Financial Crisis in Greece

[Onur]

Do you know how Greece created these small factories in western Thrace?

Gumulcine (Komotini) and all other cities in western Thrace was more populated with Turks and the lands was belonged to them. After they entered EU, they started to leech funds from ECB with lowest possible interest rates. Then Greek governments offered extremely profitable loans to Greek businessmen from Athens if they create factories in western Thrace. A lot of them did so by getting cheap loans from state owned banks, then came to western Thrace, bought the lands which formerly belonged to the poor Turkish people. They built the factories but never gave jobs to the local Turks, instead they imported Greek workers from other parts of Greece. These newcomers totaled for 100s of thousands and as you can read from the article, they created new towns for these workers and their families. On the other hand, the real owners of these lands, Turks ousted to the far corners of the place, to the rural and deserted places.

All these things has been done to alter population figures of the western Thrace and don't allow Turkish people to select Turkish party in the elections. As you know, they also changed the national threshold to be elected and altered the borders of regions in there laters, putting Turks and these new towns populated with people from Athens to lower the voting power of the Turkish people.


So, is this payback time for their sins now?

I am quoting myself above here because i just saw a recently published article in a Greek web site which confirms what i said above here;

Komotini withers as boom turns to bust
***
A new university in the 1970s brought in students, but the good times really began in the 1980s, when an industrial zone was set up and European Union funds began flowing in.

Companies flocked to the area, setting up factories to take advantage of subsidies. By the 1990s, Komotini was flourishing.

Nearly 18,000 workers from all over the country toiled in its factories. A consumer boom took off, a large shopping mall sprang up and German cars became popular as money flowed in.

"Each year I returned, I saw the change. It was very rapid and visible – the buildings, the smiles on the faces, the new cars," said Petridis, who had studied elsewhere.

The industrial boom ended as abruptly as it began - when subsidies and funds dried up in the early 2000s. By the time the country sank into a debilitating debt crisis in 2009, Komotini's heady boom days were long gone.
***
http://www.athensnews.gr/portal/9/53788

It says that about 18k workers imported from southern Greece only to the city of Komotini. Add their families, it makes at least 50.000 people. So, it wouldn't be wrong to say that they brought about 150.000 people to the whole western Thrace in the last 20 years by using cheap EU loans. Western Thrace`s total population is about 350.000 and 150.000 of them are Turks but ousted to the suburbs after these newcomers came to there. So, the rest of 200.000 people are Greeks but as i said, 150.000 of them has been imported from all over Greece in the last 20 years.

Worst side of it all, these newcomers are extremely hostile to the Turks, voting for fascist parties and creating scenes from time to time, harassing the local Turkish people. As you know, i posted several articles about that here like golden dawn fascist marchings, slaughter of pigs in the gardens of mosques, desecrated graves and so on.

There will be a payback time now. I hope our businessmen from Turkey buys these factories and gives jobs to the local Turks of western Thrace.

[George S.]

looks like all that was done in the past will be undone as greek firms will face bankruptcy.

[Voltron]

Spot on! Good connection of the dots Onur.
Watch out, people will start calling you a 'conspiracy theorist' now.LOL.
You missed just one more bit - impoverish EU countries by putting them into debt by bailing out Greece.

Don't you love the way the plans fall into place - made money out of hiding Greece's true financial status to get them in the EU and scoop up from the flow of money coming to Greece during the 'good years'. Then make money from the bailouts (ie take EU taxpayers' money) and then make money from Greece's public assets being sold cheaply and then own Greece's oil. Everything like dominoes falling.

Brian, you're reading too much into it. Nobody is going to own our oil. Do you have any idea how many foreign American and French Oil companies work in Turkey ? Or do you think thats not the case. TUPAO (Turkish Petroleum) is a joke, the only boat they have broke down when trying to survey the mediterennean haha.

Turkey is all riled up since their vision of being a superpower by 2023 is going down the shitter. They know that if they cannot control the Eastern Meditterenean then their vision is shattered. They have no legality in their poslitions regarding Greece and Cyprus EEZ and is the reason why they wont go to International Courts to resolve it. Greece on the other hand prefers to find a common agreement with Turkey with the hope that Turkey one day will change its hostile behavior. It makes sense to work with your neighbors then trying to get international community to arbitrate. At the end of the day they are our neighbors and we cant change that.

