNMK. We really need to fit the words "Democratic" and "People's" into this name - that will make it more North Korean sounding...isn't that what we're going for here?

[Gocka]

Another boycott would be the most idiotic thing in the history of man.

I'm still not convinced that the original boycott "movement" wasn't orchestrated behind the scenes by SDSM. Because they came and went in a flash, not faces no names, after the referendum the "movement" was gone. What a coincidence its popping up again when there is yet again an opportunity to FUCK things up.

If people want to boycott something, stop going to work, stop paying taxes, bring the country to a standstill.

Everyone must vote, and they must vote for someone who will use the full power of the presidency to stop Zaev. Someone who will LEAD a resistance.

If Macedonians fuck this up again it may be the last nail in the coffin.

[sydney]

There's an increasing voice in Macedonia advocating for a boycott of the Presidential election. The strongest argument of which I have seen is the one saying electing a President of North Macedonia legitimises the name change. The counter is that Talat Xaferi will then assume the role for 6 months if no President is elected.

No matter how you play it, it's a no win situation.

It's time for the game to change, otherwise this looks like we're playing the game of the traitors and debating over the lesser evil.

If the word boycott can't shift to the word revolution, and given the passiveness of the nation it seems it can't, then at least the boycott voice should shift to an all out boycott of all institutions.

Boycott paying taxes to North Macedonia.
Boycott using ID that says North Macedonia.
Boycott the products and businesses of those involved in this treason.
Boycott going to the universities in North Macedonia.
Take your children out of schools in North Macedonia, refuse to let them learn from books written on the orders of a foreign nation (Greece).
Take your money out of the banks.
Pay cash only for all transactions, avoid all taxes.
Don't let any institution in North Macedonia see any money, any taxes from the people.

Force the Government into a situation where they have no revenue and no ability to borrow therefore no ability to pay the administration, the police, the MPs, etc.

It's easy enough, it doesn't affect peoples day to day life so the passive lazy nature of Macedonians plays well.

Don't boycott the Presidential elections, that wont achieve a win. Instead, boycott absolutely everything.

Interesting. I like it. Have you seen this seeded by some locals? They’ll need leaders to rise and shape such a movement.

[YuriB]

Can citizens vote from abroad?

Avoiding to vote (or participate in general) normally results in one's voice not being counted and increases the power of others.

[Rogi]

There's an increasing voice in Macedonia advocating for a boycott of the Presidential election. The strongest argument of which I have seen is the one saying electing a President of North Macedonia legitimises the name change. The counter is that Talat Xaferi will then assume the role for 6 months if no President is elected.

No matter how you play it, it's a no win situation.

It's time for the game to change, otherwise this looks like we're playing the game of the traitors and debating over the lesser evil.

If the word boycott can't shift to the word revolution, and given the passiveness of the nation it seems it can't, then at least the boycott voice should shift to an all out boycott of all institutions.

Boycott paying taxes to North Macedonia.
Boycott using ID that says North Macedonia.
Boycott the products and businesses of those involved in this treason.
Boycott going to the universities in North Macedonia.
Take your children out of schools in North Macedonia, refuse to let them learn from books written on the orders of a foreign nation (Greece).
Take your money out of the banks.
Pay cash only for all transactions, avoid all taxes.
Don't let any institution in North Macedonia see any money, any taxes from the people.

Force the Government into a situation where they have no revenue and no ability to borrow therefore no ability to pay the administration, the police, the MPs, etc.

It's easy enough, it doesn't affect peoples day to day life so the passive lazy nature of Macedonians plays well.

Don't boycott the Presidential elections, that wont achieve a win. Instead, boycott absolutely everything.

[Gocka]

Good points, Gocka. For how long have third parties in the US been trying to gain legitimacy in voters' eye -- whether its the Libertarians or the Greens. When the a couple of parties are deeply embedded in the fabric of government and politics, you need a massive amount of people to overcome that. Or, you need to be rich or famous or have some sort of reputable standing in the community to get the votes (I'm thinking Jesse Ventura in Minnesota getting elected to governor as 3rd party candidate). That usually doesn't guarantee the party any success -- once that individual is out of politics, it's back to the two parties.

It's not easy.

Like Phoenix said, the two party system dominates almost everywhere. The real test of a democracy though is whether you can actually affect those party structures and agendas when needed. In the USA the parties have gone through many major shifts over time. Look at the dramatic effect the tea party had on the Republicans, now look at Trump's effect. Look at how people like Bernie and Warren have pushed the Democrats further left. This is part of the ebb and flow of the system in the US.

In the US those shifts came about through shear will from the people. Massive amounts of people got behind these figures and movements and caused real change. The change isn't instant, but you can clearly see its progression.

In Macedonia its the opposite. The people wait for a political leader to set the agenda and they just follow along. Even when someone does come along, and there have been people who have tried, the people expect things to just happen without their participation. Where in the USA people will organize rallies and donate to campaigns, knock on doors to raise awareness, Macedonians just wait around for this magical figure to right all wrongs.

Macedonians don't understand democracy, mainly that it requires participation in many more ways than just voting in a few years. Especially when there is corruption and entrenched political parties. There is no self healing mechanism for the government, the only means of healing has to come through the will and actions of the people.