Who are the Slavs? - Citations and Sources

[julie]

George S.
You and I are Macedonian (and most people on this forum), we have Macedonian blood, we have Macedonian customs, we have Macedonian traditions & culture - we are Macedonian- full stop!
We speak Macedonian, to my knowledge it is one of the oldest languages around and it is categorised as being a part of the "Slavic" language group - that doesn't make us Slavs, we are still Macedonian!
There are other nationalities, ethnic groups and country's who speak similar but still different languages - for example Ukranian, these people speak Ukranian, are Ukranian and have Ukrainian customs/traditions, the Ukranian language is also part of the "Slavic" language group, but they are not Slavs either(to the best of my knowledge).
The so called "Slav" theory, is just that - a theory! IMHO
The Greeks saw that Macedonia was becomming a republic and decided they were not prepared to hand over the large chunk of Macedonia they stole so they went about trying to convince the world that it was always Greek and Macedonia was always Greek that way they wouldn't have to give it back and pay reparations for the atrocities committed.
Our genius first president - Gligorov - for whatever deluded reason, decided to announce we are "Slavs" and declared it openly trying to distinguish us from the so called "Macedonians that were always Greek" - this was a fatal error - the Greeks seized on this and use it to convince the world we are "Slavs/Slav Macedonians" because our president says so, and are different from the Macedonians who have always been Greek and therefore must have arrived in the area during the so called "Slav Migration" of the 6th century, this bullshit along with similar bullshit about "Tito" creating the Rebublic of Macedonia in 1942 is just Greek propoganda to avoid having to give our country back!
What I will tell you is that our history is still being written and as we type here on the forum there are many archaeologists at work in Macedonia making many important discoveries, some of these discoveries will show the Macedonian people, language, traditions and customs are a lot older than most academics know - it's just a matter of time before this data/information is presented to the world and the Greeks are put in their rightfull place - that is a false nation of Albanian wannabees created by the English/Germans/French around 1820 - before that the Ancient Greeks were finished off at the battle of Chaeronia!

Agreed on all counts Makedonche!

Heraclea Lyncestis is one of those archaelogical digs in the surrounds of Bitola , where an archaelogist there stated to us the layers they are unfolding are 11 deep, and there were possibly a Lyceneum ancient Macedonian people there

[makedonche]

George S.
You and I are Macedonian (and most people on this forum), we have Macedonian blood, we have Macedonian customs, we have Macedonian traditions & culture - we are Macedonian- full stop!
We speak Macedonian, to my knowledge it is one of the oldest languages around and it is categorised as being a part of the "Slavic" language group - that doesn't make us Slavs, we are still Macedonian!
There are other nationalities, ethnic groups and country's who speak similar but still different languages - for example Ukranian, these people speak Ukranian, are Ukranian and have Ukrainian customs/traditions, the Ukranian language is also part of the "Slavic" language group, but they are not Slavs either(to the best of my knowledge).
The so called "Slav" theory, is just that - a theory! IMHO
The Greeks saw that Macedonia was becomming a republic and decided they were not prepared to hand over the large chunk of Macedonia they stole so they went about trying to convince the world that it was always Greek and Macedonia was always Greek that way they wouldn't have to give it back and pay reparations for the atrocities committed.
Our genius first president - Gligorov - for whatever deluded reason, decided to announce we are "Slavs" and declared it openly trying to distinguish us from the so called "Macedonians that were always Greek" - this was a fatal error - the Greeks seized on this and use it to convince the world we are "Slavs/Slav Macedonians" because our president says so, and are different from the Macedonians who have always been Greek and therefore must have arrived in the area during the so called "Slav Migration" of the 6th century, this bullshit along with similar bullshit about "Tito" creating the Rebublic of Macedonia in 1942 is just Greek propoganda to avoid having to give our country back!
What I will tell you is that our history is still being written and as we type here on the forum there are many archaeologists at work in Macedonia making many important discoveries, some of these discoveries will show the Macedonian people, language, traditions and customs are a lot older than most academics know - it's just a matter of time before this data/information is presented to the world and the Greeks are put in their rightfull place - that is a false nation of Albanian wannabees created by the English/Germans/French around 1820 - before that the Ancient Greeks were finished off at the battle of Chaeronia!

