Nikola Gruevski

[Risto the Great]

Actually, you're right...he did accept it after if was chosen for him...

I think he needs to choose a new avatar. I have some aboriginal friends that find his choice of avatar offensive.

fyrOM, you have been ordered to change your avatar. The symbol you presently use is not yours to use. It must be changed within 24 hours or else it will be changed for you.

[Vangelovski]

I think he needs to choose a new avatar. I have some aboriginal friends that find his choice of avatar offensive.

fyrOM, you have been ordered to change your avatar. The symbol you presently use is not yours to use. It must be changed within 24 hours or else it will be changed for you.

I don't think it will bother him too much. He has argued in favour of "relative" rights for himself. So, taking the path of least resistance (fyrOM), I think we can make your friends happy.

[Risto the Great]

Striving for mediocrity

http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/18270/45/

Gruevski asked why for years the SDSM had scolded VMRO for their strong stance regarding a referendum for the name negotiations and now all of a sudden they accept it as well!? Why change the mind now? Gruevski also told the social democrats not to worry about money, i.e. how will the Government be able to fund all of their projects. "Macedonia has plenty of money, if politicians don't steal them" added Gruevski.

Gruevski, a strong stance entails asserting the Macedonian identity at every level. Not saying it will be changed only by referendum. Woeful state of affairs!

The modern Macedonian must have such an embarrassing chip on their shoulder. Thank God I am an older Macedonian.

[makalek]

Risto the Great, I get what you are saying but isn't Gruevski right?

You have SDSM who continue to go to Brussels and other European capitals and blast VMRO by saying they are at fault as to why the name issue is not resolved. Zoran Zaev, a vice-president in their party, said SDSM is against a compromise and a name with a geographical qualifier is acceptable for them. Then for the elections, they change their stance and said they will also endorse a referendum. They have been very inconsistent regarding the name issue and have accused VMRO of fake patriotism.

Parties can have disagreements but they MUST agree on issues that are of huge state and national interests. The parties in Greece hate each other but they all have the same stance regarding the name issue. Unfortunately, that is not the case in Macedonia where SDSM is putting their party interests ahead of the interests of the country.

[Vangelovski]

makalek,

I think you are missing the point. We should not even be thinking, let alone planning for, about a referendum. This matter is for the Macedonian people only. It is not appropriate to hold a referendum in reponse to the Greek insistence that we change our state name.

[makalek]

makalek,

I think you are missing the point. We should not even be thinking, let alone planning for, about a referendum. This matter is for the Macedonian people only. It is not appropriate to hold a referendum in reponse to the Greek insistence that we change our state name.

Vangelovski, what you are saying sounds good but it is simply not realistic. Our country is surrounded by enemies and all citizens in Macedonia strive for NATO and EU membership. One of the only things that brings together Macedonians and Albanians is the prospect of EU and NATO membership. If any party in Macedonia says the name negotiations are over, that party just committed political suicide and they would be done on the political scene.

People in Macedonia look at NATO and EU membership as a way to better their lives by being able to attract more foreign investment. The EU is the biggest economy in the world and NATO guarantees to protect the borders of all their members so there are obvious benefits in being a member of each organization.

For example, during these elections, SDSM has been using examples of how much foreign investment Bulgaria, Albania, and Croatia have gotten following their NATO membership as opposed to Macedonia. They mentioned all these European money available once you enter these negotiations. Every party has made entering NATO and EU as the number one priority. The people are being manipulated on some facts but they all agree that Macedonia MUST become a member of NATO and the EU. It doesn't matter whether people over there are rich or poor, young or old, they all agree that the future of Macedonia depends on whether we become members of NATO and the EU.

Unfortunately, NATO and the EU have rules where all members must unanimously approve the entrance of new member countries. Greece has been using this position to basically blackmail Macedonia by dictating what name we can call out country. VMRO-DPMNE has stood up to Greece and will not accept Greece to blackmail Macedonia. Macedonia has met all conditions to become a NATO member and received two consecutive positive assessments from the European Commission that Macedonia is ready to begin EU negotiations. However, this has not occurred because of the blockades by Greece.

