Smilkovci Lake Killings

[Vangelovski]

First of all I will say I am pretty happy that they arrested these extremists. We have some hope that not only the police did their job but the press did as well (at least what I saw so far).

Why don't you self styled patriots come up with some ideas rather than complain like a bunch of cowards and whiners.

Fucking Greeks never whine like this, even during their debt crisis. They're poor, corrupt, chauvinistic and irresponsible. But they never blame themselves. Macedonians (on this forum) however even have the audacity to question if these fucking assholes are guilty.

Then you have the ultimate discussion-Who is more Patriotic? The people in Macedonia or the diaspora? As if we didn't need more bullshit in our lives. I think the guys that I just described here are worse than any Albanian or Greek. Macedonian truth?!!? Really?

Freedom isn't just about freedom from foreign powers, its also about freedom from tyrannical government. If you want to live in a lawless society where the mob (people like you) determine guilt based on a couple of media reports or the state is able to harass INNOCENT (think about what that means) people in order to capture criminals and terrorists, then knock yourself out. But that is not the Macedonia that I'm interested in. I'm interested in a Macedonia in which the rule of law applies equally to everyone and in which statutory law in based on natural law.

As for Greeks not blaming themselves and blaming everyone else, that is the height of lunacy and the absolute WRONG way in which society should function - if they want to sort their problems out as opposed to digging themselves in even deeper.

Finally, what truth are you questioning? What exactly are you suggesting - that we should blindly follow the Macedonian Government, the barer of all "truth"? Lets not forget that it was only in 2002 that the Macedonian Police rounded up and murdered 7 INNOCENT Pakistani's and claimed it was part of the 'war on terror'. At the moment, these 3 (or 5, depending on which reports you read) are murder/terror suspects and innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Once that happens we can pat the Macedonian police on the back and say 'job well done'.

As for those extremists that are protesting, they need to be shown for what they are - racist extremists mixed up with radical Islamists. But I fear the Macedonian Government will not be up to the task and given past experience, is more likely to end up portraying them as "freedom fighters" pursing "legitimate grievances".

[Soldier of Macedon]

Why don't you self styled patriots come up with some ideas rather than complain like a bunch of cowards and whiners.

What needs to be done has explained several times here. If a naive fool like yourself doesn't want to be in our company, why are you still here? Get lost already and take your pro-Gruevski BS with you.

Macedonians (on this forum) however even have the audacity to question if these fucking assholes are guilty.

Who has questioned if the murderers are guilty?

[Brian]

hahaha just when i thought the macedonians in the republic get any more pathetic this happens

What a sad joke of a country macedonia has become.

The lazy macedonians could only get 500 football hooligans to protest against the fanatical shiptars, but the shiptars were able to get 10,000+ to protest in the capital city of macedonia, and make themselves out to be the victims!.
Skopje has much more macedonians compared to shiptars, yet they were able to get 10,000+ to come out lol

Geez BBS, you don't ask for much, from the photos it looks like a sunny day, who could be bothered to walk around on a hot day for hours when you can kick-back with a beer and watch it all on TV.

Its also sad because this large turn out to me shows that there is most probably no albanian in macedonia that cares about those innocent 5 people who were murdered, and that as per usual, the shiptars are innocent, and its all the macedonians fault.....

Of course it's the Macedonians fault, they let their blood splatter all over the place when they got shot traumatising the poor Albanians so much they had to run away and because of the trauma suffered will probably never be able to work again thus deserving a State pension to support them and their families.

How can macedonia be saved when macedonians dont care about macedonia, they put more effort into getting bulgarian passports, bringing ceca to Prilep and partying it up in Ohrid

Priorities BBS, how else would you want to pass the time until you're in the EU and can flee the place for a 'Hollywood' lifestyle we all enjoy in the West? - Kebapi, beer, Ceca and partying in Ohrid (if you're poor) or golden Greece, and if you can't wait then become a Bulgarian and catch the next plane out!

[BigMak]

Is it that hard to comprehend posts these days? What does the term innocent mean to you? Does it mean someone involved in terrorism? Can you check exactly what my comments were in relation to before making silly statements?

mmmm call it what you will, so lets re-cap tom,

what is your definition of "innocent" in regards to this particular scenario.

[Vangelovski]

And Tom you meat head knock on the door of the Preston Community Centre or ask the Church Committee there why they kicked you out of both for being a loud mouth idiot
I see nothing much chances here with you. Or better yet how about you do another round of your insightful observations of Macedonian Intelligence vs Police vs Counter Terrorist personal uniform and small arms insignia as a sign of MASSIVE conspiracy great A class effort.

