United Macedonia Diaspora

[UMDiaspora.org]

John Bitove, Jr. and Mike Zafirovski spoke at the 2nd Annual UMD Global Conference on June 3, 2010 in Toronto. They spoke on the topic of Doing Business in Macedonia - A Unique Business Gateway to Southeast Europe. Enjoy their remarks below!

John Bitove, Jr.:

YouTube - John Bitove, Jr. Speaks at 2nd Annual United Macedonian Diaspora Global Conference

Mike Zafirovski:

Part 1: YouTube - Mike Zafirovski Speaks at 2nd Annual United Macedonian Diaspora Global Conference - Part 1
Part 2: YouTube - Mike Zafirovski Speaks at 2nd Annual United Macedonian Diaspora Global Conference - Part 2

[Vangelovski]

Meto,

Will UMD support the AMHRC/MHRMI campaign:

http://www.mhrmi.org/our_name_is_macedonia/

Seeing as UMD has enough flash money to send you around the world, a financial contribution would be most appropriate.

Or was your latest "resolution" all talk as we suspected?

[Risto the Great]

That is a pretty EU flag in the background.
Why no NATO flag?

[Prolet]

UMD, This initiative must be supported, i think every Macedonian Organization world wide needs to put their support behind it.

Risto, The EU flag represents our minority in the EU, lets not forget that Macedonians in Egejska and Pirinska Makedonija are represented by that flag.

[indigen]

Meto,

Will UMD support the AMHRC/MHRMI campaign:

http://www.mhrmi.org/our_name_is_macedonia/

Seeing as UMD has enough flash money to send you around the world, a financial contribution would be most appropriate.

Or was your latest "resolution" all talk as we suspected?

Vangelovski,
Do you think this is the best way (paying the enemy to run adds in their media) to wage the struggle for Macedonian national salvation? What sustainable benefits do you see from spending limited and scarce financial resources as envisaged by the campaign? Can there be better options (ways and means) in spending these scarce financial resources that will provide media attention (media or political events) and at same time help to launch and sustain a growing internal Macedonian national/patriotic resistance movement?

Lastly, how much faith can one place in an organisation that denies our indigenous Macedonian heritage?

[UMDiaspora.org]

Listen to Renato Discenza speak about the Macedonian legend: YouTube - Renato Discenza of Invest Toronto Speaks at 2nd Annual United Macedonian Diaspora Global Conference

[UMDiaspora.org]

Viktor Mizo:

YouTube - Viktor Mizo Speaks at 2nd Annual United Macedonian Diaspora Global Conference - Part 1
YouTube - Viktor Mizo Speaks at 2nd Annual United Macedonian Diaspora Global Conference - Part 2

[Vangelovski]

Vangelovski,
Do you think this is the best way (paying the enemy to run adds in their media) to wage the struggle for Macedonian national salvation? What sustainable benefits do you see from spending limited and scarce financial resources as envisaged by the campaign? Can there be better options (ways and means) in spending these scarce financial resources that will provide media attention (media or political events) and at same time help to launch and sustain a growing internal Macedonian national/patriotic resistance movement?

Lastly, how much faith can one place in an organisation that denies our indigenous Macedonian heritage?

Indigen,

I agree we need to be careful with our scarce resources. However, I do think targeted advertisements at crucial periods can be effective (literally thousands of marketing studies back this up). I also think that these ads need to be followed up on with more ongoing and financially sustainable activities, such as (but not limited to) regular opinion columns in the larger papers (where the contributor could do it for free) to help shape public opinion. I can’t speak on there behalf, but I don’t think AMHRC/MHRMI intend this as a limited exercise.

Further, I think these advertisements will have some spin-off effects as well. Hopefully the “international community” will complain, providing us with more media exposure and further opportunities for public debate – and this is where I think AMHRC and MHRMI (and like minded organisations and individuals) will need to follow through by holding interviews, providing opinion pieces, hosting events/rallies etc, to show these vassal policies for what they really are.

Until now, our views have had extremely limited public exposure – ending negotiations have been virtually taboo in the Macedonian public space. Hopefully, this will bring an end to that.

As for UMD, I have no doubt in my mind what their vision is for Macedonia. Their "resolution" that took them five years to make was more empty words.

[indigen]

]Indigen,
I agree we need to be careful with our scarce resources. However, I do think targeted advertisements at crucial periods can be effective (literally thousands of marketing studies back this up).

Yes, they may work in an environment where they are not submerged by massive and regular editorials, opinion articles and reports with counter views (such as is the case with A1, Utrinski, Dnevnik, Vest and Fokus, amongst others) and where there is also a political movement working on the ground with similar/same agenda (and generally would be the author of the said adds). I have seen numerous times where, IMO, significant amount of money has been expended on adds that have delivered little to no tangible and sustainable political results for the Macedonian cause and this effort seems to be heading in the same way.

I also think that these ads need to be followed up on with more ongoing and financially sustainable activities, such as (but not limited to) regular opinion columns in the larger papers (where the contributor could do it for free) to help shape public opinion.

Though many years too late, I do salute the REALISATION that the ROOT CAUSE of MOST of the maladies affecting the Macedonian national interests are to be found in Macedonia (Skopje in particular, being the administrative capitol of RM!). I would prefer to see limited funds go towards the funding of a number of full-time organisers in RM (for starters) who would/should have the capacity to organise and co-ordinate media and political campaigns and be tasked with initiating and growing a Macedonian patriotic/national movement. That movement, once it gets off the ground, should be internal and independent and the Disapora should then co-ordinate and synchronise its activities to achieve common aims and objectives.

