Macedonian Church Dispute in Australia

[aleksandrov]

G. Peter: In Australia they are and against the Macedonian Orthodox Church

- Не сакам да зборувам во врска со судските случаи што се водат таму, за тоа да не се одрази врз судската одлука. Црковните заедници го замајуваат народот дека се со МПЦ, ама со документите не ја признаваат. Австралија е мултикултурна, мултиетничка и мултирелигиозна земја и се труди сите да го зачуваат својот идентитет. Нашите браќа и сестри прават обратно и бараат асимилација на македонскиот народ. Ние тука се трудиме по секоја цена да си го задржиме нашето македонско име, а таму уште од почетокот се води таа асимилаторска политика - објаснува владиката.

This man is not only a megalomaniac from out of this world, but also a pathological deceiver to rival any televangelist. There is nothing he won't do to detract the public's attention from his own misdeeds. After 14 years of having to deal with his campaign of deception, I still find it hard to believe his nerve.

Who could be credited with preserving and promulgating the Macedonian identity and cultural heritage in Australia more than the old Macedonian Orthodox communities, which were established in the 50s, 60s and 70s? The resistance against Petar's injustices comprises all of those communities, plus some newer communities that modelled themselves on the old ones. On the other hand, all of the incorporated Macedonian Orthodox associations that have submitted to his despotic rule were established under Yugoslav state influence (under the leadership of Macedonian bishops and priests loyal to Yugoslavia), to counter the older Macedonian communities that were considered too nationalistic and recalcitrant because their conception of Macedonia and the Macedonian people exceeded the scope of Yugoslav nationhood. As for the newer churches that are legally owned by (bishop) Petar Karevski and two of his priests, Petar's signature on the Nish Agreement with the Serbian Orthodox Church of 2002 is evidence enough of how committed he and his servants are to preserving the autochthonous Macedonian identity. His promotion of Jovan (Zoran) Vraniskovski to bishop of the Macedonian Orthodox Church is another eye-gouging piece of evidence. The fact that he hasn't objected to the Hellenic Council's and the NSW Government's proposal to identify the Republic of Macedonia as Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia in the Macedonian Orthodox Property Trust Bill 2010 (NSW) is another sign. The fact that one of the submissions in favour of his Property Bill comes from the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese of Australia, which is part of the Greek Orthodox Church of Antioch and considers the Macedonian Orthodox Church to be non-canonical is yet another strong indicator. Further evidence will come out soon. Watch this space.

http://novamakedonija.com.mk/NewsDetal.asp?vest=10210100517&id=9&prilog=0&setIzdanie=22098

Aleksandrov, kako napreduva prevodot?

Check your PM.

[aleksandrov]

According to Bishop Petar, the court cases will be completed by the end of the year.

YouTube - naskoro ke zavrssi 13 godissniot sudski spor vo Avstralija 22.09.mpg

Petar claiming that it's his detractors who don't want to be accountable to anybody for the way they manage the funds of their communities?

When the fox preaches, look to your geese. - German proverb

Кога лисицата проповеда, гледај си ги гуските. - Germanska pogovorka

As for the commentator's claim that some of Petar's detractors from Australia have allegedly "admitted" that the properties of the incorporated Macedonian Orthodox communities could one day become "only commercial" properties, I wonder why he didn't cite their names? I wonder what his price for this ridiculously stupid lie was?

[George S.]

How much has this clown (petar) costing the community.The anount of money must be enormous.If he is an enemy of the macedonian people then he must be removed from his position.There must be means & ways to remove this clown.Does anyone know he can be removed? as he has caused enough damage.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

This is nothing new in diaspora and ever since the first church was built in the early 1900's we've seen many priests who want to have total control of the church they work and get paid from and this has caused several church splits and added costs to the Macedonian people - new church's.

[julie]

Petar is aligning the MOC under the auspices of the Serbian OC, poveke, nema da bide Makedonskata pravoslavna crkva avtokefalna. I dont understand how he has free reign to do this.
Petar has brainwashed the Macedonians in Australia who have aligned themselves under his leadership, with promises of heaven. How can someone that preaches and says he is a man of God condemn all others for basically not handing over the titles to the churches built here. Are people so blindsighted, the facts are there. The churches he has are in HIS name.
The Macedonian people in Australia came out as poor migrants, established communities and built churches with their own funds. He is a manipulative control freak, egoistical and is working contra to the Macedonian cause. He has insitigated and caused rampant divisivenss amongst Australian Macedonians. That is not a person that preaches love, but instills fear amongst his flock with promises of salvation to heaven if they hand over the church titles. I dont understand how they can be so blind not to see a materialistic, authoritarian, who will exhaust all means for the accumulation of personal wealth and gain.
I have noticed his followers on the MTO have been absent. It will be interesting to see what will eventuate with his followers when they are asked to hand over the titles to their personal homes. Many have lost their homes, and it is disgusting.

