Russia, Ukraine and the West

[Risto the Great]

Fmr. US ambassador to the Soviet Union, Jack Matlock: “if Ukraine had been willing to abide by the Minsk agreement, recognize the Donbas as an autonomous entity within Ukraine, avoid NATO military advisors, and pledge not to enter NATO,” war “probably would have been prevented.”

https://twitter.com/aaronjmate/status/1582094274606563329?s=20&t=FswfIKakb9qKPK0Z_4CMAA

Don't you just hate it when little truths escape?

[Phoenix]

So, is the pro-Russian statement hiding a hope that if borders are possible to be changed for Russia, so can they be for Macedonia? Isn't it more likely that precedent will be used by countries like Albania/Kosovo to achieve this against Macedonia? Or even Bulgaria, who like Russia with Ukrainians, perceives Macedonians as mutilated Bulgarians?..

What Russia is doing in Ukraine is what nearly every powerful state does to its weaker neighbour(s) if sufficient self-interest exists.
As Mearsheimer states - "Might is Right".

The powerful don't adhere to international laws and the notion of human rights is a very fluid concept when one wields a disproportionate level of power over a weaker adversary.

Macedonia is a perfect example of this not so noble geo-political dynamic...Nobody commenting on this thread is stupid enough to believe that what Russia will get away with in Ukraine will somehow manifest itself in Macedonia...that would be to totally divorce oneself from reality.

[Risto the Great]

YuriB, you're the guy who disappears when it's your turn to buy a round of drinks. I won't bother.

[YuriB]

I love a nuanced discussion. We're not having one right now. Russians believe these lands are Russian. The rest of the world doesn't believe them. Macedonians believe Egej is Macedonian. The rest of the world doesn't believe them.

So, is the pro-Russian statement hiding a hope that if borders are possible to be changed for Russia, so can they be for Macedonia? Isn't it more likely that precedent will be used by countries like Albania/Kosovo to achieve this against Macedonia? Or even Bulgaria, who like Russia with Ukrainians, perceives Macedonians as mutilated Bulgarians?

What is the real risk assessment of the situation? Maybe 0.05% Macedonian speakers in Greece vs. 30% Albanian speakers in Macedonia vs, the Bulgarian nationalistic stories. And add the geopolitics/power/etc in the calculation. Plus NATO country vs NATO country means no NATO support.

Nevertheless, I can empathize to the sentiment/desire to an extent. I don't come from a refugee family myself but many Greeks from the ex Ottoman Empire do and they similarly refer to their lost homes, etc. At times I am thinking we would have all been better together, if we had just tried to reform the Ottoman empire instead of breaking it but..

[Soldier of Macedon]

JUST IN - Sweden blocks joint investigation with Germany and Denmark into Nord Stream explosions.

Sweden says the "safety classification of the investigation is too high" to share the result with other countries, Spiegel reports.

Read: Oops, we just found out our puppet musters are responsible, and we can't reveal it publicly.

[Carlin]

JUST IN - Sweden blocks joint investigation with Germany and Denmark into Nord Stream explosions.

Sweden says the "safety classification of the investigation is too high" to share the result with other countries, Spiegel reports.

[Carlin]

.. and winter is coming

https://mobile.twitter.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1579923863471034368

[Carlin]

Rumors that something 'Big' is expected in the coming days by Russia. Missile strikes were just the start of a "new phase". Russians bombarded several cities overnight.

"Russia's victory in the conflict in Ukraine will be a defeat for NATO, this CANNOT be allowed", Alliance Secretary General Stoltenberg said.

Senator Vladimir Dzhabarov in response to Stoltenberg that NATO is ready for nuclear threat from RF wrote: “Is the NATO Secretary General right in the head? In the event of a nuclear conflict, his beloved Norway will end up deserted rocks. What kind of idiocy is this?”

S. Lavrov: "There is more and more information that regular military personnel from the United States and European countries are constantly working directly in Ukraine. De facto Americans have been participating for a long time in the conflict in Ukraine... U.S. has long been de facto involved in war in Ukraine."

[Carlin]

Terror on Crimea Bridge forces Russia to unleash Shock’n Awe

https://thecradle.co/Article/Columns/16704

[Carlin]

All foreign embassies in Kiev have been ordered to evacuate their staff immediately. Reports that the German consulate was struck.

