Financial Crisis in Greece

[Mastika]

next time say something worthwhile or shut up. PM fuck that, i don't chat with Bulgars. you have anything to say to me say it here. Aslong as its not shit.

I have nothing to say to you on pm. If you want a discussion excluding certain users, then take IT to pm, that is what I was reffering to (not a discussion with myself). All these false Bulgar accusations which you keep bringing up are an example of some of the shit that you just reffered to.

[Bill77]

Yes, I am aware that it is a joke..

Realy??? then why asume i was serious whats with your atitude

What a moronic thing to say..

Nobody started homosexuality nor paedophilia.

But i thought you were aware it was a joke. So why try and justify a comment that was a joke. Moron. Tell me, why did the chicken cross the road?

Sadly many people actually believe stuff like that to be true..

Yeh you are the wise one that knew it was a joke and everyone else will take it literally. Moron

Just like you I am free to comment on any part of this forum..

Hey Bulgar, like i said, next time you question me say something worthwhile rather than talking shit, How would you say "Talk Shit" in Bulgarian?

if you want a private discussion take it to pm..

well take your own advise next time before you jump in on mine and Mr Spartans discusion. He used my name on the public forum which i was entited to respond, he publicly ridiculed me, i will scorn him publicly aswell. Is that ok moron? are you an admin all of a sudden.

[Bill77]

alo alo what have we got here? A Turkish Rambo?
How you going kardashi? Buried alive any disrespectfull daughters that kissed the boy next door lately?.

And rightfully so, we get a response from a disgusted Fellow Greek of Sportster,

The death of the girl in Turkey does not indicate the entire culture and behaviour of a country. This could have happened anywhere........
Turks are neither hanging from trees, Sporster, nor living in caves. Furthermore, Greece is no longer what ancient Greece used to be. Greeks are proud only for the past (to which there is no direct connection) and not about their present. Is it now a democratic country? What an irony for the "founders" of democracy...

However, this is a forum regarding Macedonia and not a personal conflict between Sporster and Onur regarding Greece and Turkey.

At the begining, i was quite tough on you John. But this reply has changed my whole outlook on you now. You have won my respect dude


Then saddly, only after sportster was banned,

@SoM I do not agree with everything sportster says..

I will agree that he wasnt being very nice..

I supose better late than never.




But then i read this,

I dont see why I am obligated to point this out to him..

ummmm he made some disgustingly sick comments, (Well atleast John thought so). if you are a man of integrity and cared for the way Greeks are negatively perceived, you should have said something, Obviously timing is no issue,You are quick to respond to onur and myself.

[fyrOM]

The eu is basically a marriage between France an Germany so France threatening divorce over the bastard child Greece shows where allegiances lie. France has played her part in setting up Greece and her maintenance over time in history. Germany is looking more like the poor step parent having to support the excesses of their partners kid. Supporting your partners kid is important but everything has its limits and maybe supporting them to the nth degree will crash the eus precarious position in due course. Sometimes if its going to lead to crash anyway getting out earlier is more prudent. In any event it has probably cost Merkel her job at the next election. Keep up the pressure German Maks.

Zapatero: Sarkozy has threatened to leave the eurozone to save Greece

http://www.idividi.com.mk/vesti/evropa/601331/index.html

Madrid, May 14, 2010 (Reuters) - French President Nicolas Sarkozy has threatened that France would leave the euro area to force Germany to take a rescue plan for Greece, says the Spanish prime minister José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero.

According to the newspaper "Pais", which is close to the ruling Socialists, Zapatero said this on Wednesday to meet with leaders of his Spanish Socialist Workers Party.

Last Friday, Sarkozy asked "commitment from all Member States to help Greece, each according to their abilities, otherwise France would prerazgleda their position in the euro area.

Heads of states and governments of the euro area gathered last Friday in Brussels to approve the plan for aid to Greece worth 110 billion euros in loans from the EU and the IMF over the next three years. The decision to rescue Greece from bankruptcy was not delivered easily, mostly because of dislike of Germany.

- Sarkozy struck a fist on the table and threatened to abandon the euro izvrtuvajkji it to the way the hand of German Chancellor Angela Merkel said one of the senior officials of the Spanish Socialist Workers Party, citing the words of Zapatero.

[Spartan]

lets get one thing straight homosexuality is not evil nor is it exclusive to greek men. in the ancient world it was practiced by most of the warrior societies including romans macedonians celts germans etc etc.

Thank-you Osiris for providing such a logical response to this illogocal line of discussion.

ummmm he made some disgustingly sick comments, (Well atleast John thought so).

So tell him.

cared for the way Greeks are negatively perceived

I dont care how you percieve Greeks...your buisiness.

you should have said something,

If you have a problem with something...speak up....what does this have to do with me?

