Financial Crisis in Greece

[Stojacanec]

Ancient Greece is not the fault of Spain, Italy, Ireland, Voltron. They are all a product of a failed EU. Question is, can these countries put in place austerity measures that will enable them to climb out of their respective debts? That is a question for each country to answer on its own.

Problem (I have) with Modern Greece is its perception of Ancient Greece and how that impacts on the ongoing problems we as Macedonians have to face today.

The economic embargo, changing flag, blocking a small country to enter nato, eu.

So the writer has got the story half right. This I feel is a sense of karma and given all that has happened, I am not sympathetic to the Greeks and their woes.

[Voltron]

Ancient Greece is not the fault of Spain, Italy, Ireland, Voltron. They are all a product of a failed EU. Question is, can these countries put in place austerity measures that will enable them to climb out of their respective debts? That is a question for each country to answer on its own.

Im glad you made that observation Stojacanec. That is exactly the core essence of the problem. The EU isnt a bad idea, it had a lot of potential but today's EU leaders succumbed to the pressures of banks and invested interests. Its really a shame.

So the writer has got the story half right. This I feel is a sense of karma and given all that has happened, I am not sympathetic to the Greeks and their woes.

No need to feel sympathetic Stojacanec. In times of difficulty is when we excel. Too many years feeling comfortable, a little disarray will do us a bit of good.

[Stojacanec]

Im glad you made that observation Stojacanec. That is exactly the core essence of the problem. The EU isnt a bad idea, it had a lot of potential but today's EU leaders succumbed to the pressures of banks and invested interests. Its really a shame.



No need to feel sympathetic Stojacanec. In times of difficulty is when we excel. Too many years feeling comfortable, a little disarray will do us a bit of good.

Well good luck with the excelling stuff.......

How about if you change your name,flag, constitution and not to mention your identity, everything else can stay the same, then we will grant you EU$110 billion.

Yes I agree with you that things are in a bit of dissaray.

[Voltron]

How about if you change your name,flag, constitution and not to mention your identity, everything else can stay the same, then we will grant you EU$110 billion.

Stojacanec,

Do you not understand that Macedonia had been used against Greece in the recent past by the likes of Bulgaria for example ? Do you feel that using a symbol that Ancient Hellenes used collectively as well is appropriate while at the same time laying claim to a minority living within Greece's borders that just so happens to have the same name that we identify as Hellenes themselves ? Its like asking me to amputate my arm for the sake of individuality. And before someone harps on me for this, im just flustered at some of the questions here posed as if nobody knows the underlying reasons for these things.
Does that mean that Macedonians within your context of definition dont exist ? No, absolutly not, but lets not act as if we are completely oblvious to historical events and realities.

[Daskalot]

Stojacanec,

Do you not understand that Macedonia had been used against Greece in the recent past by the likes of Bulgaria for example ? Do you feel that using a symbol that Ancient Hellenes used collectively as well is appropriate while at the same time laying claim to a minority living within Greece's borders that just so happens to have the same name that we identify as Hellenes themselves ? Its like asking me to amputate my arm for the sake of individuality. And before someone harps on me for this, im just flustered at some of the questions here posed as if nobody knows the underlying reasons for these things.
Does that mean that Macedonians within your context of definition dont exist ? No, absolutly not, but lets not act as if we are completely oblvious to historical events and realities.

Wow, I need to deal with this later, just quoting you to remind myself to do so. But until then wow Voltron!

[George S.]

Voltron do you know the bulgarians,Serbians.Albanians,& also the greeks divided macedonia up in 1913.Each one with it's own propaganda shows how macedonia belongs to them But when one really examines its all lies to cover up the land grabs.When did the hellenes or greeks use the star of vergina before 1978.They never occupied northern greece before.So we have established that it's no more than a land grab of which you will simply ignore.
The truth is very hurtfull when you see that macedonia was a whole before 1913 then it was divided up prior to 1913.If macedonians are greek why don't the whole of macedonia belong to them.Why because it's a land grab.

[Onur]

Greece will be officially governed by the troika now. EU appointed one of their former officer in European central bank as a new PM of the country.

It appears like Papandreu really planned the referendum idea all by himself, so he shared the same fate as the previous Slovakian government who toppled by the EU after refusing the bailout plan.

Papademos front-runner to be new Greek PM
Lucas Papademos, a former deputy head of the European Central Bank, was on Monday tipped to emerge as Greek prime minister as political leaders bargained over who will lead a new coalition to push through a bailout before the country runs out of money in mid-December.

But whoever leads the transitional government of national unity will have a monumental task in restoring order to a country whose chaotic economy and politics are shaking international confidence in the entire euro project.

With the European Union demanding a quick resolution to the political crisis, Prime Minister George Papandreou sealed a deal on Sunday with the conservative opposition on the crisis coalition to approve the international financial aid package.

Papandreou informed European leaders, including German Chancellor Angela Merkel and European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso, by phone on Monday about efforts to form the coalition, his office said.

The Greek leaders' job on Monday was to agree a new prime minister, possibly a technocrat who must exert authority over hardened party chiefs from the center-left and center-right, and made decisions which will affect Greeks for a decade.

HANDS FULL
However, the new prime minister will have their hands full merely getting Papandreou's socialist PASOK party and the conservative New Democracy party of Samaras to work together, regardless of whether the leaders join the cabinet.

"I'm afraid the new government will very soon turn out to be problematic," conservative former finance minister Stefanos Manos told Reuters.

Papademos, who as Bank of Greece governor oversaw the nation's adoption of the euro in 2002 before moving to the European Central Bank, is a front runner as premier.

