Nikola Gruevski

[mango]

the Macedonian politicians seem to be doing what may come.They have no master plan
as they are taken advantage all the time by the Albanians so that the Macedonians hold power.It seems to be loss of soveregnity is like the order of the day.They like to lose their soveregnity regardless upon entering the eu if they so choose to decide.They have lost it to the Albanians most of it already.

That would be one explanation, George i.e. no master plan. On the other hand a lot of evidence (like above texts) point to realization of a master plan for the partition of Macedonia between Albania and Bulgaria. Our biggest problem seems to be that there is no viable political opposition. The former communists of the SDSM are lost in time and space.

[Risto the Great]

mango, what are the impediments for the establishment of a more viable opposition? Why nothing for so long?

[George S.]

what we are expecting something greater of the opposition parties??they are all feathering their nests.We can't even get a moot point on the ruling party let alone the hodgepodge of an opposition.They too are in cohoots with the Albanians etc.Macedonia has lost any chance of getting out of the rutt you only need to see their poor driven policies.

[mango]

No opposition

IMHO to be a viable party anywhere the participants have to show some kind of patriotism. The SDSM is perceived as an ex-communist party and and someone who is ready to negotiate the country's name, hence unpatriotic. As such, they have almost no chance to unite the Macedonian people and become a viable opposition. Our political elite is in abysmal condition: unpatriotic, scared and/or corrupt and therefore irrelevant. Presently the DPMNE still has the monopoly on Macedonian patriotism, false as it is. So we find ourselves in a position to applaud the ruling elite as they are slowly dismantling the country while blaming foreign forces (EU, USA etc) for our predicament. Another basic flaw in our society is the identifying of the Macedonian patriot with the Orthodox Christian religion thus alienating Macedonian Muslims who have no choice but to identify with the Albanians. We missed a historical chance to seek alliance with the Albanians from Albania proper through our large minority there.

[George S.]

years ago I heard a comment that went on like why can't be a one party govt that looks after the interests of all.But that was wishfull thinking and there is so much division in such a small country.Macedonia has more municipalities etc than the whole of Australia.No one who has vested interest would think about joining to form bipartisan lines
for the sake of Macedonia.They think that would be treasoness to give up one's ideals.So what may never be is everyone working for the common good.

[Niko777]

Another basic flaw in our society is the identifying of the Macedonian patriot with the Orthodox Christian religion thus alienating Macedonian Muslims who have no choice but to identify with the Albanians.

I don't think that's a huge issue... Macedonian Muslims are a small population of what, 50,000? And let's not forget how weak the Macedonian church is in influence and power on society compared to the national church in our southern neighbor, for example.

I think the real reason Macedonian Muslims chose to identify with the Albanians is because they are ashamed of their Christian counterparts...

[Bill77]

I don't think that's a huge issue... Macedonian Muslims are a small population of what, 50,000? And let's not forget how weak the Macedonian church is in influence and power on society compared to the national church in our southern neighbor, for example.

I think the real reason Macedonian Muslims chose to identify with the Albanians is because they are ashamed of their Christian counterparts...

No it's a religious issue. For a Muslim, it's Allah above everything else.

Where as for the influence and power on society the southern neighbour Church posses, it's not due to teaching Gods words, but breeding nationalism and teaching hatred for others. It's not the type of influence and power any religious church should have regardless if it's Macedonian, Greek or whatever.

[Niko777]

No it's a religious issue. For a Muslim, it's Allah above everything else.

But Macedonian Muslims were until recently very moderate, unlike other Muslims they still retained Macedonian Christian traditions in their culture, like St George's day. That's why I don't think it was much of a religious issue for them. I think it was more of a social-economic issue that turned them towards the Albanians.

Where as for the influence and power on society the southern neighbour Church posses, it's not due to teaching Gods words, but breeding nationalism and teaching hatred for others. It's not the type of influence and power any religious church should have regardless if it's Macedonian, Greek or whatever.

I think the church can play a very important role in protecting our name, identity and culture. The Orthodox church is more of a cultural institution than a religious one, IMO.

[Alex_MK]

I don't think that's a huge issue... Macedonian Muslims are a small population of what, 50,000? And let's not forget how weak the Macedonian church is in influence and power on society compared to the national church in our southern neighbor, for example.

I think the real reason Macedonian Muslims chose to identify with the Albanians is because they are ashamed of their Christian counterparts...