[George S.]

RTG correct me if'm wrong to some xtent all languages are influenced by each other.That still doesn't change the ethnic sense.We still are macedonian ethnically.Our blood running through our veins is macedonian blood.Anyway the slavs were assimilated into mainstream macedonia.So the only influence or connection is the language.It doesn't make you any less macedonian or more macedonian.Also all races in the world coorect me if i'm wrong aren't pure because they intermingle & assimilate that is natural in the scheme of things.The thing i'm reminded is why did alexander want his men to intermarry with other nationalities if he wanted to keep a pure breed of macedonian.I think he wanted the benefits of assimilation * intermingling of the races.

In rehgard to the slavs my knowledge of the slavs was disjointed at best i didn't know for a fact that we are only using the slav language.Nothing else has changed except the linguistics we still are macedonians.We have to face reality as to the historical happenings & accept what the truth is that only our language is affected linguistically nothing else.The other thing i would like to add that scholars tell us that the macedonian language,venetic.prhygian is interrelated with the slavic language & its basically the same language.One could really drop the slav reference if one wanted to.language

vojnik that is why i suggested to som that he should give us a 1 page tretise of the extent he knows on slavs as his knowledge is extensive,But the dialogue so far is dispelling any differences we had it better to do it now than later.I'm for the better for it.If you got anything on your chest now is the time vojnik.

[vojnik]

This thread should be made sticky and I also share the same views as SoM about this I have spent days researching this stuff at the Australian Nation Library even though I did SoM's knowledge on this matter is far more extensive.

[Risto the Great]

but the same can also be said for Spanish, Mexican, Italian, nobody calls them an ethnic hispanic people

The correct terminology is Latin for the linguistic grouping of these people. It means nothing more than that. How Mexican people who once were akin to American Indians (now speaking Spanish) can be thought of as "Latins" in an ethnic or national sense is beyond me.

Macedonians have far more unique features than Mexicans but some people are still afraid to mention the "S" word when it comes to linguistic similarities. I see no problem in making the obvious declaration of linguistic familiarity within the slavic languages.

[George S.]

There is a slav language we speak it.WE are also macedonian.THe only connection with the slavs is the language right?
There aree countries like greece trying to tar us with the same brush as if we just speak the slav language & we must be slavic.There is no slav people only macedonian people.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Julie, who here has said anything about Macedonians being 'ethnic Slavs' or that Macedonians should have a 'Slav' qualifier?

.......the slav theory discounts Macedonians as descendants of Alexander the Great.....

Which theory? That the Macedonians speak a language belonging to the Slavic linguistic group? Because aside from that, I don't see anybody claiming anything else.

[Onur]

Linguistically, there are similarities between different ethnicities within the Balkans, but the same can also be said for Spanish, Mexican, Italian, nobody calls them an ethnic hispanic people

The slav Macedonian theory plays into the Grk propoganda

Thats a good point Julie. The connotation of the adjective "slav" in an ethnic sense started with Karl Marx`s theories of united slavic speaking people under the domination of Russia to create Russian satellites in Europe. Before that, there was no such a thing. This idea is totally collapsed with Yugoslavia and with the end of communism in Russia.

But as you said, Greeks are purposely still using this long-gone connotation to undermine your identity and your nation.


Also, some of you trying prove something by using the terms Slovene, Slovak. I don't think you can reach a proper point with that because both the terms of Slovene and Slovak created quite recently if we compare with the word Slav.

[julie]

I do not for one minute believe we have slavic roots. I do not know what that means nor do I accept anything other than our roots being Macedonian.

