Persecution of Macedonian Christians in greece

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  • DedoAleko
    Member
    • Jun 2009
    • 969

    Persecution of Macedonian Christians in greece

    Persecution of Macedonian Christians in greece

    Religious Freedom Abuses – The Case of the Macedonian Orthodox Christian Minority in greece

    Last month, the United Macedonian Diaspora (UMD) published a new report: greece: Religious Freedom Abuses – The Case of the Macedonian Orthodox Christian Minority. The report outlines the culture of abuse inherent to the greek legal system concerning the lack of religious freedom, and it outlines the grievances of recent immigrants, the historic Turkish minority in Thrace, and the indigenous Macedonian Orthodox Christian community in northern Greece.
    The report raises a number of concerns arising out of the lack of any formal or informal separation of church and state in Greece, resulting in the greek Orthodox Church being de facto an organ of the greek government. Article 3 of the greek Constitution defines the greek Orthodox Church (GOC) as “the prevailing religion.” Thus, only the greek Orthodox clergy are considered civil servants, and practices such as proselytism and cremation are forbidden. The legal system does not allow religions other than greek Orthodox to legally practice, as in the high-profile prosecutions against the Turkish Muftis of Xanthi, cases that were later abrogated at the European Court of Human Rights.
    The report states that a number of religious groups face significant religious freedom violations there, including Macedonian Orthodox Christian followers, Muslims, Jews, Catholics, Scientologists, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormons, evangelical Christians, and other Protestants.
    The plight of the Macedonian Orthodox Christian minority in greece is even more desperate. The greek Government has denied a permit to re-establish the Macedonian Orthodox Church at Aridea for two decades, and has imposed complex procedural punishments for the vast majority of the Macedonian population. For example, greek priests refuse to baptize children with Macedonian names, and GOC leaders like Metropolitan Anthimos of Thessaloniki actively encourage violence against Macedonians on nationwide state-funded television. As public employees, a network of GOC informants coordinate with the state police to suppress all Macedonian human rights activities in the country.

    Archimandrite Nikodim Tsarknias with Dr. Suzan Johnson Cook
    The religious leader of the Macedonian Orthodox Christian community of greece, Archimandrite Nikodim Tsarknias, visited Washington, D.C. in October 2012 and met with Dr. Suzan Johnson Cook, the U.S. Ambassador-at-Large for International Religious Freedom. Archimandrite Tsarknias brought to Ambassador Johnson Cook’s attention the challenges of the Macedonian Orthodox faith community in greece and the greek government’s long-standing policy of hampering down on faith-based communities.
    The Archimandrite entered the ranks of the greek Orthodox Church 39 years ago. Following several disagreements over a 20-year-period with greek Orthodox Church authorities for his preaching the Bible in the Macedonian language, the Church defrocked him. Since then, he has been jailed, beaten by police, intimidated by the greek secret services and till this day has not been allowed to build a fully-functioning Macedonian Orthodox Church in greece. Archimandrite Tsarknias lives with tremendous fear for his life on a daily basis, and has been subjected to over a dozen lawsuits and arrest warrants, costing him and the Macedonian community in greece over 50,000 euros in legal fees.
    UMD hopes to see Athens guarantee equal religious freedom for all greek citizens and residents, in accordance with international law. UMD calls upon greece to ratify the European Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities and to actively and in good faith secure religious freedom for all religious minorities in greece.

    izvor: http://www.venninstitute.org/uncateg...ians-in-greece
  • Phoenix
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2008
    • 4671

    #2
    Originally posted by DedoAleko View Post
    Persecution of Macedonian Christians in greece


    The report states that a number of religious groups face significant religious freedom violations there, including Macedonian Orthodox Christian followers, Muslims, Jews, Catholics, Scientologists, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Mormons, evangelical Christians, and other Protestants.
    ...you're fuckin' kidding me Meto, is there really that many 'scientologists' in greece that anyone should give a fuck about them...or are you trying to impress some of your looney 'scientologist' friends...

    Comment

    • Risto the Great
      Senior Member
      • Sep 2008
      • 15658

      #3
      Scientologists are people too!

      Having said that, here are a few sage observations from the interweb:

      An Atheist, a Christian, and a Scientologist walk into a bar.