After so many years of Turkey being the American and British lapdog in the region there is a new geopolitical strategy in the making. Greece, Cyprus and Isreal will be the the new strategic triangle in the mediterrenean while Turkey will concenrate with their eastern borders. The Turkish partition of Cyprus singlehandedly gave all the rich deposits to the Southern Cypriot part of the island to the Greeks. Morons didnt see that one coming. Now they dont know what to do. Bagis their FM now is saying to have NC annexed to Turkey which caused a huge uproar with the TC's and some of them openly supporting their GC brothers on the island. They dont want those settlers from Turkey and are complaining that their culture and crime is being worsened by the Turkish squatters. Now Bagis is backtracking on his statement saying he was misinterpreted lol.

I have to hand it to Cyprus though, they told Turkey to fuck off and the Turks cant do anything about it. As far as Russian and Chinese companies, they are the ones that want to work with Cyprus and you'll see that soon. Greece is letting this situation play out. Once the Cypriots solidfy their EEZ zone with other Gas and Oil companies under their jurisdictian, Greece will follow with theirs.

Egypt and Lebanon will have no choice to follow through and the Turks, well...they will just have to live with it. And man are they pissed. lol.

[Voltron]

I am quoting myself above here because i just saw a recently published article in a Greek web site which confirms what i said above here;



It says that about 18k workers imported from southern Greece only to the city of Komotini. Add their families, it makes at least 50.000 people. So, it wouldn't be wrong to say that they brought about 150.000 people to the whole western Thrace in the last 20 years by using cheap EU loans. Western Thrace`s total population is about 350.000 and 150.000 of them are Turks but ousted to the suburbs after these newcomers came to there. So, the rest of 200.000 people are Greeks but as i said, 150.000 of them has been imported from all over Greece in the last 20 years.

Worst side of it all, these newcomers are extremely hostile to the Turks, voting for fascist parties and creating scenes from time to time, harassing the local Turkish people. As you know, i posted several articles about that here like golden dawn fascist marchings, slaughter of pigs in the gardens of mosques, desecrated graves and so on.

There will be a payback time now. I hope our businessmen from Turkey buys these factories and gives jobs to the local Turks of western Thrace.

Your completely ignorerd the Pomaks of Thrace. Nice try.
How many squatters did you import to Cyprus ? Care to tell everyone ?

[Phoenix]

Brian, you're reading too much into it...

No fuckin' kidding...lol

Turkey is all riled up since their vision of being a superpower by 2023 is going down the shitter....

You're fuckin' kidding...Turkey has an astronomical economic upside that you fuckers can only imagine in your wildest, wettest dream.
After Chinese and Indian development, the next tier countries include the likes of Brazil and Turkey...

They know that if they cannot control the Eastern Meditterenean then their vision is shattered. They have no legality in their poslitions regarding Greece and Cyprus EEZ and is the reason why they wont go to International Courts to resolve it...

The Turks will eventually fuck you over Voltron, in the near future they will be a regional superpower, both economic and military...not even Zeus will be able to help you, let alone the ICJ...

Greece on the other hand prefers to find a common agreement with Turkey with the hope that Turkey one day will change its hostile behavior. It makes sense to work with your neighbors then trying to get international community to arbitrate. At the end of the day they are our neighbors and we cant change that....

Voltron, stop acting like the typical 'greek' idiot, do you think we just came from Asia Minor yesterday...?
You clowns fuck around with Macedonia because you can from a position of relative power and a total disregard for international law and charter, you're not interested in neighbourly relations, you're not interested in "common agreements" but prefer to use the machinations of international arbitration to stifle Macedonia's progress but when you come up against a powerful foe like Turkey your hypocrisy stands out like dogs balls....

After so many years of Turkey being the American and British lapdog in the region....

That's a bit rich...lol...considering greeces position of Western privelige in the 20th C

[Voltron]

You're fuckin' kidding...Turkey has an astronomical economic upside that you fuckers can only imagine in your wildest, wettest dream.
After Chinese and Indian development, the next tier countries include the likes of Brazil and Turkey...

Il tell you something, what is happening in Turkey is a bubble that will burst. Dont be illusioned by their economy, there is nothing solid behind their numbers. I have people in Turkey telling me its not what it seems. All the projects and big businesses are being run by AKP invested interest groups, relatives, and party supporters. Even the EU gave them a warning.

The Turks will eventually fuck you over Voltron, in the near future they will be a regional superpower, both economic and military...not even Zeus will be able to help you, let alone the ICJ...

