United Macedonia Diaspora

[rujnovino]

You can, really? Then surely you would have realised that the UMD denounce the name negotiations first - and then go on about how 'good' and 'bad' both Macedonia and Greece have been respectively. So your below distortion holds now water, because you either haven't read the article or you're trying to improvise from a platform of sheer ignorance:

They are stating the 'facts' of what happened to paint Greece as the 'bad' one for rejecting prior (and treacherous) proposals. That, is a fact to anybody who can (actually) read Macedonian. Let me know if you need some help.

I agree, entirely.

Quite a stupid comparison based on urelated matters, but I will address it for the benefit of readers. If you wish to compare the MTO with the UMD, then do so based on the statements of official representatives of the organisations. Unless you can show me where Risto, Tom or myself (or Daskalot in relation to the forum) have made explicit 'death threats' against people here (or, within the context of MTO Inc., have said anything contrary to the Macedonian Cause as defined at the MTO), I will kindly advise you to shut your trap and cease those sort of manipulative and ambiguous statements, immediately.

As for others here who have made these so-called 'death threats', it overwhelmingly relates to impulsive reaction, and without impeding on freedom of speech, I think we manage and moderate the forum adequately enough. Anybody with half a peanut that follows this forum can see countless examples of where I have intervened when things get out of hand, or when there are inappropriate statements being made. This has inevitably put me on 'bad' terms with some Macedonians, but objectivity and the truth are paramount. And things will continue to be that way, despite the efforts of vindictive people like yourself who falsely paint this forum as a collective based on the opinions of a handful of individuals.

Soldier, Sometimes I think you can't read Macedonian OR English. You have taken to Vangelovski's strategy of simply repeating falsehoods enough times until someone loses interest, and then claiming a hollow "victory". It's quality not quantity, and you are fooling no one other than those who are already fools (MakKafana, etc.)

[Soldier of Macedon]

Rujno, everything I stated above is FACT. Even if I made the statement only one time, it would still be more factual than your repetitive lies in support of the UMD. Your most recent and petty response demonstrates that you've backed yourself into a corner. That's what usually happens when you're caught out lying. At this point in time you may want to start considering your value and/or relevance here, as you won't be sustaining your forum membership on a staple diet of lies and manipulations for much longer.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

After, many years of human rights experience you would think he of all people would fully understand BASIC things like “freedom of speech” and or a “right to choose” yet it's obvious he hasn't learned anything. If, he has anyone to be upset with then it should be himself for allowing the UMD to buy him lock stock and website, After, about the 50th user name you begin to understand that what we have is a very desperate soul trying to hide from his own shortcoming in life. I, for one no longer care to partake in this escapade of deceits and will let him make a total fool of himself if he feels it helps his own ego or that organization called UMD.

He, is not a board member but they should kiss his ass - twice!

YouTube - ‪Sinking ships‬‏

[George S.]

Rujnovino isn't it hypocritical for the umd to say no to the pregovori in one hand but still saying their ok because the greeks refused the name.Also the umd supported the interim accord do you know what that means & it's consquences.I think deep in there it supporrts the policies of gruevski & other parties this is completely the opposite view of the diaspora.
The umd likes to think that it represents the diaspora when it doesn't it's pretty weak & is diagonally completely in opposition to the thinking of the diaspora.It says one thing but does another is summed up of the umd.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

Rujnovino isn't it hypocritical for the umd to say no to the pregovori in one hand but still saying their ok because the greeks refused the name.Also the umd supported the interim accord do you know what that means & it's consquences.I think deep in there it supporrts the policies of gruevski & other parties this is completely the opposite view of the diaspora.
We don't want a weak & wimpy organization like the umd representing us we 've got alternatives.

George, please don't encourage him to post .. ne e zdrav deteto, a swinger and yes a former Macedonian Human Rights poster child. If, he pisses me off I just may post that issue - full frontal (MEN ONLY)

UMD members click HERE

[indigen]

After, many years of human rights experience you would think he of all people would fully understand BASIC things like “freedom of speech” and or a “right to choose” yet it's obvious he hasn't learned anything. If, he has anyone to be upset with then it should be himself for allowing the UMD to buy him lock stock and website

MKaf, you would not be thinking of our friend LU by any chance when you say the above? I would be surprised and very disappointed if you were, i.e. if that is him.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

MKaf, you would not be thinking of our friend LU by any chance when you say the above? I would be surprised and very disappointed if you were, i.e. if that is him.

