Smilkovci Lake Killings

[Zarni]

This is optimistic

I too hope unlike the case of the murder of Trajovski and the attempted assignation of Gligorov we have an agency and men on the ground with lots of talent and professional will solve this murder for our Nation and people

[United MKD]

Kаде исчезнаа Ахмети, Тачи и Османи?

Една недела по грозоморната егзекуција не слушнавме изјави од лидерите на владејачката ДУИ, Али Ахмети, и опозициските ДПА и НДП, Мендух Тачи и Руфи
Османи. Тие не ~ се обратија на јавноста, а, од друга страна, свежи се сеќавањата дека по убиството на двајца гостиварци не само што дадоа изјави за осуда туку и беа дел од протестите и ги посетија семејствата на убиените.

Додека со изјави на осуда за злосторството, пораки да се најдат сторителите, но и укажувања да нема колективно обвинување на една етничка заедница, лично се изјаснија сите кај нас и во странство, па дури и премиерите на Албанија и на kосово, Сали Бериша и Хашим Тачи, една недела по грозоморната егзекуција не слушнавме изјави од лидерите на владејачката ДУИ, Али Ахмети, и опозициските ДПА и НДП, Мендух Тачи и Руфи Османи. Тие не и~се обратија на јавноста, а од друга страна, свежи се сеќавањата дека по убиството на двајца гостиварци, не само што дадоа изјави за осуда туку и беа дел од протестите и ги посетија семејствата на убиените.

Политикологот Јове kекеновски смета дека медиумите во Македонија биле крајно коректни и воздржани во известувањето иако целта на егзекуцијата била да се разгорат верските и националните страсти. Според него, дури и целата јавност била воздржана по едно вакво грозоморно убиство.

- Ме зачудува зошто ниеден лидер на партиите на Албанците не даде изјава за злосторството. За мене, ова е страшно оти без разлика кој е извршител и кој е егзекутиран, лидерите требаше лично да го осудат злосторството, а не тоа да го направат преку соопштенија. Изјавата на Муса Џафери е во контекст на маргинализирање и минимизирање на трагедијата што го снајде македонскиот народ. Тоа е обид да се скрие вистинскиот мотив за убиствата - смета kекеновски.

За вицепремиерот Муса Џафери, ситуацијата во земјава по петкратното убиство на македонските граѓани не е таква како што се прикажува во медиумите. Тој ги обвини медиумите дека креваат тензии и целата ситуација ја прикажуваат како алармантна. Потпретседателот на Владата ова го изјавил за државната косовска телевизија. Од кабинетот на Џафери вчера не можевме да добиеме одговор, прво, кои се аргументите дека медиумите креваат тензии и, второ, зошто го минимизира грозоморното злосторство што се случи кај Железарското Езеро.

- Ситуацијата во Македонија се стабилизира, случајот е под истрага и треба што побрзо да заврши за да се затворат шпекулациите - изјави Џафери за РТk.

Вицепремиерот ги критикува медиумите дека ситуацијата во Македонија ја прикажуваат како алармантна:

- На настанот му се дава медиумска димензија, тој не е толку алармантен како што изгледа во печатот. Спортските навивачи почнаа да се солидаризираат, но нивните протести преминаа во вандализам.

Тој изјавил дека освен социјалните мрежи, институциите не оставиле простор на случајот да му се припишат меѓуетнички мотиви. Изјавата на Џафери вчера ја пренесоа неколку портали на албански јазик.

Неофицијално, коментарите за изјавата на Џафери се дека таа е политичка и оти вицепремиерот не сакал да прикаже пред медиумите од соседството дека ситуацијата во Македонија е толку тензична. Целта била да се смират страстите.

Не е првпат политичари-Албанци од Македонија да излегуваат со различни ставови за домашните и за странските медиуми. Неодамна, токму Џафери повторно беше „изваден од контекст“ во изјава за косовски медиум.

Експертите што ги консултираше „Дневник“ оценуваат дека нема оправдување да се маргинализира или минимизира петкратното злосторство, ниту вината за нараснатите меѓуетнички тензии да им се припишуваат на медиумите.