I think this is spot on. I believe there used to be Albanian christians but most of them assimilated into the Macedonian ethno or converted to islam

[Soldier of Macedon]

Another basic flaw in our society is the identifying of the Macedonian patriot with the Orthodox Christian religion thus alienating Macedonian Muslims who have no choice but to identify with the Albanians. We missed a historical chance to seek alliance with the Albanians from Albania proper through our large minority there.

What sort of an alliance are you referring to Mango?

[mango]

But Macedonian Muslims were until recently very moderate, unlike other Muslims they still retained Macedonian Christian traditions in their culture, like St George's day. That's why I don't think it was much of a religious issue for them. I think it was more of a social-economic issue that turned them towards the Albanians.



I think the church can play a very important role in protecting our name, identity and culture. The Orthodox church is more of a cultural institution than a religious one, IMO.

I don't think our church is capable of protecting anything, look what is going on in Australia.

The Albanian national doctrine says that religion is secondary, nationality/ethnicity is of primary concern. This has united the Albanian and despite internal disputes over 90% of Albanians seek a Greater Albania while we're fighting for survival.

[mango]

What sort of an alliance are you referring to Mango?

I think that we all agree that there is no chance we reach an agreement with Bulgaria and Greece, which are our mortal enemies. Serbia is so, so. While they do recognize us we still have problems with them but should try to be friends, as much as possible.

Albania, on the other hand, has recognized us as people and culture. There is a huge number of Macedonians there, mainly in Tirana. There were/are a lot of Macedonians highly integrated in their society, businessman, generals, professors, politicians. If we attempted to organize them we'd have a powerful Macedonian party with several MP and chance to influence country politics, including the behavior of Albanians in Macedonia. As is now, the only Macedonian party exists there by name only and most Macedonians do not want to associate with it. The blame lies with the Skopje government, past and especially present.

[Risto the Great]

Macedonians do regard their orthodoxy as a defining aspect of their culture. It shouldn't be. But it does seem to be the case. In turn, I think the Albanians regard Islam as their distinguishing feature in Macedonia. But it's clear they have a firmer grasp on their sense of identity in my mind.

[Volokin]

Macedonians do regard their orthodoxy as a defining aspect of their culture. It shouldn't be. But it does seem to be the case. In turn, I think the Albanians regard Islam as their distinguishing feature in Macedonia. But it's clear they have a firmer grasp on their sense of identity in my mind.

I believe that Albanians regard Albanianism as their distinguishing feature in Macedonia and the surrounding areas, in my opinion.

[iceman]

Gruevski: Am not Stepping Down, Manufactured Crisis will be resolved

iceman : No what needs to happen is that dog zaev and the demonic nato -eu- and soros need to fuck off


Gruevski: Am not Stepping Down, Manufactured Crisis will be resolved
Saturday, 16 May 2015



Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski on Saturday called the wiretapped conversations, released earlier today by SDSM, “an obvious attempt to manipulate the public.”
“Nikola Gruevski and this government have had nine years. If they wanted to change the name, they would have done so. Evidently, it hasn’t been done yet. SDSM are responsible for changing the name in 1994 accepting the country to be called Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia after manipulating the public and without consulting the citizens at a referendum,” Gruevski told Sitel TV.

The tapped conversations, he added, show that views have been shared. “The government is obliged to discuss and seek solution to the name issue.”

“Zaev’s intention with today’s press conference was to present us as people, who couldn’t wait to change the name. On the contrary, we have used every opportunity possible to test some things… It is our obligation to talk, look for a solution, find a compromise solution that would be acceptable for the majority of the people in Macedonia. There’s no backing down from what I’ve said,” stressed Gruevski.

The recordings, he added, also reveal how the government was attempting to secure guarantees about the identity with a resolution by the United Nations.
“It is also clear from the recordings that nothing could be accepted without a referendum. We have been publicly saying that a referendum has to be held if any agreement is reached.”

“(Zoran) Zaev by releasing fabricated, edited and re-edited materials failed to do what he wanted – to expose us as people who want to harm Macedonia,” underlined PM Gruevski.

Speaking to Sitel TV, Gruevski said he wouldn’t resign as demanded by the opposition. “I was elected by the citizens of Macedonia in regular, fair and democratic polls only a year ago.”

“I do not intend to step down or to accept a transitional government to be formed. I have the obligation to deal with this and to find a solution allowing Macedonia to move forward. The country will move forward,” the Macedonian PM urged.

Asked about the current situation, Gruevski said a solution to the political crisis must be found.

“A solution must be found, but not by using violent means. A solution will be found. Macedonia will come out of the crisis even stronger with many lessons learned,” Gruevski stated.