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-   -   The Real Ethnic Composition of Modern Greece (http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=17)

tchaiku 10-03-2017 10:00 AM

[QUOTE=Carlin;167644]Historical Documents: Albanians (and other peoples) in various Greek Islands.

Presence of Albanians located in the northeastern Aegean islands (Samos, Psara) and some islands of the Cyclades (Andros, Ios, Kea, Kythnos). Just a few random examples (Google Translation):
[U]Ios[/U]:

[U]"Throughout the island there is only a small town on a hillside. The inhabitants are [B]ethnic Albanians[/B] ...." (Francois Richard, 1650).
[/U][/QUOTE]
Homer died on Ios. :37:
I have a horrible cover page of Iliad and very poorly treated by me too (a little scratched of the upper layer I mean it looks white you know). Inside it looks very elegant and it's translation respects the literal version with balanced words. For cover page I would choose this one:
[IMG]http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRxYTrMJ-wvHNzg4q20ASneq7DxvSWSAxFx8MRUznjrShsDuWX7[/IMG]

However this one is not so great inside. perseus.tufts

Carlin15 01-16-2018 11:55 PM

I will just be posting the relevant URLs/Screenshots to save time. Everyone is welcome and encouraged to explore and verify the sources/links.

1) [COLOR="Blue"]"The Vlachs filled Thessaly and for this reason it was called "Great Vlachia". Also Vlachs were in Roumeli, Euboia and the Peloponnese. Arvanites who settled in Attica, Corinthia, Epirus, Mani, in Thessaly and the islands were not few, and [B]the 'Franks' (Italians, Catalans, Venetians, etc.) from the Crusades were established in many Greek regions (the coasts of Eastern Thessaly, Ionian Islands, Attica, Roumeli, Aegean islands etc.)[/B]."[/COLOR]

URL:
[url]https://www.google.ca/search?tbm=bks&ei=WtdTWvHSDom2jwTfoLi4Cg&q=%CE%A6%CF%81%CE%AC%CE%B3%CE%BA%CE%BF%CE%B9+%CE%9A%CE%B1%CF%84%CE%B1%CE%BB%CE%B1%CE%BD%CE%BF%CE%AF+%CE%98%CE%B5%CF%83%CF%83%CE%B1%CE%BB%CE%AF%CE%B1&oq=%CE%A6%CF%81%CE%AC%CE%B3%CE%BA%CE%BF%CE%B9+%CE%9A%CE%B1%CF%84%CE%B1%CE%BB%CE%B1%CE%BD%CE%BF%CE%AF+%CE%98%CE%B5%CF%83%CF%83%CE%B1%CE%BB%CE%AF%CE%B1&gs_l=psy-ab.3...39622.39913.0.40543.2.2.0.0.0.0.157.292.0j2.2.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..0.0.0....0.9SNvkwM0iQk&gws_rd=cr&dcr=0[/url]

2) The village of Agios Akakios (formerly known as Golitsa), an important settlement which according to the local historians "is said to be founded in the 14th century by Vlach and Serbian nobles." Other villages of the same region such as Achladia (Amurlar), Leontari (Aslanar), Anthohori (also known by the blatant Vlach name Floresi) etc., where the Vlach presence -even more spectacularly- is attested up to this day are also utterly neglected as if they do not exist at all.

Another area of Greece where Vlachs still linger and which again is outside Thede Kahl's reach -if not interest- is Euboea. A long and lanky island which almost touches the mainland at Chalkis, Euboea, known in mediaeval times as Negroponte is described by the [B]Encyclopaedia Britannica (15th edition, 1995, vol. 4, pag. 587)[/B] as having a Vlach element: [B][COLOR="Blue"]".. the population of the island is varied (..) there is a Vlach element in the hill country"[/COLOR][/B].

URL:
[url]http://www.network54.com/Search/view/22270/1043017105/Aromanian+Vlachs%3A+The+Vanishing+Tribes?term=Discovery&page=6666[/url]

3)
[url=https://imgur.com/yxsBrQm][img]http://i.imgur.com/yxsBrQm.png[/img][/url]

4)
[url=https://imgur.com/3IJa0vv][img]http://i.imgur.com/3IJa0vv.png[/img][/url]

5) The following comes from the (deceased) Serbian historian Tibor Zivkovic. I will provide translations later on, when I have time - apologies.