I can’t speak on there behalf, but I don’t think AMHRC/MHRMI intend this as a limited exercise.

Time will tell.

Further, I think these advertisements will have some spin-off effects as well. Hopefully the “international community” will complain, providing us with more media exposure and further opportunities for public debate – and this is where I think AMHRC and MHRMI (and like minded organisations and individuals) will need to follow through by holding interviews, providing opinion pieces, hosting events/rallies etc, to show these vassal policies for what they really are.

I used to hear from (experienced) people involved in other struggles that it is better to draw up your own agenda for action and let the enemy react to that rather than your movement reacting to their actions and agendas. The proposed Aleksandar Makedonski statute in Skopje is one such example of a Macedonian initiative which has generated a large amount of publicity (domestic and international) but the initiators are very poor at taking advantage of the opportunities for positive advocacy.

Until now, our views have had extremely limited public exposure – ending negotiations have been virtually taboo in the Macedonian public space. Hopefully, this will bring an end to that.

They were high-profile agenda for DPMNE for a few years (up until 1997, I think?) and until they fell into line with western interests that promised them power and a chance to feed at the public troughs unhindered. Ending name negotiations equates to TERMINATING the "Interim Accord" and the "Provisional Reference"! I would like to know how MHMRI and AMHRC stood on these capitulations throughout the years since their coming into force in 1993 and 1995?

As for UMD, I have no doubt in my mind what their vision is for Macedonia. Their "resolution" that took them five years to make was more empty words.

That may be so but it was not them I had in mind when I raised the question of putting faith in an organisation that denies our indigenous Macedonian heritage.

So pochit,
I.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Indigen, are you referring to the AMHRC where it concerns the Macedonian heritage? If not, disregard my question and I will delete it.

[indigen]

Indigen, are you referring to the AMHRC where it concerns the Macedonian heritage? If not, disregard my question and I will delete it.

Da.

Mongrel Breed Theory for Macedonian Ethogenisis:

“...Macedonians' ethnicity and identity is based on the experiences of all peoples who have settled in Macedonia in the last 2500 years ranging from the Ancient Macedonians, Romans, Celts, Tatars, Slavs, Turks and various peoples brought in during the 500 year plus Ottoman reign....[....]....I do not subscribe to the theory that Macedonians are direct descendants of the Ancient Macedonians...[....]....Modern Macedonian ethnicity and identity, like the Greek, Bulgarian, Serbian etc, are the result of processes which occurred in the period following the French Revolution, in the age of nationalism...”

Dr Chris Popov .
Media Spokesperson AMHRC

[Vangelovski]

Indigen,

Do you have a link for the statement?

[indigen]

Indigen,

Do you have a link for the statement?

Google Search Results

1.
Macedonia Forum • View topic - More ignorant journalism
... of all peoples who have settled in Macedonia in the last 2500 years rang-ing from the Ancient Macedonians, Romans, Celts, Tatars, Slavs, ...
www.maknews.com/forum/post270197.html?sid...

[PDF]
Autumn 2010
File Format: PDF/Adobe Acrobat - View as HTML
2 Jul 2010 ... is based on the experiences of all peoples who have settled in Macedonia in the last 2500 years rang- ing from the Ancient Macedonians, ...

https://www.maknews.com/announcements/AMHRC_Autumn_Review_2010.pdf

[Vangelovski]

Seeing as this was published in the AMHRC Review, does anyone from there want to make an official comment in relation to Popov's letter?

[AMHRC]

Tom,

The history of Macedonia, like the rest of the world is complex. From a sociological perspective, we can divide the social realm into three structural forms: cultural, economic and political. From the time of the Ancient Macedonians to the present, these forms have undergone significant alterations; partially as a result of foreign invasions.

Therefore in our view, the identity marker/symbol, Macedonian, has represented different things at different times. This does not mean that Macedonians today cannot claim descent from the Ancient Macedonians; however to claim that this descent is direct or unbroken/unmixed and linear is difficult to maintain (as a result of transformations, in part caused by foreign invasions etc).

However, this is just our historical perspective and we apply it equally to all other Modern ethnic groups and nations - especially to the Modern Greeks. It is not to deny that other perspectives are possible, especially as so much of Macedonia's history remains unknown and also because existing evidence is open to more than one interpretation.

We would like it noted that indigen in another thread on this forum has posted information indicating that the "Slavonians" did invade and settle Greece (and the whole of the Balkans, according to indigen's source: post number 12, in the "Greece, History, Truth" thread in the Exposing Lies etc. section of MTO).

If indigen can prove our view completely wrong and demonstrate that the ancestors of Macedonians today have been continuously identifying as Macedonian from ancient times to the present; and that the usage of that identity marker (Macedonian) has always meant/symbolised the same thing/social structures continuously from ancient times to the present and that there has been no intermingling/mixing both physical and cultural between Macedonians and all the invaders, we would be more than happy to surrender our perspective as invalid.

We do not require of our members that they all hold the same historical perspective; we merely ask that they accept our Macedonian identity, language and culture, unequivocally; and that they help the struggle to resist attempts by anyone to change our identity or undermine our human rights in general.

Regards,

AMHRC.