[Spartan]

and you want to play pathetic child games

Bravo malaka!!!!
Coming from someone who posts like this after hes made to look the fool....again



and this



and this

You forgot to mention Pedafilia was also rampant. Hmmmm is that something else Greeks gave to the world?

And this gem here should be your sig....

I apoligise to MTO and its administrators. I want to make it clear to everyone that what i post does not represent the peoples views here on the Macedonian Truth Forum.

This way, it will follow every post you make, and thus eliminate the MTO from any association with your comments whatsoever..... Im sure the admins will be VERY greatful!!!!

[Mastika]

But i thought you were aware it was a joke. So why try and justify a comment that was a joke. Moron. Tell me, why did the chicken cross the road?

well take your own advise next time before you jump in on mine and Mr Spartans discusion. He used my name on the public forum which i was entited to respond, he publicly ridiculed me, i will scorn him publicly aswell. Is that ok moron? are you an admin all of a sudden.

Listen here, I have enough of a moral conscience to know that making jokes/accusations involving paedophilia are not on. It is very sad that people can even think of using the painful experience of paedophilia as an attempt at making a cheap shot at someone on an internet forum, regardless of what nationality/religion/whatever they are. Maybe you have not had any dealings with victims of paedophilia or the effects of what it has caused, this would probably explain your lack of sensitivity to the issue. What is even sadder is that you are justifying what you said because it was a 'joke', I can think of many offensive jokes ranging from Jews to African-Americans, however it doesn't mean that they need to be repeated. Hopefully you will think twice next time you choose to use the disgusting and distrautful act which is paedophilia as a way of making your point on a internet forum.

BTW. you and spartan are just two people involved in the discussion, all members are invited to partake on the thread. Defending accusations is fine, I dont have a problem with anyone doing that, bringing paedophilia into the discussion, is not fine.

[The LION will ROAR]

GO GREECE GO!! RIOTS UP FRONT AND PERSONAL!!



Listen to the CNN reporter at 1:40sec...this is the reason why they are rioting....

[fyrOM]

Fantastic the truth is getting out but has anyone seen anything like this reporting in mainstream tv in Australia. No better not upset the Greeks. The protectionism they have received both in Australia and around the world is amazing. Its as if the Greeks have something on the west and they’re holding it over them.

[Phoenix]

when does organized, nationwide, violent protest actually become 'civil war'...?

[Bill77]

Argentina to Greece: You are $crewed


Monday, 17 May 2010
Gregorio Lopez has a message for the Greek workers who are protesting deep cuts in salaries and pensions that come with an international, trillion-dollar rescue package: You're on your own.


Lopez and his fellow employees at the Lavalan wool-processing factory worked for a year without pay after Argentina's economy imploded in 2001 and the country defaulted on a record $95 billion debt.

But Greece is 10 times smaller than Argentina with 5 times higher debt. To make matters worse, Greece is under impression they are being 'saved' by the EU, when the EU is simply saving its own Banks (Dutch, German, French...) operating in Greece who in turn will finance Athens.


The Argentinians endured blows from riot police to keep creditors from carting off the equipment. In the end, they had to take over the factory and form a worker-run cooperative to save their jobs.

"It was really ugly," Lopez said. "We didn't have support from anybody — not the government, not even the union. ... Our only way out was to do it ourselves."



Argentina also had to go it alone after failing to make the deep, and somewhat insane cuts demanded by the International Monetary Fund to secure more loans. The country in 2001 was in many ways where Greece and other southern European nations are today, with its economy sputtering, companies failing and huge debts coming due. But instead of a trillion-dollar rescue to keep Greece from defaulting, Argentina got a cold shoulder from lender (which is why Argentina survived!).

While Europe's rescue package announced this week has at least postponed the worst — a domino effect of defaults across Europe that could drag down the euro and even break up the European Union (would be the best thing for the continent) — Argentina ran out of options. It defaulted and had to figure out how to rebuild its economy without outside help.

But in its isolation, the country boomed (as expected). Usually countries do prosper when EU/US banksters don't meddle. By boosting government spending to stimulate the economy, Argentina increased its GDP by more than 50 percent since 2003, and now plans to emerge from default by resolving the last of its bad debts.

President Cristina Fernandez says Argentina's experience shows that austerity measures are exactly the wrong medicine in a debt crisis, which is why Europe's rescue plan is "condemned to failure."

"You don't need to be an economist to know that if you reduce the flow of economic activity, you reduce even more the capacity to pay the debt," Fernandez said in a national address this week. "It's clear that you won't be able to pay what you're being lent."

An Argentian Govt. official has been quoted as saying "You sign with the IMF and you seal your future as a country.", however his statement was quickly removed from the Associated Press.