[url=https://imgur.com/QXlObLd][img]http://i.imgur.com/QXlObLd.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://imgur.com/HwjlNRh][img]http://i.imgur.com/HwjlNRh.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://imgur.com/QX8Z4w3][img]http://i.imgur.com/QX8Z4w3.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://imgur.com/03k2lab][img]http://i.imgur.com/03k2lab.jpg[/img][/url]

For the last page, [B]314[/B], the gist of it is as follows:
Both Mantineia and Olympia (in the Peloponnese) were entirely empty and deserted (abandoned) by the time Slavs arrived and settled here in the 7th century.

URL - [I]Tibor Zivkovic - Juzni Sloveni Pod Vizantijskom Vlascu Od 600-1025[/I]:
[url]https://www.scribd.com/document/56960573/Tibor-Zivkovic-Juzni-Sloveni-Pod-Vizantijskom-Vlascu-Od-600-1025[/url]

Liberator of Makedonija 01-17-2018 01:13 AM

Vlachs have played a large role in the formation of Greece in the 19th century.

Carlin15 01-18-2018 07:52 PM

URL:
[url]https://books.google.ca/books?id=7VVJAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA566&dq=Sclaves+Wallachians+Epir&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwijtJKF8K3YAhUp4YMKHbR7DEMQ6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=Sclaves%20Wallachians%20Epir&f=false[/url]

Putnam's Magazine - Volume 4 - Page 566, Year 1869.

Page 566:

[COLOR="Blue"][B][SIZE="2"]"In [B][U]Epirus[/U][/B], there are, no doubt, a few places where the tongue has been preserved with considerable purity; but, [B]in the main, [U]that province is inhabited by Albanese, Sclaves, Wallachians[/U][/B], and similar incongruous tribes."[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR]



URL:
[url]https://books.google.ca/books?id=bjUBAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA37&lpg=PA37&dq=northwards+into+macedonia+pure+greeks+are+no+longer+to+be+found+wallachs+romounoi&source=bl&ots=LnEMqHEDhW&sig=05zC6KPlPC4Wgu5vQAW5Uel3CLM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi34_De4OLYAhWH34MKHSdaAFAQ6AEIJzAA#v=onepage&q=northwards%20into%20macedonia%20pure%20greeks%20are%20no%20longer%20to%20be%20found%20wallachs%20romounoi&f=false[/url]

Twixt Greek and Turk; Or, Jottings During a Journey Through Thessaly ..., By Sir Valentine Chirol, Year 1881.

Pages 37 and 38:
[B][COLOR="Blue"]
"... [U]northwards into Macedonia[/U] pure Greeks are no longer to be found. [U]All the communities which are included under that designation are Wallachs; or Romounoi, as they call themselves[/U] -- Greco - Wallachs, as they are called by the Hellenes."[/COLOR][/B]

Carlin15 01-18-2018 08:28 PM

The Twentieth Century, Volume 6.

Page 937:
[COLOR="Blue"]"[B]The Greek population round Argos and Nauplia, we are told, was entirely exterminated, and replaced by Albanians[/B], who remain to-day. In [B]Aegina[/B] all the males were massacred, 6000 women and children were sold as slaves, and [B]their place was taken by the ancestors of the present Albanian inhabitants[/B]."[/COLOR]

Page 938:
[COLOR="Blue"]"In Greece proper, the Albanians occupied large areas abandoned by the rural population, and became the only inhabitants of some of the most famous sites. They cultivated the fields of Marathon and Plataea, and pastured their flocks on Helicon and Parnassus. The whole of Boeotia, Attica, Megaris, Corinthia, and Argolis, a great portion of Laconia and Messenia, Arcadia, Elis, and Acarnania were so colonised. Indeed, the Albanians appear to have done for Greece in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries something like that which the Sclavonians had done in the sixth and seventh."[/COLOR]

URL:
[url]https://books.google.ca/books?id=51gPAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA932&dq=slaves+were+chiefly+Thracians+Slavonians&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiM9KG-l7HYAhUn_IMKHbi-CRIQ6AEIMTAC#v=onepage&q=slaves%20were%20chiefly%20Thracians%20Slavonians&f=false[/url]

Carlin15 01-21-2018 11:06 PM

[SIZE=3][COLOR="#0000CD"][B]The Arvanites were so dominant in Attica that even the Bavarians who settled in Attica were forced to speak [U]Arvanitika[/U].[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE]

The following comes from the book [I]Arvanites[/I] written by Kostas [URL="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kostas_Biris"]Biris[/URL] in 1960. The actual title of the book in Greek is [I]Αρβανίτες οι Δωριείς του νεότερου Ελληνισμού: ιστορία των Ελλήνων Αρβανιτών[/I].