Are you referring to me? I've never even been to the Preston Community Centre and I don't even live in Melbourne.

Noone suggested a conspiracy, I merely suggested we cannot trust a government that lies to us on a daily basis. And yes, the uniforms still don't match, but that's just irrelevant details for you.

[Soldier of Macedon]

After being repeatedly warned for his profanity and idiocy, Zarni/Frank has been banned. We are not going to keep wasting our time deleting his incoherent garbage.

[Vangelovski]

mmmm call it what you will, so lets re-cap tom,

what is your definition of "innocent" in regards to this particular scenario.

You for example - someone who had no involvement in, or knowledge of, what happened. Are you really having that much difficulty in understanding the concept of 'innocence'? Or are you trying to be a plastic patriot?

No one has suggested that those involved should not be arrested, prosecuted and convicted so you can dismantle your 'straw man' and stop trying to knock him down.

[Vangelovski]

Watch carefully the videos of the raids...

I did. Why, what is it you want to point out? Did you identify each suspect in each video? Are you holding on to evidence that no one else knows about through your international network of nut jobs?

True (what you say) if it were true Vangelovski but from the videos of the raids every house had a stash of guns and stuff, so are they innocent?

Most homes in Macedonia have a stash of guns. What does that prove?

A. Is there such a thing as an innocent Albanian?

How does this fit with the below?

Hey, LOL, just because I'm from Australia doesn't necessarily mean I'm from convict stock.

LOL. Yeah, you suggested such re the 'gotta love the USA or else "(I'm) a hypocrite" stuff', remember.

No, I don't remember, show me where.

Look, your right about if any innocents have been arrested ect

So why all the fuss?

I just don't believe any of them are innocent, even the old-bag with the stash of guns in her house. She can barely walk, but if you're caught with the stash all I can say is evil spawn usually come from an evil pichka - just because old people look like cute and friendly now doesn't mean they weren't rotten shits in their time nor that their mind or soul has change. Hang the bitch and everyone of her mutant demon offspring.Period.

Maybe they are all guilty, but again, what does having a stash of guns prove?

[Ljubanec]

After being repeatedly warned for his profanity and idiocy, Zarni/Frank has been banned. We are not going to keep wasting our time deleting his incoherent garbage.

If only he agreed with you maybe he could of stayed a bit longer?

[Soldier of Macedon]

I couldn't care less if he didn't agree with me. You don't agree with me and I haven't banned you. The reason why he was sent packing is because he kept using profanity to refer to members of this forum. The same reason he was banned by his previous username of 'Frank'. And he was warned to stop several times prior, both in public and private correspondence. I suggest you stop creating fictional garbage.

[Ljubanec]

Vangelovski, you are absolutely wrong.

[Vangelovski]

Vangelovski, you are absolutely wrong.

About what and why? Or should we just take your word for it?

You sound like a prime candidate to be the first ever immigrant to North Korea.

[BigMak]

You for example - someone who had no involvement in, or knowledge of, what happened. Are you really having that much difficulty in understanding the concept of 'innocence'? Or are you trying to be a plastic patriot?

No one has suggested that those involved should not be arrested, prosecuted and convicted so you can dismantle your 'straw man' and stop trying to knock him down.

Do you always reply in a insulting manner? This still leaves the unexplained VANGELOVSKI concept of the innocent, the 5 killed, and the arrested, so who is innocent? I gather your are meaning the 5 killed,or are you writing in code again?

Or should I just agree with you and your concept of innocents and arguably the most pathetic display of military arms and attire knowledge.

[Vangelovski]

Do you always reply in a insulting manner? This still leaves the unexplained VANGELOVSKI concept of the innocent, the 5 killed, and the arrested, so who is innocent? I gather your are meaning the 5 killed,or are you writing in code again?

Or should I just agree with you and your concept of innocents and arguably the most pathetic display of military arms and attire knowledge.

BigMak, I have no idea what you're on about and I'm beginning to think you don't either. Perhaps quote the post you are referring to.

In terms of the weapons, you probably didn't even have a clue what a Steyr or a TAR 21 were before this (let alone actually handled one) and in relation to the uniforms, I still have not seen a Macedonian police or military unit with multi-cam pattern.

[Soldier of Macedon]

This still leaves the unexplained VANGELOVSKI concept of the innocent, the 5 killed, and the arrested, so who is innocent? I gather your are meaning the 5 killed,or are you writing in code again?

He isn't talking in "code", and he already defined 'innocent'. What exactly are you confused about, BigMak? Or are you just trying to follow in the footsteps of a certain someone? Don't go backwards.