Macedonia & Greece: Name Issue

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  • Carlin
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2011
    • 3332

    Greek concern over constitutional proposals

    URL:
    The government of the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) submitted draft constitutional amendments to Parliament on Friday that would formally rename the country “North Macedonia” under the name deal signed with Greece, but Greek President Prokopis Pavlopoulos has reportedly expressed reservations about an article that hints at a Macedonian people.


    The government of Macedonia submitted draft constitutional amendments to Parliament on Friday that would formally rename the country “North Macedonia” under the name deal signed with Greece, but Greek President Prokopis Pavlopoulos has reportedly expressed reservations about an article that hints at a Macedonian people.

    Pavlopoulos reportedly objected to Article 36 which retains references to a Macedonian “people and identity” and the need to protect the Macedonian “people” living outside the country.

    Pavlopoulos has insisted that Macedonia must make a written commitment that the name deal signed in June does not recognize a Macedonian nation but rather a citizenship.

    Prime Minister Zoran Zaev presented the proposal at a press conference after a meeting of his cabinet and said there is nothing disputable in the four proposed amendments which, he said, are in compliance with international standards.

    The first amendment proposes the replacement of the phrase “Republic of Macedonia” with “the Republic of North Macedonia” in the country’s constitution.

    The second amendment proposes the addition of the Ohrid Framework Agreement of 2001 as the country’s constitutive element.

    Moreover, in agreement with the Greek side, the constitution’s preamble will also include changes to the references made to the 1944 Anti-Fascist Assembly of the National Liberation of Macedonia (ASNOM) so that any wording deemed irredentist is removed.

    The proposed third amendment includes a reference that Macedonia respects the national sovereignty and territorial integrity of neighboring countries.

    The next plenary session of the Parliament to ratify the constitutional changes will take place on December 1.

    A month later the third and final vote to ratify the constitutional review will take place, meaning the name deal will be ratified by Macedonia by mid-January at the latest.

    Comment

    • TrueMacedonian
      Senior Member
      • Jan 2009
      • 3812

      Originally posted by Carlin15 View Post
      Greek concern over constitutional proposals

      URL:
      The government of the Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia (FYROM) submitted draft constitutional amendments to Parliament on Friday that would formally rename the country “North Macedonia” under the name deal signed with Greece, but Greek President Prokopis Pavlopoulos has reportedly expressed reservations about an article that hints at a Macedonian people.


      The government of Macedonia submitted draft constitutional amendments to Parliament on Friday that would formally rename the country “North Macedonia” under the name deal signed with Greece, but Greek President Prokopis Pavlopoulos has reportedly expressed reservations about an article that hints at a Macedonian people.

      Pavlopoulos reportedly objected to Article 36 which retains references to a Macedonian “people and identity” and the need to protect the Macedonian “people” living outside the country.

      Pavlopoulos has insisted that Macedonia must make a written commitment that the name deal signed in June does not recognize a Macedonian nation but rather a citizenship.

      Prime Minister Zoran Zaev presented the proposal at a press conference after a meeting of his cabinet and said there is nothing disputable in the four proposed amendments which, he said, are in compliance with international standards.

      The first amendment proposes the replacement of the phrase “Republic of Macedonia” with “the Republic of North Macedonia” in the country’s constitution.

      The second amendment proposes the addition of the Ohrid Framework Agreement of 2001 as the country’s constitutive element.

      Moreover, in agreement with the Greek side, the constitution’s preamble will also include changes to the references made to the 1944 Anti-Fascist Assembly of the National Liberation of Macedonia (ASNOM) so that any wording deemed irredentist is removed.

      The proposed third amendment includes a reference that Macedonia respects the national sovereignty and territorial integrity of neighboring countries.

      The next plenary session of the Parliament to ratify the constitutional changes will take place on December 1.

      A month later the third and final vote to ratify the constitutional review will take place, meaning the name deal will be ratified by Macedonia by mid-January at the latest.
      Funny thing to see is what happens when the grk govt votes against the name change and the predavniks in Skopje are stuck with the name Republika Severna Makedonija. What a comedy show this will be having fyrom and severna makedonija attached on your armies sleeve lol.
      Slayer Of The Modern "greek" Myth!!!

      Comment

      • Phoenix
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2008
        • 4671

        Originally posted by TrueMacedonian View Post
        Funny thing to see is what happens when the grk govt votes against the name change and the predavniks in Skopje are stuck with the name Republika Severna Makedonija. What a comedy show this will be having fyrom and severna makedonija attached on your armies sleeve lol.
        I think that’s exactly what will happen or Zaev will continue making concessions to appease the greeks.

        On too many occasions already Zaev has publicly stated one thing only to do the exact opposite a short time later...he claims he is protecting the identity and language but unfortunately he has shown that he can’t be trusted with anything that he says...