"The prime minister had several telephone contacts with Mr Papademos in the last days," a senior government official told reporters.

At least the two parties agreed on the likely life of the coalition, deciding in the early hours of Monday morning that February 19 would be the preferred date -- hours before Finance Minister Evangelos Venizelos must explain Greece's plans when he meets his euro zone peers at a meeting in Brussels.

Brussels has piled pressure on Athens to approve the bailout, a last financial lifeline for Greece which faces big debt repayments in December, fearing that its crisis will spill into much bigger euro zone economies such as Italy and Spain -- which would be far harder to rescue.

The coalition agreement came after the EU told the parties to explain by Monday evening's Eurogroup meeting how they would form a unity government to secure the 130-billion-euro ($180-billion) funding.

Papandreou, who sealed his fate last week with an attempt to call a referendum on the bailout which backfired, will stand down when the new government takes over.

SCEPTICISM ON THE STREET
Many Greeks remained skeptical.

"Are we saved? I don't think so, if nothing is done to stop this practice of slapping more and more taxes because people's pockets will be empty," said Nikos Stratakis, 49, a taxi driver, referring to the two years of austerity.

"Hurrah, we are saved!" said plumber George Vihos sarcastically. "Why should we celebrate now that they will make sure we bear the pain?"

On Sunday European Economic and Monetary Affairs Commissioner Olli Rehn told Reuters that euro zone finance ministers would insist on hearing a plan for a unity government from Venizelos at Monday's Eurogroup meeting.

Papandreou had sought the referendum to show that harsh cuts demanded in the bailout had public support, but the risk that a "no" vote could bring about a sudden bankruptcy caused mayhem in markets and unrest in the ruling party.

He soon ditched the idea and won a confidence vote in parliament, but only after promising to make way for the national unity coalition.

Nov 7, 2011

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...topNews&rpc=71

[Brian]

Wow!, Votron. There is so much to say about your comments. So as not to pollute the thread I will briefly say here, No Voltron, the writer is right - it is the poor Greek attitude and lies that have brought Greece to their demise, and potentially the EU, and potential world recession/depression. Your statements are an affront to every thinking person. In the interest of not polluting this thread, see the link bellow for my full response to your comments.

Link

http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum/showthread.php?p=113879#post113879

[George S.]

one of my greek friends told me that it was a big possibility for greece to go back to a military junta.

[Voltron]

Wow, I need to deal with this later, just quoting you to remind myself to do so. But until then wow Voltron!

Daskale, I believe your reading and interpreting way more than what I responded to. My post does not have any negative connotations nor was it intended to nullify views in this forum.

@ Brian, there is no link.

[Voltron]

Greece will be officially governed by the troika now. EU appointed one of their former officer in European central bank as a new PM of the country.

The members of the EU are bound to certain obligations regarding the Euro. Its not just Greece, but Italy is up next. Ireland already has the IMF in place. I dont find it absurd to have a monitoring body to check up on EU members with financial issues. After all there is no unified federal government like the USA has. This is the only way to counter the markets blowing up the Eurozone into thin air. I dont see what your trying to get at. Its the same EU Turkey is trying to become a member of.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15617132

[Brian]

Daskale, I believe your reading and interpreting way more than what I responded to. My post does not have any negative connotations nor was it intended to nullify views in this forum.

@ Brian, there is no link.

Link is fixed now. It points to "Brian's Corner" just to keep this thread clean.

[Stojacanec]

Stojacanec,

Do you not understand that Macedonia had been used against Greece in the recent past by the likes of Bulgaria for example ? Do you feel that using a symbol that Ancient Hellenes used collectively as well is appropriate while at the same time laying claim to a minority living within Greece's borders that just so happens to have the same name that we identify as Hellenes themselves ? Its like asking me to amputate my arm for the sake of individuality. And before someone harps on me for this, im just flustered at some of the questions here posed as if nobody knows the underlying reasons for these things.
Does that mean that Macedonians within your context of definition dont exist ? No, absolutly not, but lets not act as if we are completely oblvious to historical events and realities.

Yes Wow! What a statement.

Btw I didn't mean to fluster you when I asked to change your flag, name, identity and constitution to better your life as an EU member.

[Dejan]

Stojacanec,

Do you not understand that Macedonia had been used against Greece in the recent past by the likes of Bulgaria for example ? Do you feel that using a symbol that Ancient Hellenes used collectively as well is appropriate while at the same time laying claim to a minority living within Greece's borders that just so happens to have the same name that we identify as Hellenes themselves ? Its like asking me to amputate my arm for the sake of individuality. And before someone harps on me for this, im just flustered at some of the questions here posed as if nobody knows the underlying reasons for these things.
Does that mean that Macedonians within your context of definition dont exist ? No, absolutly not, but lets not act as if we are completely oblvious to historical events and realities.

Have you researched and found the truth as to why this 'minority' goes by this same name that racists of your ilk claim?

Oblivious to historical events???????????????????
This should be fun...

[makedonche]

The members of the EU are bound to certain obligations regarding the Euro. Its not just Greece, but Italy is up next. Ireland already has the IMF in place. I dont find it absurd to have a monitoring body to check up on EU members with financial issues. After all there is no unified federal government like the USA has. This is the only way to counter the markets blowing up the Eurozone into thin air. I dont see what your trying to get at. Its the same EU Turkey is trying to become a member of.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15617132

Voltron
I had you pegged as an intelligent and articulate sort with the capacity to display objectivity and lateral thinking.......sadly I was mistaken.....you too have fallen into the latest EU creation in the southern balkans it's call the State of "Denial".