Macedonia & Greece: Name Issue

[Brygian Seed]

The Celts are a good people! Some believe that they originated from an area north of Macedonia, from where they started their long migration northward.

[Bill77]

Bill.
Really?
Northern Macedonia?
Would I then be a Northern Macedonian from Northern Greece?

RTG mabe i have miss understood the proposal. I am assuming it is a bilateral used. i did also say its not perfect. But my eyes opened more to the point where our language and identity will remain MACEDONIAN.

[indigen]

Doe anyone know if Bulgaria has veto power?

Yes, ALL EU members have Veto power.

[indigen]

SoM, it is not even Bi-Lateral. It is saying some countries can call us one thing, others can call us another. As a Macedonian from occupied Macedonia it is even more offensive to be a Northern Macedonian from Northern Greece.

Macedonian people as Macedonian is a joke. If the country is called Northern Macedonia, get ready for a new round of $130 million Greek spending to convince the world otherwise.

We may get a lucky delay because The Greeks are hard-line and want everything at once, but apart from that "our" side is ready to deal on state name (for international use) and much more.

As for $130 million, I think they have spent much, much more that on their decades old anti-Macedonian crusade and they will spend as much as it takes to ERASE every trace of ethnic Macedonian identity around the globe. The Greeks are, and will be, greatly assisted by Bulgars and Shiptars in their common cause against us.

[Bill77]

Doe anyone know if Bulgaria has veto power?

Bulgaria has made it public that they suport Macedonia's integration. They have no issue with the name. I posted a recent Macedonian artical somewhere in this forum.

[Pelister]

Something we should all realize. If the traitors in our government were to accept "Northern Macedonia" as the name of our Nation, we lose our Macedonian Nationality, not as citizens of Macedonia but as ethnic Macedonians. Currently the name of our state reflects our ethnic and cultural identity.

Gruevski is a first class TRAITOR (as is UMD), because they have put foward proposals for a name change.

Here is the Greek position regarding the Macedonian nationality.

There is no generally accepted definition of Macedonia. In modern times Macedonia had never formed a racial, linguistic or political unit. Source: p. 3, Dakin, D., The Greek Struggle in Macedonia 1897-1913

Read and understand this carefully, because to be called "Northern Macedonia" means that the Macedonians will lose political representation that directly reflects there ethnic and cultural identity.

Incidently, compare this official Greek position with comments the current president of UMD posted on MacedoniaMediaGroup, Wednesday, August 24, at 12.38. There is no room in Macedonia for these kinds of Trajkovski'ism's.

We are going to discuss creating a society based on individuals, not ethnic groups, on citizense and not minority groups

.

It is identical to the Greek position.

[Prolet]

Bulgaria has made it public that they suport Macedonia's integration. They have no issue with the name. I posted a recent Macedonian artical somewhere in this forum.

And you believe that?

[Sovius]

to be called "Northern Macedonia" means that the Macedonians will lose political representation that directly reflects there ethnic and cultural identity.

The beginning of the end and a negation that would be amplified internally within Greece. Any compromise will continue to reinforce the idea that Macedonians are not truly entitled to their cultural legacy and, therefore, their land(s). The global political projection would be one of generosity on the part of Greece.

[Risto the Great]

The global political projection would be one of generosity on the part of Greece.

It is already being promoted this way.
Could you have the Macedonians capitulate in any worse fashion?

[Bill77]

And you believe that?

This was reported by the Macedonian Media. There was no claims anywhere from the Macedonian government or media to dispute the claims. The Bulgarians whould have been at the most recent EU summit also Macedonian reps would have been there or known what whent on. Unless you show me otherwise i would believe this media report.

[Bill77]

This was reported by the Macedonian Media. There was no claims anywhere from the Macedonian government or media to dispute the claims. The Bulgarians whould have been at the most recent EU summit also Macedonian reps would have been there or known what whent on. Unless you show me otherwise i would believe this media report.

Here it is again Prolet.

Bulgaria backed Macedonia for EU membership - Bulgarian PM


Bonn, December 10 (MIA) - Bulgaria has supported Macedonia in Brussels to obtain a date for start of negotiations and we hope this will be appreciated. Our position resembled the agreement we've made with Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski, says Bulgarian Premier Boyko Borisov in an interview with Deutsche Welle radio - Macedonian language program.