They cant even man up to an island such as Cyprus, what can they possibly due other than launch their horders into Greece. Nobody would support them thats why they make empty threats and dont follow through. You should of seen how they were threatening Cyprus by saying we will send our fleets and stop you, blah blah blah. Cyprus told them to go fuck themselves and Noble ended up arriving, setting their rig and proceeded with operations without a shot being fired. The Turks were left standing with their thumbs up their asses. Give me a break. They are like a castrated rottwieler that barks all the time.

Voltron, stop acting like the typical 'greek' idiot, do you think we just came from Asia Minor yesterday...?
You clowns fuck around with Macedonia because you can from a position of relative power and a total disregard for international law and charter, you're not interested in neighbourly relations, you're not interested in "common agreements" but prefer to use the machinations of international arbitration to stifle Macedonia's progress but when you come up against a powerful foe like Turkey your hypocrisy stands out like dogs balls....

Disregard from internatinal law, Lol you on crack ? Its you guys thats been trying to sidestep it from time immemorial. You didnt live up to the interim agreement, we didnt live up to it either (regarding the veto). Two way street buddy.

[Phoenix]

Disregard from internatinal law, Lol you on crack ? Its you guys thats been trying to sidestep it from time immemorial. You didnt live up to the interim agreement, we didnt live up to it either (regarding the veto). Two way street buddy.

Voltron, I don't particularly give a toss about your rivalry with the Turks so I'm not going to bother with your comments about how useless the Turks are (according to you)

but this business about Macedonia having a disregard for international law is pretty fuckin' deluded...maybe when you fuckin' baboons take a couple of steps up the evolutionary ladder you might find a few United Nations Charters that need to be shown some respect...

[Bill77]

Turkey is all riled up since their vision of being a superpower by 2023 is going down the shitter.

Mabe you could tell them what its like being in the shitter. Go on, they are your friends.

They know that if they cannot control the Eastern Meditterenean then their vision is shattered.

while you are at it, You can show them what shattered feels.

They have no legality in their poslitions regarding Greece and Cyprus........... and is the reason why they wont go to International Courts to resolve it............Greece on the other hand prefers to find a common agreement with Turkey with the hope that Turkey one day will change its hostile behavior...............It makes sense to work with your neighbors

For fuck sake, stop with this Greeks are international law abiders and are friendly and civilised bullshit. You are making me dry reach. Your'e not fooling anyone.

Greece is letting this situation play out. Once the Cypriots solidfy their EEZ zone with other Gas and Oil companies under their jurisdictian, Greece will follow with theirs.

And stop with this Greeks being intelligent, brave and have things under control. Now i am throwing up. .

[Voltron]

Mabe you could tell them what its like being in the shitter. Go on, they are your friends.

while you are at it, You can show them what shattered feels.

For fuck sake, stop with this Greeks are international law abiders and are friendly and civilised bullshit. You are making me dry reach. Your'e not fooling anyone.

And stop with this Greeks being intelligent, brave and have things under control. Now i am throwing up. .

If it wasnt for the name issue you wouldnt be saying those things.
Tell me one time we threatened you with military force if we dont get our way. Then, il stop.

[George S.]

you did you wanted to move in 2001 on the pretext of protecting borders.A sovereign country & you think you can waltz in.Macedonian airspace has been regularly violated by greek fighter jets trying to scare the macedonians.There have been military blockades on the border.THere have been tanks ,military scaring the villages in northern greece.

[Valmir]

you did you wanted to move in 2001 on the pretext of protecting borders.A sovereign country & you think you can waltz in.Macedonian airspace has been regularly violated by greek fighter jets trying to scare the macedonians.There have been military blockades on the border.THere have been tanks ,military scaring the villages in northern greece.

Why dont you fight? Aren't you the Macedonians of Alexander the Great?

[United MKD]

Macedonians haven't grown up with terrorist ideologies like UCK.

[George S.]

valmir you thimk fighting will olve all ourproblems.Why don't you fight for us & go there we will cheer you.
i think they left out the F mkd.in UCK

[Brian]

Brian, you're reading too much into it. Nobody is going to own our oil. Do you have any idea how many foreign American and French Oil companies work in Turkey ? Or do you think thats not the case. TUPAO (Turkish Petroleum) is a joke, the only boat they have broke down when trying to survey the mediterennean haha.

