Macedonia and NATO

[Pelister]

Name Talks - How has it come this?

http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/12295/45/

Latest message from Spanish FM.

Spain will help Macedonia find a name solution so that it can begin the process of E.U accession.

Since when was becoming a member of the E.U contingent on a name change?

If you look at the change in NATO and E.U position in terms of Macedonia entering those organizations, over the last 18-24 months, the policy shift is remarkable.

These organizations we ready to admit Macedonia by its Constitutional Name. The ONLY obstacle was a Greek veto.

NOW, the E.U and NATO have fully backed the terms put to us by Greece.

The decision to negotiate was the first mistake, and making its a foriegn policy goal - parading it like a centre piece all around the world, has convinced the rest of the world we must be serious. What a fking disaster for us poor Macedonians?

And finally to have UMD back these Western institutions, even though they negate us, only shows that the lunacy and madness in the Macedonian government is infectious.

Why not take the U.N to the ICJ? Why abandon the ONLY reasonable and BEST option we have?

[Prolet]

Pelister, Did you watch this interview??

http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?t=2615

Its bloody disgusting, i cannot believe that people like this exist in the world.

[Bill77]

Just another version of this threads topic.


Moratinos: Skopje and Athens are close to name row settlement, Spain ready to help


Brussels, February 4 (MIA) - Speaking to the European Parliament Foreign Policy Committee, Spanish Foreign Minister Miguel Moratinos announced that he would soon visit Skopje, Radio Deutsche Welle - Macedonian language programme reported on Thursday.

Athens and Skopje are close to settling the name row, Moratinos said, pointing out that the new Greek Government's position on the matter is rather satisfactory. Taking MEPs questions, Moratinos said Spain's EU Presidency was ready to do its best to that effect.

- Both parties have been working under the UN auspice, and at the moment it is better for them to talk with each other with the support of the world organization. If European intervention is to be needed, the Spanish Presidency is ready for that. For this purpose I have naturally decided to visit Skopje in the near future and reaffirm this position, Moratinos said.

Referring to other Western Balkan countries, Moratinos said the region would not be forgotten as it was among the priorities of the EU Presidency.





Realy, is there something our Gov knows that the rest of the Macedonians don't? or is Moratinos talking shit?

[fyrOM]

As posts of this forum have rightfully pointed out the west supported Greece by firstly creating the modern Greek state and then the Greek lie to explain to the world why Greece has a right to occupy the territory that it does. Are we now to expect the west to admit that they lied. Nobody likes to admit they lied.

It is far more convenient if a small group like the Macedonians decided to call themselves eg north Macedonians as if they are some other race and the lie still holds and no one needs to explain why they lied. The best we could hope for is some ancient artefact to be dug up in Macedonia where it wont be hidden from sight as I think would happen with items found in Greece which didn’t suit their story to blow the whole lie apart or the grey elephant in the corner solution as the Germans seemed to prefer of don’t throw the lie think in our face even though we know your right and well quietly support you. Spain an France have their own minority rights and territory issues with the Basques so it is no wonder they are supporting Greece. Trust none of them.

[King Makedon]

Has someone watched the TV Debate at the TV Show "Nie" yesterday at 1230 CET, between Macedonian historians and those of our southern neighbour??? Damn, I missed it.

[Stojacanec]

Has someone watched the TV Debate at the TV Show "Nie" yesterday at 1230 CET, between Macedonian historians and those of our southern neighbour??? Damn, I missed it.

Can someone provide a youtube link to the show or a transcript of what took place?

ThanX

[Struja]

Has someone watched the TV Debate at the TV Show "Nie" yesterday at 1230 CET, between Macedonian historians and those of our southern neighbour??? Damn, I missed it.

I too would like to see this debate..

[Pelister]

E.U and NATO send Macedonia an ultimatum

End the dispute with Greece or never enter the E.U and NATO.

http://www.mia.com.mk/default.aspx?vId=71498312&lId=2

Skopje, February 12 (MIA) - Macedonia must solve the name problem if it wants to join EU and NATO, said former Danish Foreign Minister Uffe Ellemann-Jensen in his address upon receiving order "September 8", presented by President Gjorge Ivanov on Friday.

"You will kept out of the structures you want to join until the name issue is resolved. This is unfair, beyond any reason and the common European and Atlantic interests, but this is a fact of life", added Jensen.