It would be easy for VMRO to accept a compromise and say we were the party that brought Macedonia to NATO and the EU which would make them even more popular in Macedonia but they have decided to remain firm on their stance and not to accept blackmail from Greece. They have been criticized for their stubbornness and patriotism but they do not want Macedonia to enter these organizations with a name dictated by Greece. It has become basically a prerequisite for Macedonia to reach a solution with Greece in order to become members in these two organizations. VMRO then called for a referendum by saying politicians come and go but the people will have to live with the decision forever so they must have their say on this important issue.

This is VMRO's stance after reading their program for the upcoming elections:

They will not accept anything that will change the constitution so Republic of Macedonia will remain the constitutional name that will be used domestically. The identity and language are not negotiable and they are not even willing to discuss that. The new name will only be used in international organizations to replace FYROM. Other countries around the world will then decide whether to use the constitutional name during communications or the new name that was agreed for international organizations. The party will not accept a name with a geographical qualifier like Northern Macedonia. They don't view that acceptable since it will open up more questions but a possible solution would be a name like Republic of Macedonia (Skopje). Any name that is agreed by the two countries will then be put on a referendum for the citizens to decide.

I see Nikola Gruevski receives a lot of criticism on this forum but just think about who our enemies support and despise? Why do you think Greece desperately wants Gruevski to lose these upcoming elections? If he was such an enemy to our country, why is he so hated in Greece? They see that he won't back down and will not accept for Macedonia to get blackmailed by accepting a name that Greece wants us to have. Their position is weakening with their financial problems and many countries are getting tired of their inept politicians. We must stay patient and continue to build good relations with other countries around the world.

Greece wants SDSM to win because they know they can bully that party because they lack leadership. During the early years of our country, Crvenkovski demanded for the Serbian anthem to be sung ahead of the Macedonian anthem. Crvenkovski is a criminal who wants to return in power in order to put more money in his pockets. He privatized companies during his time and many people close to him got very rich while thousands of Macedonians lost their jobs. Corruption and organized criminal was rampant during that time. Many people who were critical of him were killed in suspicious ways and many Macedonians left the country to seek work and a better life abroad. Simply put, he doesn't care about Macedonia and only cares about himself and the people close to him.

That is why all parties must have the same stance on the name issue. It is normal to have disagreements in parliament but all parties must have the same stance on state and national interests such as the name issue. It only strengthens your position but instead we have SDSM who blame the current government as to why the name issue is not resolved as opposed to blaming Greece. They are weakening our position with their inconsistent stance on this important issue. It is important for SDSM to reform and get rid of politicians like Crvenkovski, Sekerinska, and Jani Makraduli.

[Vangelovski]

Makalek,

You are one of those people who have missed all of the discussions in relation to the matters you have just raised, and are parroting them all over again as if you are the first to think of them. Everything you have written has already been addressed.

In fact you sound a lot like a former poster by the name of fyrOM.

[makalek]

Makalek,

You are one of those people who have missed all of the discussions in relation to the matters you have just raised, and are parroting them all over again as if you are the first to think of them. Everything you have written has already been addressed.

In fact you sound a lot like a former poster by the name of fyrOM.

Well, I'm definitely not fyrOM. You can check my IP address if you want.

Look, I understand the views of some of the posters on this forum but we have different opinions on certain issues and that is normal in any discussion.

I am stating my opinion. There is no question that we are in a difficult situation. We are the only country that is being asked to chance the country's name in order to enter organizations. Picture yourself as a politician in this situation. It's pretty much a lose-lose situation. Change the country's name to enter NATO and the EU, people will be mad at you and accuse you of being a sellout or don't solve the issue and remain out of NATO and the EU, people will get mad at you and accuse you of living in the past. I'm just trying to point out that it's not as easy as saying let's get out of the name negotiations. A politician works for the people so how can a politician end the negotiations which means an end to our aspirations to join NATO and the EU which is what the majority of the people want.