LOL.
You started off quoting me but the rest looked like it was directed at Onur/Turkey. My post did not factor Turkey into it at all so your long attempt to 'prove' Turkey can't do squat is irrelevant to my point which was -

the West are screwing the Greeks over (nothing to do with Turkey)
Greece's bought-off politicians and greedy and gullible (a lethal combination) public went along thinking they screwed the West over to give them buckets of money for nothing (how's it go again, "The smart boy will always find a way"?). They should have known the West ONLY give where they can get their money back (more importantly) with lots more in return.

Instead of screwing the West the Greek's lavish pays/holidays/pensions/early retirement were all instalment payments over years, kind of like a mortgage, but in reverse where you get money dolled out to you over time but you forfeit value in your asset ie your sovereignty - we have those "Reverse Mortgage" products here in Australia (maybe you also have the in Greece?) for pensioners who want to still live in their house but spend up big in their retirement years enjoying themselves but when they die 2/3 of the house (or more) could be owned by the bank. That's what happened to Greece.

Your in the hole for hundreds of billions, more than you can EVER repay, and have squat to show for it but photos of happy memories.

I'm not "reading too much into it". Phoenix is a NWO scumbag who would say it was night at mid-day if I said it was daylight outside - don't listen to him.

Your only way out of a debt you cannot ever pay off is to go bankrupt but the West wont let you do that, instead they are stringing you along with one bailout after another each time putting Greece into a bigger hole you can never get out of while at the same time those bailouts are going to the West's banks to enrich them while ordinary Greeks suffer. Further, those bailouts are from the savings/wealth of the rich Western EU and USA countries thus also impoverishing/putting into debt them - it's not the West Vs Greece but the banks Vs Greece and the West, Καταλαβαίνετε? (it's Google translate, I don't speak Greek - translation, "Do you understand?").

The West have known about your/the Mediterranean oil for ages but to help you earlier would mean Greece gets supper rich (the West/banks are racist pricks who don't believe you deserve to get rich even when God/luck put it there for you - well, I'll qualify that, you stole the Aegean and now you are being stolen from because it wasn't all yours to begin with ie the 'for you' bit. This way Greece is so far into debt not only will they get your oil but also you infrastructure/ports/ect for pennies on the dollar in lieu of (some?) the debt . Do you see how by putting your asses into hock the 'smart boy always finds a way' but he wasn't the Greek people.

I'm not "reading too much into this". It's the kind of shit I know.

It's also in part why Greece and Israel are now 'best buds' and Turkey is getting the cold shoulder (just as you said they can do squat to most of the oil). Israel wants a pipe via Greece to the EU to sell their gas, but since Greece is owned by the banks it wont be a problem, the Israelis will have to pretend they like souvlaki more than donar kebab for a while.

[Voltron]

Brian, when you go for a business loan a bank will ask if you have a business plan in place and review it before you get your money. Same thing here, it is only obvious they are going to want to know how they will get their money back. The problem with Greece is due to poor vision, corruption and complacency from continuous Greek governments that have done absolutlely nothing to try to be a competative income making country. Add that with a dose of heavy socialism, strong unions, and generous civil rights such as asylum and striking (20 ppl can block a major road to protest) and you have a perfect storm for failure. It wasnt noticable previously, but ever since we got straightjacketed into the Euro it became more pronounced and apparent that we wouldnt be able to get ourselves out of this situation. This probably would of never happened if Papandreou in his attempt to discredit ND didnt inflate the debt statistics to his EU counterparts in what would be the biggest political fuck up ever imaginable. He singlehandedly brought the EU to its knees that led to credit agenicies attacking the whole EU as a whole.

I have just as much disdain for corporatism and bank tactics as you do if not more. But the reforms being done here is not at the expense of the Greek people. It needed to be done ages ago, and if it takes a higher power to get the job done then so be it. That doesnt mean we will lose everything here to foreign interests. There is a lesson to be learnt and it was high time it happened. It wouldnt of been so hard for people to accept if these reforms happened earlier.

There is also another saying in Greek " I malakies plironounte "

It's also in part why Greece and Israel are now 'best buds' and Turkey is getting the cold shoulder (just as you said they can do squat to most of the oil). Israel wants a pipe via Greece to the EU to sell their gas, but since Greece is owned by the banks it wont be a problem, the Israelis will have to pretend they like souvlaki more than donar kebab for a while.

We are "best buds" now because Turkey pushed them into our arms. Another stroke of genius on the part of Davatoglou and Co.
Isreal and Greece never developed relations due to the extreme Pro Palestinian position Greece held. We were the last country in the EU to recognize them as a country. Add to the rising islamofacism in Turkey and the region and the end result was a no brainer.