- Не сакам да коментирам политички изјави. Политичарите имаат право да дадат свои политички оцени, но за тоа носат и одговорност. По петкратното убиство ситуацијата е крајно сериозна. Не сакам да коментирам зашто функционерите овој ужасен настан може го гледаат од политичка, а јас од хумана призма - вели политикологот Имер Исмаили.

Петкратното убиство, ситуацијата по него и односите меѓу Македонците и Албанците, според најавите на албанските медиуми, денеска и утре ќе бидат централна тема на средбите на претседателот на Албанија, Бамир Топи, со македонскиот државен врв и со политичките лидери Ахмети, Тачи и Црвенковски.

http://www.dnevnik.com.mk/?itemid=adf9dc1a070e144b81ac9bd5a78cdbe6

[Niko777]

I am referring to Albanians calming their so-called 'demands' regarding linguistic and cultural 'equality' if the economic situation were to improve. Do you think that is a possibility?

SoM, I used to be a huge believer in this. The problem is that the Republic of Macedonia did a poor job enforcing Macedonian nationalism in Albanians. For example, we have seen thousands of Albanians get employed by state institutions, only to misuse their powers and make more demands from the state. This is because Macedonia could not show them even the slightest amount of discipline, that is, a state job comes with loyalty and respect to the state. Instead Albanians who get employed by the state are led to believe that they can do whatever they want because they are put in groups with other Albanians and their manager is Albanian, and not only that but signs are in Albanian and the Albanian flag is flying on government buildings.

As for the private sector employing Albanians, the situation would be the same if the company is owned by Albanians.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Vangelovski if you are such a candle of wisdom ready your passport and spend time in Macedonia with the people........

Have you taken your own advice? Are you intending to take your own advice?

......not tally all your energy on a shitty Forum like this in Internet space

If it is such a shitty forum for somebody like yourself (don't presume you can speak on behalf of others here), what are you doing here? What are you doing for the Macedonian Cause, Zarni? Here, I will help you kick it off with one example: you posted a message on a news website because of the error they made regarding the dead fishermen. Please expand on the list and teach us how it's supposed to be done, champ.

You now what....many of you need to get away from this Forum for a few days

This recent loopy attitude you've developed can't be good for you. Perhaps you need to take a break.

SoM, I used to be a huge believer in this. The problem is that the Republic of Macedonia did a poor job enforcing Macedonian nationalism in Albanians. For example, we have seen thousands of Albanians get employed by state institutions, only to misuse their powers and make more demands from the state. This is because Macedonia could not show them even the slightest amount of discipline, that is, a state job comes with loyalty and respect to the state. Instead Albanians who get employed by the state are led to believe that they can do whatever they want because they are put in groups with other Albanians and their manager is Albanian, and not only that but signs are in Albanian and the Albanian flag is flying on government buildings.

I can't disagree with you there mate, successive Macedonian governments have done a terrible job of promoting a unified citizenry based on Macedonian heritage.

[George S.]

Donate and help the families of our 5 slain Macedonians



For Borche’s family - Ace Dobrev Stevkovski zhirosmetka account number 530500013935268 Ohrid Bank.


For Filip’s family - Stefka Slavkovska zh-account 300007040286323 Commercial Bank AD Skopje.


For Kire’s family - Trichkovska Juliana zh-account number 300007080491368 at party 80491345 Commercial Bank.


For Aleksander’s family - Goran Nakjevski 20002410498395 Commercial Bank


For the Acevski family - Dimo Acevski 300007047813329 Commercial Bank.

Let us show our support to the families of our slain Macedonians. Let us show then that we care and are here for them!

Organizers:


National coordinating body “Humanitarian actions in Macedonia”

Organizer - Coalition of NGOs.





Донирајте и помогнете на Семејствата на нашите убиени Македонци


За семејството на Борче - Аце Стевковски жиросметка 530500013935268 Охридска банка.


За семејството на Филип - Стефка Славковска ж-сметка 300007040286323 Комерцијална Банка ад Скопје.


За семејството на Кире - Тричковска Јулијана ж-сметка 300007080491368 број на партија 80491345 комерцијална банка.


За семејството на Александар - Горан Наќевски 20002410498395 Стопанска банка.