We read the following on Page 320:

"As for the presence of the Bavarians on the northern outskirts of Athens, the story is as follows: during the first years after Otto's coming to Greece, many of his compatriots decided to come and settle in Athens in the hope that they would find work here to live. However, the competition in the civil professions, both towards the Greek and the other Europeans and, most importantly, towards the Maltese and the Napolitans, has frustrated their predictions. Most were forced to return home, while for the rest and for the Bavarian guard, the "[URL="https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conseil_de_R%C3%A9gence_grec"]Leadership[/URL] of the Greek Rule" ([I]Αντιβασιλεία[/I]) was forced to give them an agricultural settlement. Indeed, in 1838 estates in Heraklion (Athens) were granted to them by those who had bought it for the Greek state from the Turks and exacted for them a poor settlement around a chapel of Catholic faith to which all of them belonged. They were also given horses and other supplies for the cultivation of their fields. Since they were neither farmers, nor the animals and supplies that were given to them were fit, they failed in their first attempts when Buchon visited them in 1841 during his tour of the northern suburbs of Athens. He predicted that their settlement would dissolve after a few years. However, they themselves, with their prowess and perseverance, denied these predictions. Because they adapted to not only the requirements of their new surroundings, but also to the inhabitants of the surrounding villages, and they have been completely assimilated. They received from their neighbours all the characteristics of the Attica peasant. That is why, even before they completed 100 years from their original establishment and settlement, as seen in Arakli or in the neighboring suburbs [U][B]the (Bavarian) villagers spoke Arvanitika, and others were astonished to hear German names, although they later found out that they did not even know German.[/B][/U]"

Sorry for the translation but I tried my best. Anyway here is the original text:

Όσο για την παρουσία των Βαυαρών στα βόρεια περίχωρα της Αθήνας η ιστορία έχει ως εξής: κατά τα πρώτα χρόνια μετά την κάθοδο του Όθωνος στην Ελλάδα, πολλοί συμπατριώτες του απεφάσισαν να έλθουν και να εγκατασταθούν στην Αθήνα με την ελπίδα ότι θα εύρισκαν εδώ εργασία να ζήσουν. Ο συναγωνισμός όμως στα αστικά επαγγέλματα, τόσο προς τους Έλληνας όσο και προς τους άλλους Ευρωπαίους παροίκους και - κυρίως - προς τους Μαλτέζους και τους Ναπολιτάνους, διέψευσε τις προβλέψεις τους. Οι περισσότεροι αναγκάσθηκαν να επιστρέψουν στην πατρίδα τους, ενώ για τους υπόλοιπους, καθώς και για τους απομάχους της βαυαρικής φρουράς, εφρόντισε η Αντιβασιλεία να τους δοθεί αγροτική εγκατάσταση. Πραγματικά, παρεχωρήθησαν σε αυτούς το 1838 κτήματα στο Ηράκλειο (της Αθήνας) από εκείνα που είχε εξαγοράσει το ελληνικό δημόσιο από τους Τούρκουςκαι εκτίσθη για αυτούς ένας φτωχός συνοικισμός γύρω από μιαν εκκλησούλα καθολικού δόγματος στην οποία ανήκαν όλοι. Τους εδόθηκαν επίσης άλογα και άλλα εφόδια για την καλλιέργεια των χωραφιών τους. Επειδή όμως ούτε αυτοί ήσαν γεωργοί, ούτε τα ζώα και τα εφόδια που τους έδωσαν ήταν κατάλληλα, απέτυχαν στις πρώτες προσπάθειές τους ώστε ο Buchon που τους επεσκέφθη το 1841 κατά την περιοδεία του στα βόρεια προάστεια της Αθήνας. προέβλεψε ότι ο συνοικισμός τους θα διαλυόταν ύστερα από μερικά χρόνια. Οι ίδιοι ωστόσο με την φιλοπονία και με την επιμονή τους διέψευσαν τις προβλέψεις του. Γιατί όχι μόνο στις απαιτήσεις της νέας τους επιδόσεως προσαρμόσθησαν αλλά και με τους κατοίκους των γύρω χωριών αφοιμοιώθηκαν τελείως. Και ενώ αυτοί έγιναν η αιτία να διαδοθή σε όλους ο πάνινος κούκος με το γείσο, παρέλαβαν από εκείνους όλα τα άλλα χαρακτηριστικά του χωρικού της Αττικής. Γι' αυτό και προτού συμπληρωθούν ακόμη 100 χρόνια από την αρχική τους εγκατάστασι, βλέποντας κανείς στο Αράκλι ή στα γειτονικά προάστεια χωρικούς να μιλούν αρβανίτικα, με κατάπληξη άκουε μεταξύ τους γερμανικά επώνυμα, αν και διεπίστωνε ύστερα ότι δεν ήξευραν ύστερα ούτε λέξι γερμανική.