He has aligned himself with the Reverend Nile. This so called man of God caused the disintegration of the Presbyterian church in Australia, and the newly made up uniting church.
Is this what the Macedonians want? We will be under the auspices of the Serbian church. For God's sake, we have fought so hard for our independence, being subservient to an egoistical material "priest", will cause further divisions amongst us.
Its time for the Macedonians in Australia to wake up. Petar is the anti Christ, he is amassing material wealth on the backs and sweat of the people in AUstralia, for his own personal gain.
This property trust bill is disturbing. On examination of this bill it shows it wont be just NSW he will be able to snatch from, but other states as well.

[makedonche]

How much has this clown (petar) costing the community.The anount of money must be enormous.If he is an enemy of the macedonian people then he must be removed from his position.There must be means & ways to remove this clown.Does anyone know he can be removed? as he has caused enough damage.

George S
What you say is 100% correct, the only thing that will rid us of this plague on our religion and our identity and independence is the voice of the people. Until enough people voice their outrage and continue to voice their outrage in unified numbers, we will not be rid of him!

[indigen]

vladikata_i_crkovnite_lideri_denes_9_7_99.jpg

[indigen]

Агатангел: "....Македонската православна црква како Тело Христово, но и како духовна институција на македонскиот народ, има обврска секогаш да ја сведочи и брани вистината, бидејќи токму со вистината и Божјата правда Православната црква е во коалиција речиси 2000 години....."

А ми изгледа да на Јоле Каревски (Петар) ЛАГИТЕ, КЛЕВЕТЊЕТО и ШИРЕЊЕТО на РАЗДОР и ОМРАЗА помеѓу Македонците во Австралија му е дневна задача и обврска! Каков Владика е Петар и дали заслужува да остане со таква титула и надлежност? Сигурно не заслужува и не би требало да остани на таква одговорна надлежност!!!

[Makedonska_Kafana]

YouTube - Priznanija za tie shto posetuvaa verska pouka 10.10.2010.mpg

[Prilepcanka]

The Final Report was tabled in the Legislative Council on 19 October 2010

Summary of Recommendations

there's only 1
That the Macedonian Orthodox Church Property Trust Bill 2010 not proceed.*

http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/Prod/parlment/committee.nsf/0/88998518557524d4ca2577c10014fc5f/$FILE/101019%20Report%2023%20Macedonian%20Orthodox%20Chu rch%20Property%20Trust%20Bill%202010.pdf

GREAT WORK TO ALL THOSE THAT WORKED SO HARD TO HAVE THIS BILL DEFEATED

[julie]

Prilepcanka, welcome to the MTO

Fantastic news, having trouble openeing the link, it may be my slow laptop is on its way out though.
Great work by everybody in blocking this travesty from being passed against the Macedonian cause and against our people in Australia.

[Mikail]

Thanks prilepcanka! Good work to all those involved.

Thanks to Dr Kaye for stating the obvious:

Resolved, on the motion of Dr Kaye: That a new paragraph 7.3 be inserted to read, 'The Committee
believes that the current divisive climate between Macedonian Orthodox communities and the Church
hierarchy is not conducive to any legislative solution at this time. It is the hope of the Committee that the
Church and communities can work together in a consultative environment to resolve these issues in the
future.'

[Prolet]

Bishop Petar is stating that Macedonian Churches in the 1960s were registered as Bulgarian Churches then they changed the titles. I've never heard anything about this from anybody before, maybe he is talking about the Kiril i Metodij Church in NorthCote that the Bulgarians took?

YouTube - Ico Najdovski i Vladikata Petar

[Mikail]

He is an idiot a and a propagandist!

Does any other Bishop speak out against his parishioners, anywhere, the way Petar does.

I was very surprised to see he had law firm, Gadens, acting for him, to get the NSW Property Trust Bill through. They are a "top end" of town law firm and very pricey indeed for providing their services.

Where did this "simple koleger" get the kind of money needed to fund such a case.

There are people within our community who need social services. We have no infrastructure to support or community.

There have been calls for a retirement village to be built for many, many years. We don't have one for our elderly.

Yet Petar has millions of dollars to spend to take Macedonians to court, and has the time to spread vial propaganda on Macedonian TV.

What the hell is wrong with this man?

[makedonche]

He is an idiot a and a propagandist!

Does any other Bishop speak out against his parishioners, anywhere, the way Petar does.

I was very surprised to see he had law firm, Gadens, acting for him, to get the NSW Property Trust Bill through. They are a "top end" of town law firm and very pricey indeed for providing their services.

Where did this "simple koleger" get the kind of money needed to fund such a case.

There are people within our community who need social services. We have no infrastructure to support or community.

There have been calls for a retirement village to be built for many, many years. We don't have one for our elderly.

Yet Petar has millions of dollars to spend to take Macedonians to court, and has the time to spread vial propaganda on Macedonian TV.

What the hell is wrong with this man?

Mikail
Nothing a lead aspirin wouldn't fix!