        This is a disaster already and I believe it will get uglier.

        Comment

        • Vangelovski
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 8532

          Originally posted by TrueMacedonian View Post
          Funny thing to see is what happens when the grk govt votes against the name change and the predavniks in Skopje are stuck with the name Republika Severna Makedonija. What a comedy show this will be having fyrom and severna makedonija attached on your armies sleeve lol.
          Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
          I think that’s exactly what will happen or Zaev will continue making concessions to appease the greeks.
          I agree. In fact, this is what has been happening for the past 30 years. Successive Macedonian governments have capitulated on one issue after another (FYROM, Interim Accord, Flag etc) without being able to appease Greece, but have idiotically persisted in maintaining in perpetuity the initial capitulation. They very well may be stuck with NM and still have an open name dispute with Greece.
          If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

          The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

          Comment

          • Gocka
            Senior Member
            • Dec 2012
            • 2306

            FYRONM

            We can just keep adding fucking letters. Pretty soon we might have enough letters to form a word all on its own, then we can just use that.

            Comment

            • Risto the Great
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2008
              • 15658

              Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
              They very well may be stuck with NM and still have an open name dispute with Greece.
              I guarantee it. You think it will be easy to change back? No way! Not with the ethnic Albanians asking for further concessions in exchange.
              Risto the Great
              MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
              "Holding my breath for the revolution."

              Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

              Comment

              • Stojacanec
                Member
                • Dec 2009
                • 809

                You can only sit and watch in amazement that this is taking place.

                Comment

                • VMRO
                  Senior Member
                  • Sep 2008
                  • 1462

                  The sell outs from DPNE who voted were mentioning to have an amendment put in that if the Greeks don't ratify the agreement then the constitutional changes revert back.

                  Biggest drapachi if you ask me.
                  Verata vo Mislite, VMRO vo dushata, Makedonia vo Srceto.

                  Vnatreshna Makedonska Revolucionerna Organizacija.

                  Comment

                  • Risto the Great
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 15658

                    Reminds me of the "we want to be an independent Macedonia as long as we can join with Yugoslavia in the future" kind of thing.
                    Risto the Great
                    MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                    "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                    Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                    Comment

                    • Carlin
                      Senior Member
                      • Dec 2011
                      • 3332



                      „Бев кристално јасен дека ратификацијата на Договорот од Преспа мора да се финализира брзо ...

                      Comment

                      • Risto the Great
                        Senior Member
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 15658

                        Who would actually like that post. Pathetic Macedonians along with some (E)USA types I would imagine.
                        Risto the Great
                        MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA
                        "Holding my breath for the revolution."

                        Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

                        Comment

                        • Phoenix
                          Senior Member
                          • Dec 2008
                          • 4671

                          It's time for the EU and the clowns running the show to put an end to the constant threats against Macedonia...there's no active opposition in the country and all of the politicians can easily be bought...stop pretending you have a fight on your hands to get the agreement through parliament...
                          Last edited by Phoenix; 11-08-2018, 12:31 AM.

                          Comment

                          • Vangelovski
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 8532

                            A loyal opposition...loyal to whom?
                            If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14

                            The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

                            Comment

                            • Karposh
                              Member
                              • Aug 2015
                              • 863

                              На прашањето на ЦИВИЛ Медиа, кој политичар или функционер следен ќе избега од Македонија, еден од анкетираните граѓани ни одговори дека тоа ќе биде премиерот...


                              I have a lot of respect for the man in the above video-link. He looks like a guy who is mentally fatigued and exhausted by all the constant betrayals on his nation. The tone of his voice, the manner with which he speaks, his quite and unassuming demeanour, all point to a man who has lost all hope and trust in the system and is at a complete loss to explain why and how it has been allowed to come this far.
                              This is just a small snippet of the conversation at the start of the video:

                              -Koj politichar ke izbegne prv od Makedonija?
                              -Zaev
                              -Zashto?
                              -Pa oti nishto ne pravi kako shto treba...Se obratno pravi sho ne treba za Makedonija
                              -Kako primer?
                              -Pa sve...Od platformata do potpishuvanjeto na dogovorite
                              -Koja platforma? (dumb bitch reporter feigning ignorance from the side)
                              -Pa, Albanskata platforma..Neznam druga platforma ima? Makedonska platforma nema.

                              Comment

                              • Gocka
                                Senior Member
                                • Dec 2012
                                • 2306

                                Comments like these from the highest levels of leadership truly feel surreal to me. Its downright eerie and makes me feel like I'm in some dystopian scene straight out of Hollywood. What does that even mean?

                                That was my very first thought. How can an opposition in any regard be loyal to something they are in opposition to? These people are so drunk with power they have lost touch with reality. They don't even veil things anymore.

                                Scary days are ahead in the world.

                                Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
                                A loyal opposition...loyal to whom?

                                Comment

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