Lets, wait to see what his next move here is, I'll have my back to the wall while we wait his next plan of attack. Hint, the Village of Bouf is somehow involved so it could be a few silly boys I've been playing him like a Greek puppet here - easy pickings

[Vangelovski]

I apologize for nothing, and you are the one that is blind. Your circular logic and repetitive bullshit is extremely unimpressive. I'm not surprised you were shown the door by the UMD board, and that you have since dedicated to your existence to pampering your own bruised ego. Inaet is not a virtue, Vangelovski.

Your posts are nothing but apologetic BS for UMD's treasonous policies. In the last quote I provided UMD clearly calls on Greece to respect the Interim Accord. Or did you ignore that one?

As for my leaving, I resigned because the UMD was ready to accept a name change for NATO membership in 2008. Their Press Release at the time reprimanded Greece for NOT accepting "Republic of Macedonia (Skopje)".

You're typical of Meto's apologists. You have not taken the time to read their public statements and when you do read a few snippets, you pathetically and disingenuously attempt to creatively reinterpret them in order to save face, when Meto himself has never denied them and consistently held that line.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

Tom, you did the correct thing by walking away as a proud Macedonian something our happy friend will not be man enough to do. He's going down ... with the ship?

[indigen]

The clip is a Sitel report on the Our Name is Macedonia campaign.

www.mhrmi.org/news/2011/march05_e.asp

I have the clip downloaded and it sure looks like a promo clip to me, regardless of what you say. It appears to me as another excuse thrown at the gullible in similar fashion to the Dostoinstvo one about the law not allowing them to use their old (current) Association logo as the PPD party logo.

Secondly, who is TJHosting and what are their links to MHRMI? They seem like an official MHRMI YouTube representative and the following vid is also of concern as it seems to be selectively edited to show the desired images and one of which displays a giant VENTILATOR banner and your web address at the very end:

Descendents of Alexander The Great at Canberra Meeting

YouTube - ‪Descendents of Alexander The Great at Canberra Meeting‬‏

Considering who were the initiators and main organisers of this demo, I can not consider that it was they who brought the ventilator banners (or flags), took the specific photos or edited the vid!

Читај ја оваа страница на македонски

http://www.mhrmi.org/images/macedonian_flag.gif

That MHRMI is not averse to using the ventialtor symbol can be seen in the above language gif used to designate the Macedonian language. There are alternative ways this can be done and some people do it right. And neither is the "United Macedonians" org of Canada averse in doing the same as can be seen in the favicon used when accessing their website [ http://www.unitedmacedonians.org/ ] (click on the link and see what favicon icon is flapping in the address bar).

Macedonian Human Rights Movement International (MHRMI) and the Australian Macedonian Human Rights Committee (AMHRC) initiated the Our Name is Macedonia campaign in July 2010, which demands that Macedonia end all negotiations with Greece over its name. The campaign includes billboards throughout Macedonia, ads in print and online editions of major newspapers, television commercials, press conferences, radio interviews and the distribution of hundreds of thousands of flyers throughout the country.

• Our organizations have consistently denounced the name negotiations and condemned SDSM for agreeing to the "temporary reference" of "FYROM" and subsequently changing the flag.
• We condemn SDSM and their media for scare-mongering and claiming that Macedonia must change its name to enter the EU and NATO, or risk collapse.
• We demand that VMRO fulfill its promise that it will never change Macedonia's name by immediately ending the name negotiations.
• Furthermore, we demand that Macedonia revert to the original flag and immediately end the acceptance of "FYROM" or "Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia".
• Finally, MHRMI and AMHRC call on every Macedonian organization and individual to sign on to the Our Name is Macedonia campaign.

https://www.mhrmi.org/our_name_is_macedonia

Silence is not an option. Our Name is Macedonia.

All the above is very good, praiseworthy and to be encouraged and supported but some more practical consideration/s in how the campaign publicity is organised would only add more ideological consistency to the actual campaign and the organisations leading it, IMHO!

We demand that VMRO fulfill its promise that it will never change Macedonia's name by immediately ending the name negotiations.

Lastly, I am going to have my last gripe about the ideological inappropriateness in using VMRO designation when referring to VMRO-DPMNE for many and varied reasons and one of which would indicate some predisposition of the MHRMI poster here to some political preference for this ramkovist organisation which has committed to changing the name (albeit allowing the "gragjani" to pull the final suicide trigger!).