Even supporters of Europe's rescue package say Greece, Portugal, Spain and other overly indebted European countries now face years of wage cuts, increased taxes and living with less to have a chance of avoiding national bankruptcy.

http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/14416/53/

[The LION will ROAR]

Great Article...

Another example.. who has rescued Macedonia in it's times of needs..?
Yet they've done the opposite, divided the country and it's people..
They tried to remove the existence of Macedonia
Macedonia had no support from it's Neighbours or from the rest of the world..
Macedonia had virtual no economy, still till today people don't get paid for months and at high 35% unemployment…yet you don't see Macedonians protesting and acting like animals like our spoilt southern Neighbours..
Yet we still survive...Why..? Because we are Macedonians and we been through tougher and harder times then this...we will continue to survive as Macedonians and no one can take that from us..

[julie]

agreed, and that is because we all have the spirit and the will and strength of the lion

[Makedonetz]

Argentina to Greece: You are $crewed

HA HA Bravo Argentina
Gregorio Lopez has a message for the Greek workers who are protesting deep cuts in salaries and pensions that come with an international, trillion-dollar rescue package: You're on your own.

Lopez and his fellow employees at the Lavalan wool-processing factory worked for a year without pay after Argentina's economy imploded in 2001 and the country defaulted on a record $95 billion debt.

But Greece is 10 times smaller than Argentina with 5 times higher debt. To make matters worse, Greece is under impression they are being 'saved' by the EU, when the EU is simply saving its own Banks (Dutch, German, French...) operating in Greece who in turn will finance Athens.

The Argentinians endured blows from riot police to keep creditors from carting off the equipment. In the end, they had to take over the factory and form a worker-run cooperative to save their jobs.

"It was really ugly," Lopez said. "We didn't have support from anybody — not the government, not even the union. ... Our only way out was to do it ourselves."Argentina also had to go it alone after failing to make the deep, and somewhat insane cuts demanded by the International Monetary Fund to secure more loans. The country in 2001 was in many ways where Greece and other southern European nations are today, with its economy sputtering, companies failing and huge debts coming due. But instead of a trillion-dollar rescue to keep Greece from defaulting, Argentina got a cold shoulder from lender (which is why Argentina survived!).

While Europe's rescue package announced this week has at least postponed the worst — a domino effect of defaults across Europe that could drag down the euro and even break up the European Union (would be the best thing for the continent) — Argentina ran out of options. It defaulted and had to figure out how to rebuild its economy without outside help.

But in its isolation, the country boomed (as expected). Usually countries do prosper when EU/US banksters don't meddle. By boosting government spending to stimulate the economy, Argentina increased its GDP by more than 50 percent since 2003, and now plans to emerge from default by resolving the last of its bad debts.

President Cristina Fernandez says Argentina's experience shows that austerity measures are exactly the wrong medicine in a debt crisis, which is why Europe's rescue plan is "condemned to failure."

"You don't need to be an economist to know that if you reduce the flow of economic activity, you reduce even more the capacity to pay the debt," Fernandez said in a national address this week. "It's clear that you won't be able to pay what you're being lent."

An Argentian Govt. official has been quoted as saying "You sign with the IMF and you seal your future as a country.", however his statement was quickly removed from the Associated Press.

Even supporters of Europe's rescue package say Greece, Portugal, Spain and other overly indebted European countries now face years of wage cuts, increased taxes and living with less to have a chance of avoiding national bankruptcy.

[Makedonetz]

Greece Aid

Slovenians and Brazil coming to aid to these idiots!
e have received enquiries of who are Greece's financiers. Well, you requested it, you get it.

List of countries and the amounts some of them have unwillingly allocated to save Greece's economy who solely is dependent on receiving financial aid from the European Union.

Germany will allocate 22.4 billion euros (8.4 billion in the first year). Merkel was categorically against giving aid to Athens (bowed to pressure) and has already paid for this by losing regional elections.

France has allocated 16.8 billion (6.3b in first year).

Spain who itself is in deep trouble will give 9.79 billion euros (3.63b in first year).

Holland will allocate 4.8 billion euros (1.8b in first year).

Flemish speakers in Belgium after paying the social benefits for the unemployed French will now shell out 3 billion Euros for the koine speakers in Athens (1b in first year).

Not sure how this happened, but Portugal was forced to shell out 2.06 billion (775m in first year) Euros to save Greece. Portugal will pay the money because they were promised the same in case Athens happens to them.
Ironically, even Slovenia will give 384 million euros to help Greece. Slovenia, whose citizens earn an average salary of 934 euros will finance Greece in order to save the salaries there.

Brasil, who is relatively poor country will dip in its state reserve and issue a check of 226 million euros to Greece. Actually the check will go to the IMF, because Brazil is one of IMF's creditors. But eventually, IMF will issue the check to Athens.

There are other countries on this list, 25 more whose financial help ranges from 10 to 200 million.