Considering claims that Bulgaria was reserved, even against Macedonia to get a date for membership talks, Borisov says those who report these information want to deteriorate Bulgaria's relations with Macedonia. - But they will not succeed, the PM states.

The Bulgarian PM fell short of responding whether the country has the chance to get a date for negotiations in the course of Spain's EU presidency. Borisov welcomes the visa liberalisation for the citizens of Macedonia as of Dec. 19, saying he expects the visa-free regime to enable them to see that EU membership is beneficial and to become closer friends with Bulgaria.

- I salute our Macedonian neighbours who will travel freely throughout EU as of Dec. 19. Then for the first time they will understand how different is the time in which they lived in and how the situation has changed. They will understand that is better to be in EU and NATO and to foster neighbourly ties. I hope that after Dec. 19 Macedonians will understand that they should become closer friends with Bulgaria, urges Borisov.

Asked about his last week's address in the Parliament referring to the relations with Macedonia, where he failed to mention the existence of Macedonian language and to state whether the language was a problem between both countries at a Q&A session with MPs, PM Borisov says it is not an issue for his country. He deems he gave a balanced response, presenting a clear position in relation to Macedonia, which had been previously agreed with country's president.

- Every country has internal political issues. There are people in Macedonia and in Bulgaria who see backwards in history, but they need to be pushed aside. Bulgaria has no issues with the Macedonian language. Our only concern is Macedonia and Bulgaria to become developed European countries. Emphasis should be put on the advancement of the economic climate, trade, services, etc..., stated Bulgaria's PM Borisov, who takes part at a congress of the European People's Party (EPP) in Bonn where he met with his Macedonian counterpart Nikola Gruevski at its sidelines.

http://www.idividi.com.mk/English/Ma...409/index.html

[Prolet]

Spolaj Ti Blagojche, but we know we cant trust the Bulgarians they say one thing and do the opposite. How many times did Bojko Borisov go to Greece?

Something we should all realize. If the traitors in our government were to accept "Northern Macedonia" as the name of our Nation, we lose our Macedonian Nationality, not as citizens of Macedonia but as ethnic Macedonians. Currently the name of our state reflects our ethnic and cultural identity.

Gruevski is a first class TRAITOR (as is UMD), because they have put foward proposals for a name change.

Pelister, Shame on you for saying that, it has to be the most anti-Macedonian statement you've ever said. Pissing on somebody whos done nothing more then to defend our name and identity. He has had two chances to change our name and he didnt, what more do you want from him?? Ne gibaj kadi ne treba, ne lichi ubo.

You will loose all your credibility if you constantly spit on people like this.

[indigen]

Spolaj Ti Blagojche, but we know we cant trust the Bulgarians they say one thing and do the opposite. How many times did Bojko Borisov go to Greece?

Pelister, Shame on you for saying that, it has to be the most anti-Macedonian statement you've ever said. Pissing on somebody whos done nothing more then to defend our name and identity. He has had two chances to change our name and he didnt, what more do you want from him?? Ne gibaj kadi ne treba, ne lichi ubo.

You will loose all your credibility if you constantly spit on people like this.

IMO, you are trolling, again.
What do you think having UCK TERRORISTS (Ahmeti and Co.) in government constitutes?



Notice someone familiar from the present government in the picture above?

[Jankovska]

Anyone, Anyone who dares to even THINK about talking of name change is a traitor to my eyes and my country. I will refuse to vote for Gruevski and Ivanov again (i did vote for both and I am ashamed of it) and I will never ever vote or support anyone who thinks they have the right to talk about our name. To me those deserve a lifetime in jail, in a black hole with no visitors.
Once again anyone who supports these talks must be removed immidietly, we must pull out of any chit chat about our name and stick it to the pederi Greeks once and forever.
If we don't have the jajca or the heros to stand up and do that than WE DESERVE everything that is coming our way.

[Prolet]

The IRA and the Loyalists formed a Government together we had no choice, VMRO has formed coalitions with pretty much all the minority parties. We are discussing the name issue here remember that, read what i highlighted spitting on somebody who has done alot for the country who has had the chance to change our name on a number of occasions and hasnt done so, are you another Gruevski hater???

Sure everyone has the right to an opinion but open accusations of calling somebody a traitor when they are clearly not is simply pointless and stupid.