За семејството на Ацевски - Димо Ацевски 300007047813329 Комерцијална банка .

Да покажеме дека не забораваме на семејствата на нашите убиени Македонци. Да покажеме дека сме тука за нив!

Организатори
Национално координативно тело ,,Хуманитарни акции во Македонија,,

Организатор - Коалиција на Невладини организации .

[Zarni]

Have you taken your own advice? Are you intending to take your own advice?

Would you beleive me if I told you
Look there is a ten thousand spread thread on educating the Macedonians back home on shaking their collective shackles Forum members here are absorbed with it I have not once been involved not once. I have spent lots of time with Macedonains back home ever wondered how our attitude here would be seen by the folks back home why are there so few active members on this Forum I address this to both you Admins

Komita is the only local Macedonian resident that posts which most of you regard as a lunatic

If it is such a shitty forum for somebody like yourself (don't presume you can speak on behalf of others here), what are you doing here? What are you doing for the Macedonian Cause, Zarni? Here

In all hoenstly the UMD has more merit then the MTO which is just Internet real estate and a Message Board comon isn't the later statement true. I asked forum members here to just post a complaint to the Washington Post and Associated Press nobody responded that was a small effort to be made for the cause

Onur said it politely I will say it again so many of you have an romantic view, a thousands of miles away perspective view
Yesterday I sitting with a NGO of ASX listed Company and suggested Macedonia as a Resource venture capital destination it was intersting to here his views

This recent loopy attitude you've developed can't be good for you. Perhaps you need to take a break.

I think I will take a permanent holiday thanks for helping me decide that will make me join a growing number of lost members leaving the MTO for green pastures just think about that before just brushing me off but then again I really dont care

[Vangelovski]

Vangelovski if you are such a candle of wisdom ready your passport and spend time in Macedonia with the people not tally all your energy on a shitty Forum like this in Internet space

You now what....many of you need to get away from this Forum for a few days

Zarni, do you suffer from an intellectual disability? Didn't you read my posts about the time I've spent in Macedonia and some of what I did with my time there? What exactly do you mean by "spend time with the people"? WTF do you think I was doing there and WTF do you think holding research-based interviews with them actually entails?

[Vangelovski]

Would you beleive me if I told you
Look there is a ten thousand spread thread on educating the Macedonians back home on shaking their collective shackles Forum members here are absorbed with it I have not once been involved not once. I have spent lots of time with Macedonains back home ever wondered how our attitude here would be seen by the folks back home why are there so few active members on this Forum I address this to both you Admins

Komita is the only local Macedonian resident that posts which most of you regard as a lunatic




In all hoenstly the UMD has more merit then the MTO which is just Internet real estate and a Message Board comon isn't the later statement true. I asked forum members here to just post a complaint to the Washington Post and Associated Press nobody responded that was a small effort to be made for the cause

Onur said it politely I will say it again so many of you have an romantic view, a thousands of miles away perspective view
Yesterday I sitting with a NGO of ASX listed Company and suggested Macedonia as a Resource venture capital destination it was intersting to here his views


I think I will take a permanent holiday thanks for helping me decide that will make me join a growing number of lost members leaving the MTO for green pastures just think about that before just brushing me off but then again I really dont care

Zarni, there are many Macedonia-based posters on this forum, just because you are not aware of them that does not mean they do not exist. If you think what has been happening in Macedonia over the past 20 years is all great and we are wrong, then you can explain why the country is in the state that it is. Or offer an alternative to our views. Further, if you think the MTO is just some sort of billboard, then you have no idea what we actually do. Just because we don't advertise every time we fart like the UMD does, it does not mean we just sit on the net. What is even more important that quantity of activity, is the quality of it and in particular, the message that is spread. If you think the UMD is spreading the right message, the tell us what exactly it is you agree with and why - they may even award you with one of their Goce Delcev medals.

[BigMak]

I would like to know what the MTO is doing apart from the forum, thats great news Vangelovski, can you elaborate further on what MTO has done?

[Brian]

Zarni, there are many Macedonia-based posters on this forum, just because you are not aware of them that does not mean they do not exist.

I don't know where everyone is located either.
Since there is a location field available would people like to update their records and include at least the country and optional city they are from?
It might help in better directing one's question if there is a country specific thing happening and you wanted to ask something. It's not really necessary but just an idea.