[Louis Riel]

makalek

This is VMRO's stance after reading their program for the upcoming elections:

They will not accept anything that will change the constitution so Republic of Macedonia will remain the constitutional name that will be used domestically. The identity and language are not negotiable and they are not even willing to discuss that. The new name will only be used in international organizations to replace FYROM. Other countries around the world will then decide whether to use the constitutional name during communications or the new name that was agreed for international organizations. The party will not accept a name with a geographical qualifier like Northern Macedonia. They don't view that acceptable since it will open up more questions but a possible solution would be a name like Republic of Macedonia (Skopje). Any name that is agreed by the two countries will then be put on a referendum for the citizens to decide

This is in their manifesto?

[George S.]

I can't beleive what people are saying that we should commit suicide by changing our name just to pliease greece & the eu.This has been discuissed ad naseaum with ct and other threads that it's not the best way to get to the eu & we know the eu is collapsing all around itself.So why does macedonia want the eu so much.It thinks it's going to get prosperity but the actual truth it's going to suffer as the eu is not going to be so well as people think.
Why are people in such a rush to change their name i suppose the y can appropriate all the macedonian glory to the greeksI have heard all the arguments & counterarguments & they all dont make sense.Why are we doing it we want the easy so called road.
Why not be smart about it & make your own way in the world instead of compromise & capitulation when 130 or so nations around the world recognize macedonia under her proper name.

[George S.]

Actually you are right isn't it a coincidence that fyrom missed the discussions & he was recommending to someone to change his ip address & now he has changed his name to malalek.Or is it misspelt malaka!!
Typical of Fyrom.I bet he is going to deny that he's fyrom.Wolf in sheeps clothing.

[makalek]

makalek


This is in their manifesto?

Parts of it are in their manifest. Other points are taken from public statements by Gruevski and the President Ivanov. Both Ivanov and Gruevski have said that a name with a geographical qualifier is not acceptable. That will only open up more questions as to what Greece will call their part of Macedonia and Gruevski said in an interview he will not approve a name with a geographical qualifier. They both want a bilateral solution where we would agree on a new name with Greece while other countries would call us Republic of Macedonia. Greece rejects that. In the end, I think we will keep our constitutional name domestically while the new name would be used for international organizations to replace FYROM. Other countries would then decide during bilateral relations with Macedonia whether to use our constitutional name or the new name agreed for international organizations. There is no way that the identity and language will be changed.

Both Gruevski and Ivanov have said that a name like Republic of Macedonia (Skopje) could lead to a solution that will then be put to a referendum. Greece also rejects that but I definitely think other powerful countries will pressure them to accept that solution. I do think that Republic of Macedonia (Skopje) will be passed by the majority of citizens in Macedonia.

[Rogi]

makalek,

Do you oppose the name The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia?
If so, why do you oppose it?

[George S.]

Why are they holding talks on the name both gruevski & ivanov are traitors.Is there anything else they could do lick their Hell arses.This is treason of what they are doing.What right have they got to negotiate our name NO right at all.What's that they'll negotiate first & tell the people later by a referendum.Shouldn't they even ask to negotiate permission the answer would be the people would say no to negotaiting the name.

[makalek]

makalek,

Do you oppose the name The former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia?
If so, why do you oppose it?

Of course I oppose the name the "former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia?"

It hurts me every time when I see the term FYROM. For instance, I am an avid sports fan and I have written numerous complaints to UEFA and FIFA not to mix politics with football but both of their websites refer us as FYROM or FYR Macedonia. They say we won't mix politics with football but it seems Greece's lobbying has led to them to refer to us with that derogatory term. I wasn't even interested in politics until 2008 after Greece vetoed our NATO entry. After that, I started following politics closely especially the name issue.

We would all want to be called Macedonia everywhere but that is flatly not possible at the moment, especially in international organizations where Greece is a member. Greece created this problem but unfortunately many countries in NATO and the EU have backed Greece by saying they are showing European solidarity to them. As we know, politics is a dirty game and usually being a bigger country with more lobbyists can help you gain an advantage.

Let me ask you a question. How can we move forward without EU and NATO membership? Soon, most countries in Europe will become members in these organizations with the exceptions of maybe Kosovo and Bosnia. How can we compete for foreign investment against other countries in the region who are members of these organizations? We would be isolated and there will be the potential of instability.