According to him, the conflict that has become a tangled knot, could be settled through compromise, which can be reached in two ways.

"Alexander the Great found an efficient way to solve the Gordian Knot. I hope we all agree that Alexander's method would not bring us closer to the problem at hand. This problem should be resolved through compromise, where concerned parties will have to budge from their stances. The best solution is always the one which makes both parties satisfied. However, this was not possible until now. The second-best solution would probably be a compromise where both sides are a bit dissatisfied, because for a solution to be sustainable, there must be no winners and no losers", said the former Danish FM.

According to Jensen, being a small country of multiethnic structure, Macedonia would most efficiently cope with coming challenges if it joined EU and NATO.

Jensen warned that time is running out, whereas the price of maintaining positions that Macedonia regards as fair and reasonable may exceed the gains of ending the impasse and start the process of EU and NATO integration.

"Once you join these structures, you will be in a much better position to defend your interests", he stressed.

President Ivanov said in his address that order "September 8" recognizes Jensen as Macedonia's great friend, acknowledging his personal contribution in the establishment of Macedonia-Denmark diplomatic ties, as well as for his continual support to Macedonia since its independence.

He referred to a number of Jensen's comments supporting Macedonia and its statehood from the time of chairing the EC Council of Ministers in 1993 and as country's foreign minister, but also as leader of the Danish Liberal Party and the European liberals.

"Although you live far from the Balkans, You share the injustice that has been imposed on us. There are no dilemmas where Macedonia is going and where it belongs. Macedonia - faced with such absurd and lack of principles - has always needed people of vision, such as the vision of Uffe Ellemann-Jensen, who has continually stood on the side of the truth", underlined President Ivanov.

Uffe Ellemann-Jensen was Denmark's Foreign Minister in period 1982-1993 and is considered creator of Danish foreign policy better known as "Ellemann-Jensen Doctrine". He led the Danish Liberal Party from 1984-1998 and the European Liberals (1995-2000). In the course of his mandate, the Kingdom of Denmark recognized the Republic of Macedonia in 1993, whereas countries established diplomatic ties.

More blackmail?

Are the Greek terms reasonable and fair? Is it reasonable and fair for us to be discussing the terms of our extinction? What you say that this is evidence that the E.U has backed Greece in what can only be described as an illegitimate dispute?

[drle]

I think Greece has enough issues of their own at the moment...they are on the verge of being bankrupt and they're worried about the name issue....

In terms of the EU & Nato they have absolutely no right to give Macedonia an ulimatum...

[Dejan]

It's easy to end this dispute, just pull out of negotiations, and viola!.

[Risto the Great]

"You will kept out of the structures you want to join until the name issue is resolved. This is unfair, beyond any reason and the common European and Atlantic interests, but this is a fact of life", added Jensen.

But the EU & NATO are not about being fair are they.

[Jankovska]

We should stick it to the EU and NATO and say , thanks, but no thanks. Bring back our soldiers and start exchanging soliders and military training with Turkey. Give something and get something back. The EU will be shitting themselves to see that and Greece will not sleep for decades.

[Serdarot]

...Bring back our soldiers...

you are "my man" (woman )

we have to admit that we are helping invading force, send official appologise to the Iraki and Afganistan people, and bring our girls and boys back home.

we conquered the world once, no need to do it again, nothing good cames out of conquering foreign lands...

and not to mention that WE pay the costs
and not to mention that exactly those girls and boys are much needed in Makedonia...


about the "ultimatum"

i am "hard core nationalist"

i would send ultimatum to EU and Nato

without appologise for the Genocid and Exodus made from the "greeks" with help of their masters, we do not want ot enter your organisations.

without appologise for the crimes made from the "bulgars" , also we dont need those organizations

i was proud that we NEVER joined the wrong alliance, till recently...

we were not with the fascist in the ww2
we were not with the austro-ungaria in the ww1

better to die defending the country and our homes, families, freedom, than to die in Irak or Afganistan

[sydney]

macedonia needs to start issuing "fuck you" medals to these 'europeans'. will we ever be afforded any dignity?!

[Serdarot]

Respect has to be earned

so long we let our weak politicians to claim that "...90 % of the Macedonians want to join Nato an EU" , nothing will change

50 or 100 000 people on demonstration against the discriminations and humiliations we are put on, will change that...