[Brian]

It seem the government knows more than they were first letting on. Let's hope it helps to catch them.

Were killers captured on camera?

http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/20855/1/

20 April 2012
Police has confiscated camer footages from numerous gas stations, shops, banks, post offices in and around Skopje. According to local media, MOI's research teams have drawn up the movement of the killer's vehicle and ordered police to confiscate all cameras along those routes.

Police, understandably keeps all information secret on whether they have found the car on these cameras or not.

Skopje has extensive camera system installed on major boulevards and highways in and around the city. Not all were functioning at the time of the murder, although MINA finds some were turned on, as part of a 'test' performed by city for their final unveiling on May 7th.

Police reported there are at least 3 killers involved in the shooting, adding the entire event took no more than 8 minutes.

[Brian]

Fully agree with the death penalty for murder.
Dose anyone know if that law exists in RoM?

Milososki requests 'death penalty' for Smilkovci murderers

http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/20849/45/

20 April 2012
Former Foreign Minister and current MP and president of the Parliament Working group has requested a death penalty for the Smilkovci murderers in which 5 fishermen were gunned down (executed) in cold blood.

Macedonia officially does not have 'death penalty', however there were some administered after WW2 for Bulgarian collaborators, and later in the 50's, 60's and 70's for Macedonians who were active in their quest for independent Macedonia.

[Vangelovski]

I would like to know what the MTO is doing apart from the forum, thats great news Vangelovski, can you elaborate further on what MTO has done?

We are looking into providing an update on some of our activities shortly. I don't want to pre-empt that.

[Risto the Great]

Look there is a ten thousand spread thread on educating the Macedonians back home on shaking their collective shackles Forum members here are absorbed with it I have not once been involved not once.

You should think about it mate. You seem to have an opinion on most other much more important things like superior music and sports if I recall correctly.

My dealings with many Macedonians from RoMacedonia tells me they will not defend Macedonia, That they have already given it up. But they will "never forget who they are". So many of them are so piss weak that it shames me to be associated with them. There are strong Macedonians in Macedonia. Just very few of them. Deal with it sunshine.

Komita is the only local Macedonian resident that posts which most of you regard as a lunatic

lol. C'mon Frank, you know he comes from Sweden don't you??? He pretends he is there all the time. I suspect he spends more time in Serbia than Macedonia. (Or at least with his Serbian mates)

In all hoenstly the UMD has more merit then the MTO which is just Internet real estate and a Message Board comon isn't the later statement true. I asked forum members here to just post a complaint to the Washington Post and Associated Press nobody responded that was a small effort to be made for the cause

Yeah, you make a point. Remember when the UMD were going to have Shekerinska at one of their conferences?? They would sell their arses for some relevance on the Macedonian scene. (For not much money or purpose I might add).

The AMHRC makes UMD look terrible. I am sure you would agree. Guess what, the MTO promotes the hell out of them and they have never had as much widespread support. Isn't it lovely to help the Cause Frank?

Yesterday I sitting with a NGO of ASX listed Company and suggested Macedonia as a Resource venture capital destination it was intersting to here his views

NGO of ASX company=WTF
And we entertain your comments no matter how roomy they are for interpretation. I will assume you meant to write CEO and congratulate you for talking to the man when you emptied his wastebasket.

I think I will take a permanent holiday thanks for helping me decide that will make me join a growing number of lost members leaving the MTO for green pastures just think about that before just brushing me off but then again I really dont care

Thanks Frank.
Let us know where the greener pastures are. I usually find that people argue on this forum on matters they usually do not fully comprehend. They either raise their appreciation of the issue at hand or go away whinging about something that they cannot actually explain. The MTO is secure and steadfast in its commitment to the Macedonian Cause. Discussions and commitments are logical extensions of the commitment to the Cause. Others just don't understand because of limited intellect or limited effort to understand any given situation. Tell that to your many alter-egos.

[Risto the Great]

Fully agree with the death penalty for murder.
Dose anyone know if that law exists in RoM?

When a politician knows the death penalty is not allowed and says it should happen, then it is nothing more than political grandstanding.