Financial Crisis in Greece

[makedonche]

What consequences Makedonche ? Consequences as a Regional impact ? Or even Global in some cases ? Good. This is the card that should be used right now.

For Greece it cant get any worse at this point. The only thing that would be worse is to follow your suggestion in selling off our assets.
Why the heck would we want to do that ? Our assets belong to the Greek ppl, and to Greece. Maybe next time around it will actually be used in a proper manner to benefit this country and ppl.

Default and start over. That is the only way. If it ruffles some feathers, what can I say. Fuck em.

Voltron
Consequences- nobody will trust Greece again, it will be cash up front or in advance for imported products, no futher credit for many years to come - these then lead to futher consequences of hardship and poverty for the bulk of the average Greek citizens - and that's just the tip of the iceberg!
Default is the dishonourable way and will leave the next 2 generations of Greeks to pay for the mistakes of the few, this will lead to a mass exodus of youth and qualified people and leave the country financially crippled for many years to come.
An honourable course of action would be to acknowledge and accept the debt, strip all those multi millionaires/billionaires of all assets and cash accumulated by dubious means, reduce the debt as quickly as possible by as much as possible, return to the drachma and devalue the currency to promote far easier trading terms and make it cheaper for foreigners to invest and visit Greece, make friends with all neighbours and set balanced trade agreements and mutual diplomatic relations - then you can sell all your military hardware which is costing billions and is not required- given Greece's status in NATO.
I could go on and on and give you far more suggestions but I fear my words "like silent raindrops fall"(simon & garfunkel), which is currently the greatest danger to Greece, it is that mentality which you currently display that got Greece into this mess and will put it into an even greater mess if Greece does not accept an honourable way to solve it's problems.

[SirGeorge8600]

Debate topic: is the European populist form of socialist-democracy the reason Greece and it's citizens cannot swallow austerity?

[Bill77]

Look out voltron, here comes the Macedonians

Greece changes Ownership Laws, Macedonians Buying...

Macedonian nationals have already started to buy property in Greece in accordance with the new act that the southern Macedonia’s neighbour has enforced. Citizens who do not live in Greece are from now on allowed to buy real estate there.

Macedonians are very interested in buying property in Greece, confirm law firms and real estate agencies in Solun. They think Macedonian nationals want to become owners of land and villas in Halkidiki, Greece, even more so then in Ohrid, especially because of the fact that prices in Greece are dropping due to the debt crisis and the fact that Greeks cannot obtain loans at the moment.

Macedonians are mostly looking for apartments near a beach, for which they offer from EUR 40,000 to EUR 60,000. Real estate agents claim these prices are not realistic. The value of real estate in Greece has dropped by 30 percent, expected to go down further.
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/18564/45/

Be afraid voltron.......Be very afraid.

[George S.]

the land is so cheap in greece you might find yourself surrounded by macedonian neighbours voltron maybe even turkish.You might be just lucky & get gobbled up in the process & get assimilated!

[Voltron]

Look out voltron, here comes the Macedonians

Be afraid voltron.......Be very afraid.

40 to 60K by the beach ?

If thats the case im packing my bags and moving tommorrow.
I dont have a problem with Macedonians in which case it would be a nice change from the Pakis, Kurds and other Central Asians I see here.

[George S.]

Voltron just because the country is small 12 million people doesn't really mean much because there are other countries that are smaller because the've got more resources behind them.Also if greece does not pay her way in the eu they can expect to be booted out i read that there will be plans for greece to go back to their drachmas & not have eu$$.

[Risto the Great]

Debate topic: is the European populist form of socialist-democracy the reason Greece and it's citizens cannot swallow austerity?

Greece questionably "invented democracy" according to Dora. But there is no question their entire government runs on populism and the Greeks love it. Austerity cannot be embraced in Greece because there is no leadership there. Every citizen has the (justified) belief that the politicians are first in line for the rorts and will not accept any reduction in their "personal rorts".

[Soldier of Macedon]

40 to 60K by the beach ?

If thats the case im packing my bags and moving tommorrow..

That's what I thought

I dont have a problem with Macedonians in which case it would be a nice change from the Pakis, Kurds and other Central Asians I see here.

You've got to have someone to hate, don't you mate? Lol.

[Onur]

Euro crisis, Italy next?