[Carlin]

Massive Russian strikes with long-range precision weapons on the objects of military command and control systems, communications and energy in Ukraine

(Zelensky was urgently evacuated to a secret bunker in western Ukraine according to media reports, the President of Ukraine, amid rocket attacks on the capital and other major cities, was urgently taken out of Kiev and sent to one of the secret bomb shelters in western Ukraine)

https://mobile.twitter.com/Ukraine66251776/status/1579437038964965379?cxt=HHwWhoDQycznpOsrAAAA

https://mobile.twitter.com/Ukraine66251776/status/1579390264602681345?cxt=HHwWgoDTtfzEj-srAAAA

https://mobile.twitter.com/Ukraine66251776/status/1579352049266806789?cxt=HHwWisCq_cWU_uorAAAA

https://mobile.twitter.com/Ukraine66251776/status/1579349045071712256?cxt=HHwWgMDQ_dbl_OorAAAA

Summary:

Results of missile strikes as of 13:10
(expanded list)

The cities struck were:
- Kiev
- Dnepropetrovsk
- Kharkiv
- Zaporozhye
- Ternopil
- Odessa
- Krivoy Rog
- Lviv
- Zhytomyr
- Rivne
- Mykolaiv
- Krapivnitskiy
- Kremenchuk
- Konotop

Strikes on important objects:
- SBU Headquarters (Kiev)
- CHPP-5 (Kyiv)
- TEC-6 (Kyiv)
- Lviv CHPP (Lviv)
- Burshtyn TPS (Ivano-Frankivsk oblast)
- EU Advisory Mission (Kyiv)
- Department of Law Enforcement Agencies (Kyiv)

Underground in Kyiv and Kharkiv stopped.

The lights went out:
- Lviv
- Zhytomyr
- Sumy
- Kharkov
- Khmelnitsky
- Poltava
- Ternopil
- Lutsk
- Rivne
- Ivano-Frankivsk

Many towns in Ukraine have problems with water supply and internet.

- From @Slavyangrad Telegram channel

[Vangelovski]

Hate to nit pick Vangelovski but you incorrectly attributed a quote to me which I didn't make. I didn't say anything about things being grey. I stand by my "MSM Whores" comment, however. The classic, mostly peaceful BLM riots news report comes to mind while the building behind that particular MSM whore was burning right behind him. Then there was the Covid news reporting of the last two years which really clinched it for me as far as fair and impartial news reporting goes by mainstream news outlets.

Apologies if I've misquoted you.

[Karposh]

Hate to nit pick Vangelovski but you incorrectly attributed a quote to me which I didn't make. I didn't say anything about things being grey. I stand by my "MSM Whores" comment, however. The classic, mostly peaceful BLM riots news report comes to mind while the building behind that particular MSM whore was burning right behind him. Then there was the Covid news reporting of the last two years which really clinched it for me as far as fair and impartial news reporting goes by mainstream news outlets.

[Risto the Great]

Here’s a little snippet:
Sounds like most people posting in this thread think the “MSM” is “COMPLETELY full of shit”.

Nice how you added a few statements made after your original post.
But you did finish your first dick swing in the park by saying this:

If everything were a lie, then we couldn't even trust that a war was actually happening.

You went from suggesting everyone here thought everything was a lie and then made your "un-grey" conclusion that we intellectual peasants couldn't possibly trust that a war was even happening. It's cute in a mentally unhinged way.

Really? I’ve never seen you actually have one. It’s the just one liners.

If I had some kind of government job where they pay me based on the colour of my cardigan, I would find more time. But my business does require me to work for my money. Any minute I spend rambling with impossibly autistic people merely reduces that time. Plus, I have better things to do. My life is great in the old folks home. My biggest problem here is those hot babes with dementia keep forgetting how good I am in bed.

I agree that the Russians genuinely believe those are Russian territories. But there is the historical record. That tells us otherwise. Happy to have that discussion, if you can manage more than one line on it.

Greeks show us their historical records all the time. In any case, I do believe Ukranians have a distinct national identity. Putin was rambling about how the Ukrainians don't have a national identity. We have heard it all before. Nope, nothing to discuss. I am gonna watch the news. Apparently Putin bombed his gas lines. Crazy bastard.

[Carlin]

If the invasion Of Iraq was legal, why is the Russian invasion of Ukraine illegal? @AndersFoghR Former Prime Minister of Denmark.

https://twitter.com/BRI_SL/status/1577130485548912641