από το βιβλίο του Κώστα Μπίρη - Αρβανίτες, οι δωριείς του νεώτερου ελληνισμού, Αθήνα 1960, σελίδα 320.

tchaiku 01-23-2018 12:20 PM

[QUOTE=Carlin15;171516]The Arvanites were so dominant in Attica that even the Bavarians who settled in Attica were forced to speak Arvanitika.
[/QUOTE]

No doubt Albanians were the dominant element in Attica, however I would use 'obligated' instead of 'forced'.

Carlin15 01-24-2018 11:04 PM

[QUOTE=tchaiku;171541]No doubt Albanians were the dominant element in Attica, however I would use 'obligated' instead of 'forced'.[/QUOTE]

You are correct.




The following comes from URL:
[url]https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/1911_Encyclop%C3%A6dia_Britannica/Macedonia[/url]

[I]1911 Encyclopædia Britannica/Macedonia[/I]

[COLOR="Blue"]- "With the exception of the southern and western districts already specified, the principal towns, and certain isolated tracts, [B]the whole of Macedonia is inhabited by a race or races speaking a Slavonic dialect[/B]. If language is adopted as a test, the great bulk of the rural population must be described as Slavonic. [B]The Slavs first crossed the Danube [U]at the beginning of the 3rd century[/U], but their great immigration took place in the 6th and 7th centuries[/B]."

- "After its subjugation by the Romans the country was divided into four districts separated by rigid political and social limitations. Before long it was constituted a province, which in the time of Augustus was assigned to the senate. Thenceforward it followed the fortunes of the Roman empire, and, after the partition of that dominion, of its eastern branch. [B][U]Its Thraco-Illyrian inhabitants[/U] had already been largely [U]latinized[/U] when Constantine the Great made Byzantium the imperial residence in A.D. 330; [U]they called themselves Romans and spoke Latin[/U].[/B] Towards the close of the 4th century the country was devastated by the Goths and Avars, whose incursions possessed no lasting significance. [B]It was otherwise with the great Slavonic immigration, which took place [U]at intervals from the 3rd to the 7th century[/U]. An important ethnographic change was brought about, and the greater part of Macedonia was colonized by the invaders[/B]..."

- "The well-wooded and cultivated [B]districts of Grevena and Castoria, which are [U]mainly inhabited by a Vlach population[/U][/B], are remarkably beautiful, and the scenery around Lakes Ochrida and Prespa is exceedingly picturesque."

- "[B]The Greek and Vlach populations are [U]not always easily distinguished[/U][/B], as a considerable proportion of the Vlachs have been [B]hellenized[/B]. Both show a remarkable aptitude for commerce..."[/COLOR]









[url=https://imgur.com/oEsZgbt][img]http://i.imgur.com/oEsZgbt.jpg[/img][/url]

[url=https://imgur.com/w8MrP15][img]http://i.imgur.com/w8MrP15.jpg[/img][/url]

[url=https://imgur.com/aYxUVKb][img]http://i.imgur.com/aYxUVKb.png[/img][/url]

[url=https://imgur.com/mtg7XQJ][img]http://i.imgur.com/mtg7XQJ.jpg[/img][/url]

Carlin15 01-26-2018 07:11 PM

The Greek World War II Hero Manolis Glezos (Ethnic Arvanite/Albanian) declares in Greek Parliament to Minister of Education of Greece: ”You have a foreign name, you do not have a Greek name. You are Arvanite..."

[B]Youtube video link:[/B]
[URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-XTS-2TaCM"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-XTS-2TaCM[/URL]

Carlin15 01-27-2018 04:26 PM

John Haldon
[url=https://imgur.com/QpDqpSP][img]http://i.imgur.com/QpDqpSP.png[/img][/url]


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