Agreed

Grtsite po toa "slavjani" ni vikaat, i po to nachin velat deka Makedonija e Grchka, nashite vo Egejskiot del Makedonija znachi ne postojat kako Makedontsi

Pa koga zboruvav so nashiot star pop Jordan Tasev, im postojav edno prashenje. Na sluzhbite koga velaat pravoslavni, ne e deka Makedonskiot narod e slavjanski narod, pa za VERATA, znachi pravoslavni - Macedonian Orthodox

It is contra to our unique Macedonian language, culture etc to label Macedonians as slav, I disagree with the ethnic connotation placed upon us, and dispute there are a "slav" people
Linguistically, there are similarities between different ethnicities within the Balkans, but the same can also be said for Spanish, Mexican, Italian, nobody calls them an ethnic hispanic people
The slav Macedonian theory plays into the Grk propoganda that Macedonia is Greek for Macedonians in the occupied territories .
The slav Macedonian qualifier that Macedonians are slav, also supports the Bulgarian notion that we are Bulgarian
Macedonians are unique, I am not saying that we are pure, as there will always be inter-ethnic unions, however the slav theory discounts Macedonians as descendants of Alexander the Great
I am not a historian nor a linguist, but something Macedonians today need to take on board and recognise that there are vicious power plays in place for the ethnic genocide of our people and nation, and the west will continue to support the false propaganda spread by Greeks, and the slav theory that we are slavs will be detrimental for the continuance of our very existence

[Risto the Great]

of our slavic roots.

I do not for one minute believe we have slavic roots. I do not know what that means nor do I accept anything other than our roots being Macedonian.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Do you think that the common language that people are mentioning from old times is really slavic which then became macedonian.

The Balkan, Danubian and Baltic languages all stem from a common ancestor. The Danubian (Slavic) languages absorbed the Balkan languages from the 6th century onwards.

So if slavs existed prior to the macedonians.ie phrygians,brygians,veneti,eneti.

There was no Slavic identity in antiquity, neither in an ethnic or linguistic sense. The Macedonian identity has existed for much longer.

[George S.]

So risto you mentione that language was macedonian i like the sound of that you have 100% agreement on that.
Oh also i would like to let som know i read up on theorigins on the thracians some say they were sumerians,some say one of the lost ten tribes of israel.I don't know if they were the original slavs who lived in the caspian area (indigenous) but when they came to the balkan area they had more than 20 tribes living there eventually most went to sweden a few remained.How true that is i don't know.Also i found out only a certain slav
came to the balkan peninsula in the sixth &7 th century.
I wanted to ask you som maybe it's kind of jumping the gun.Do you think that the common language that people are mentioning from old times is really slavic which then became macedonian.So if slavs existed prior to the macedonians.ie phrygians,brygians,veneti,eneti.
Then it's really talking of the same people.So that the slavs didn't just come into existence in the 6 or 7 century.
I'll be honest with you guys i didn't know the whole truth about the slavs.I may have known some & hard to accept but we have to accept it & not hide from it.THe more we know the better,knowledge is power.But if we become ignorant like little old me you end up jumping the gun because you don't know the full facts.So where's the humble pie. i'm hungry.So really we should just accept who we are & be proud of who we are.Not like our fake neighbours.WE Can then set a direction based on that.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Our language is Macedonian too mate, it just belongs to a much larger pool of languages - like most other languages on this earth. No big deal.

[Soldier of Macedon]

It's only when people try through propaganda to say that you aren't macedonian because you speak a slavic language.

Very good point. So isn't it better that we, as a people, learn how to develop a strong counter-argument to such propaganda by basing it on truth and logic, rather than avoiding the term 'slav' altogether?

[George S.]

As a matter of fact i don't think i have heard anything bad about having slavic language.We are still macedonian as the blood is still there.It's only when people try through propaganda to say that you aren't macedonian because you speak a slavic language.
have to agree on that its registered around the world as macedonianIt's only our language that's slavic.The people are macedonian.
I have been trying to avoid that only to say it's only macedonian.
Some of the things i couldn't follow was the baltic/latvian origins of the slavs etc