      The Atheist and Christian then brutally murder the Scientologist for being such a stupid cunt.
      How many Scientologists does it take to change a lightbulb?

      2, one to change the lightbulb and another to tell Tom they cost $10,000 each.

      What do you call Scientology for retards?
      Scientology
      Risto the Great
      MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
      "Holding my breath for the revolution."

      Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

      Comment

      • Phoenix
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2008
        • 4671

        #4
        Originally posted by Risto the Great View Post
        Scientologists are people too!
        Yeah they are but seriously, who gives a rats arse about them...

        That's the problem with UMD, a disturbing lack of clarity and focus to concentrate on the important things and those that they supposedly 'represent'.

        Very cheap UMD politicking.

        Comment

        • Risto the Great
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 15658

          #5
          It's taken them years to spell out some of the nastiness inflicted on Macedonia by ethnic Albanians. The UMD seems to find itself reluctant to offend anyone.
          Risto the Great
          MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
          "Holding my breath for the revolution."

          Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

          Comment

          • EricTheRed
            Junior Member
            • Oct 2012
            • 41

            #6
            DedoAleko, your report is a bit biased. You failed to mention article 13 par.1 of the greek constitution, which clearly states that religion is irrelevant regarding individual rights. Moreover, the quite important par.2 of the same article states that all known religions can freely operate within greece under the protection of the law, while par.3 dictates that the ministers of all known religions are subject to the same supervision of the state and to the same obligations towards it as those of the prevailing religion.

            Regarding the known religions part, which may sound fishy at first due to vague formulation, it is interpreted by the courts and the theorists as the following: Known religions are those whose teachings and worship take place publicly, do not break the laws, are not against common morals and whose religious hierarchy is clear. Frankly, this provision is used against satanists etc, in case they manage to find a window in regular laws(very rare). No one wants even to hear the notion of human sacrifice.

            The above clearly shows that the legal system allows almost all religions to operate within Greece. I really dont know much about the specific case you mention, but to abruptly declare that ''The legal system does not allow religions other than greek Orthodox to legally practice is clearly wrong. Regarding the Muftis, did anyone tell you that they actually receive salary from the Greek government, just like orthodox priests? The reason they are prosecuted is not because they are Muslim, but because they take advantage of their position to promote Turkish separatist propaganda amongst Greek Muslim citizens(an act illegal in almost every country on Earth).

            If the Orthodox Macedonian Church promotes separatist claims as well, it is expected that it will be not allowed to operate, since this means breaking the law. If it doesnt, then it really is an unfair decision on behalf of the greek government. Truth be told, the former is a much more likely outcome....

            Would you like it if the Republic of Macedonia allowed Albanian Muslim organizations to promote the seperation of parts of western Macedonia amongst other things? I guess not. Unfair or not, it's the duty of any government to safeguard the country they run against such stuff.

            Comment

            • sydney
              Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 390

              #7
              All that hogwash just to claim Macedonians are separatists. Same old paranoia.

              Comment

              • EricTheRed
                Junior Member
                • Oct 2012
                • 41

                #8
                Originally posted by sydney View Post
                All that hogwash just to claim Macedonians are separatists. Same old paranoia.
                Nope. DedoAleko claimed that no other religion except GOC is allowed in Greece by law. I couldnt let such bs unanswered.

                Btw, since 40-50% of the content of this Macedonian forum is about Greece, one can only assume that many here are paranoid about this country.

                Comment

                • sydney
                  Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 390

                  #9
                  Such a shining democracy, aren't you?!

                  Comment

                  • Давидски
                    Junior Member
                    • Feb 2012
                    • 4

                    #10
                    What!!! Macedonia persecutes its Protestants so publishing that report just seems so hypocritical! That's why I left Macedonian Nationalism cause your just as bad as the Greeks in your racism and Persecution!

                    Comment

                    • Gocka
                      Senior Member
                      • Dec 2012
                      • 2306

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Давидски View Post
                      What!!! Macedonia persecutes its Protestants so publishing that report just seems so hypocritical! That's why I left Macedonian Nationalism cause your just as bad as the Greeks in your racism and Persecution!
                      We do not "persecute" anyone, not even the albanians, so please dont spread bullshit around.

                      Comment

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