While everyone was thinking about Portugal will be the next one after Greece, Italy has shown signs of a start of a major crisis. Yesterday, Italian stock market dropped 4% and it`s been said that there was a secret meeting in Brussels about Italy`s economy.

Euro plunged into crisis as contagion hits Italy

European finance ministers were struggling last night to persuade nervous markets that Italy will not be the next domino to fall in the eurozone's apparently endless succession of sovereign debt crises.

But this time is different, as the saying goes: unlike Greece, Portugal and Ireland, the sheer size of Italy's economy and the scale of her debts are way beyond the resources of the current EU/IMF rescue funds, and probably any conceivable new arrangements.

An Italian sovereign debt crisis, as observers and policy makers have long quietly feared, could quickly mutate into an existential crisis for the euro itself, probably spread via Europe's highly integrated and vulnerable banking system. French banks in particular are thought to be badly exposed to Italy, as they are to Greece.

As talk of "contagion" mounted, Italian government bonds suffered the same kind of abandonment seen before in the cases of Greek, Portuguese and Irish sovereign debt. The spread between 10-year Italian and benchmark German Bunds – a reliable indicator of how secure investors feel about lending to a government – reached a new euro-era record of 285 basis points before easing back to 269 points by mid-afternoon.

However, that is still below the 300 basis points spread on Spanish debt, and the notional 1,700 points demanded by investors to lend to Athens.

The interest rate on a 10-year Italian bond was 5.5 per cent, while the rate on the German equivalent, considered the safest in the eurozone, traded at 2.81 per cent.

Shares in Italian and other banks were especially targeted: the Milan market fell 4 per cent, with Fiat Industrial, Intesa SanPaolo Bank and Telecom Italia among the worst performers. The "contagion" spread back towards other markets – Portugal's Banco Espirito Santo lost 4.9 per cent, BNP Paribas 4.5 per cent and Société Générale 4.2 per cent of their market values. RBS was down 2.9 per cent and Barclays 2.1 per cent.

The proximate cause of the panic was a rumour about the poor prospects of Italy's banks – which hold the bulk of her sovereign debt – passing the "stress tests" being conducted by European regulators, the results of which will be published on Friday. This was given traction over the weekend by a leak that Italy's travails were due to be discussed by European finance ministers meeting in Brussels today.

Ministerial assurances seem to have done more harm than good. Wolfgang Schäuble, the German finance minister, said: "I have no doubt that Italy will take the right decisions. That's all. It's the usual excitement before such meetings. It shouldn't be taken too seriously, Italy is on the right path."

Perhaps oblivious to the meltdown in the markets, ministers instead concentrated on how to persuade private bond holders of Greek debt to participate in a voluntary roll-over of their bonds, in such a way as to avoid even a technical or "selective" default.

As the third largest nation in the single currency area and with a GDP approximately the size of the UK, Italy would be "too big to save". While her 4.9 per cent annual budget deficit is modest, at almost 120 per cent of GDP, Italy's total national debt rivals Greece's for unsustainability.

Tuesday, 12 July 2011

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/bu...y-2312229.html

Every analysts are absolutely sure that neither EU nor IMF has sufficient funds to rescue a giant economy as Italy if it falls in to an abyss like Greek. So, a crisis in Italy means sudden collapse of Euro zone.




Italy has about ~400 billion dollars loans money from French banks. So, that means if Italy cannot pay back this, then France goes in crisis too!!! cuz it`s obvious that they wont able to get any money from Greece either.

[George S.]

as far as i can remember the eu was only prepared to bail out only up to the 500billion euros & stop bailouts at that point.Kooks like italy is heading into a massive debt as coupled with other countries who cannot possibly handle the repayments.

[vojnik]

Last time I checked which was a while ago Italy was 1.1 Trillion in debt

[George S.]

vojnik if it's 1.1 trillion i think they all are going to be that much debt ridden that the'll defalt.There won't be any eu to join for macedonia.

[makedonche]

vojnik if it's 1.1 trillion i think they all are going to be that much debt ridden that the'll defalt.There won't be any eu to join for macedonia.

George S
Hopefully not!!!!! Neka puknai pret da vlezime!

[vojnik]

I remember reading the newspaper in aus might have been the telegraph months ago and it had a pie chart of the debt in the EU. Italy had the biggest share at 1.1trillion followed by Spain and Portugal.

[Vangelovski]

According to the graph above Italy is now $1.8 trillion in debt.