[Vangelovski]

The clip is a Sitel report on the Our Name is Macedonia campaign.

www.mhrmi.org/news/2011/march05_e.asp

Macedonian Human Rights Movement International (MHRMI) and the Australian Macedonian Human Rights Committee (AMHRC) initiated the Our Name is Macedonia campaign in July 2010, which demands that Macedonia end all negotiations with Greece over its name. The campaign includes billboards throughout Macedonia, ads in print and online editions of major newspapers, television commercials, press conferences, radio interviews and the distribution of hundreds of thousands of flyers throughout the country.

• Our organizations have consistently denounced the name negotiations and condemned SDSM for agreeing to the "temporary reference" of "FYROM" and subsequently changing the flag.
• We condemn SDSM and their media for scare-mongering and claiming that Macedonia must change its name to enter the EU and NATO, or risk collapse.
• We demand that VMRO fulfill its promise that it will never change Macedonia's name by immediately ending the name negotiations.
• Furthermore, we demand that Macedonia revert to the original flag and immediately end the acceptance of "FYROM" or "Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia".
• Finally, MHRMI and AMHRC call on every Macedonian organization and individual to sign on to the Our Name is Macedonia campaign.

www.mhrmi.org/our_name_is_macedonia

Silence is not an option. Our Name is Macedonia.

I think that is a platform that we can work with. Though I would not be using any material that provides any time/space to the ventilator, and even though Sitel created the report, I still stand by my original comments that it would be better to remove that clip and not use it as part of your promotional material - or at least edit it so that it does not include the ventilator.

On another note, DPMNE never promised not to change the name. The vague statement of promising not to change the constitution in order to change the "constitutional" name is nothing more than a mirage. A promise not to change the name is still forthcoming and I highly doubt it will ever come seeing as they have already accepted a name change (FYROM) and are toying with another one ("Republic of Macednia (Skopje)").

[Vangelovski]

They seem like an official MHRMI YouTube representative and the following vid is also of concern as it seems to be selectively edited to show the desired images and one of which displays a giant VENTILATOR banner and your web address at the very end:

Descendents of Alexander The Great at Canberra Meeting

YouTube - ‪Descendents of Alexander The Great at Canberra Meeting‬‏

Considering who were the initiators and main organisers of this demo, I can not consider that it was they who brought the ventilator banners (or flags), took the specific photos or edited the vid!

I don't know who put up this video, but I can confirm that it was not done by the organising group "Alexander's Descendents" - whoever put the clip together it got their name wrong. I assisted in organising the Canberra demonstration, and I can confirm that the organising group officially discouraged the use of the ventilator and a number of them were confiscated on the day (including that large ventilator in the photo towards the end), though obviously some still slipped through the cracks.

Further, MHRMI was not involved with that event, so I'm not sure why their website is being advertised at the end.

[Vangelovski]

Tom, you did the correct thing by walking away as a proud Macedonian something our happy friend will not be man enough to do. He's going down ... with the ship?

I'm not sure who Rujnovino is, but I suspect that he's every close to UMD, though isn't very familiar with the details. From past experience, a number of 'newbies' have tried to pretend UMD did not really say what they did without having even a basic knowledge of what UMD has actually stated publically in the past.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

Guys, I know many of the answers but we need much more feedback from these organizations themselves like we expect from the UMD. I'm sure Bill will look after his end like today but can't say the same about the United Macedonians of Canada because that website has been under construction almost one year and the president Mendo has put all his trust in their youth to get that job done.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

I'm not sure who Rujnovino is, but I suspect that he's every close to UMD, though isn't very familiar with the details. From past experience, a number of 'newbies' have tried to pretend UMD did not really say what they did without having even a basic knowledge of what UMD has actually stated publically in the past.

This is the risk when organizations let people speak on their behalf and avoiding it totally (UMD) only makes matters worse. UMD, is an organizations that heavily relies on others (UN) to bail them out these binds ie. stop all talks, no name changes or eu membership -- reactive organization 100%

Tom, think back to some of the personal attacks towards you on Maknews and connect the dots .. almost, word for word and the same anger. Did, those person(s) know much about anything let alone the UMD? Folks, this is not NASA and only a few people post that often daily.

If, we find out this whacko is a board member (he's not) Meto must resign.