Was there a revolt in Macedonia in 1739?

[Soldier of Macedon]

I don't think there was any "greek" blood flowing from the Morea (as they called it then). The biggest and brightest of your war for independence were Albanians, Vlachs, and Slavs. It was the Great Powers that won the war for you. If it wasn't for the French the Albanian islands would have never have prospered as they did to give the war for independence its greatest assest. The Albanian sailors. That's in St.Claires book to.
In fact the so-called 'greek revolutionaries' were so wild about stealing and killing the Great Powers installed many of their own generals and admirals to lead the "greeks" to victory. When your best leader was Marko Botsaris (Marco Bocari) a bandit mountain warrior of Albanian origin then we know exactly why the Great Powers took the reins.

I am going to play devils advocate here and say (in corroboration of an earlier 19th century article you have produced) that of the total population in the territory of the new Bavarian-led state, no more than 20% of the population (and most probably less) spoke Greek (Demotiki) as a first language.

For the sake of objectivity, and despite the rapid promotion from westerners of the new 'Hellenic' idea, I feel that we need to allow for this consideration, if we are to take in other factors prevailing during that period.

If 'Greek blood' survived in any degree (albeit tainted like the rest of the Balkans), the Peloponnese would be the most likely place. What cannot be discounted however, is the huge influx of Slavs, Albanians and Latins in the same area, from which the current Peloponnesian stock would have been significantly drawn from.

[TrueMacedonian]

In the article above, are the Macedonians fighting in the ranks of the Russians or the Ottoman Vizier?

This speaks of events during Orlov's activities in the Peloponnese (1770).

Actually I posted the wrong pics. I'll have to search my pics tomorrow for the book I had where it states the bravery of the Macedonian contigent in the Russian army. For now here is a nice video to watch;

YouTube - Macedonians in Russia in 18th century AD - Russian documents

[TrueMacedonian]

I am going to play devils advocate here and say (in corroboration of an earlier 19th century article you have produced) that of the total population in the territory of the new Bavarian-led state, no more than 20% of the population (and most probably less) spoke Greek (Demotiki) as a first language.

For the sake of objectivity, and despite the rapid promotion from westerners of the new 'Hellenic' idea, I feel that we need to allow for this consideration, if we are to take in other factors prevailing during that period.

If 'Greek blood' survived in any degree (albeit tainted like the rest of the Balkans), the Peloponnese would be the most likely place. What cannot be discounted however, is the huge influx of Slavs, Albanians and Latins in the same area, from which the current Peloponnesian stock would have been significantly drawn from.

I'm sure a vial of ancient hellenic blood survives in a minute few. However it's not so much the blood but the culture instilled in them by foreigners. When I see todays imposter hellene say that they are related to the ancient Hellenes culturally it makes me wonder how long it took the philhellenes to brainwash an illiterate society into believing this. When it came to the Macedonians no outsider told us we were Macedonians. However the same cannot be said of our southern neighbors.

[Soldier of Macedon]

When the day comes where I bear witness to some Greek citizens routinely dress up in white robes and attending the Parthenon and Delphi, sacrfice animals, praying to 12 gods, etc, I will be believe in the cultural continuity of the 'Hellenes'.

[TrueMacedonian]

When the day comes where I bear witness to some Greek citizens routinely dress up in white robes and attending the Parthenon and Delphi, sacrfice animals, praying to 12 gods, etc, I will be believe in the cultural continuity of the 'Hellenes'.

Unfortunately they believe that 'hellenism' took many shapes and forms from the ancient (in which Droysen and the Germans included Macedonia) to the Byzantine (another hapless lie) to the present (the obvious lie). I wouldn't care about their lie at all if it did not affect Macedonia and the Macedonians.

[TrueMacedonian]

page285


Here's a small piece about the Macedonians (and many others) who saw the Russians as protectors against the Turk.

[makedonin]

Interestin in deed TM.

Tell me which Photo Shop version are you using

Just joking

[Spartan]

Albanian, Vlach and Slav blood also,

I agree
I would never try to discredit anyone who helped fight for an Independent Greece.
My point is the percentage of ethnic Greeks is highest in the the most southern regions of our rocky little penninsula. The further north you went, the more this percentage dropped.

Not only a push at the commencement, but their activity for the duration and most importantly conclusion was crucial to the success of the rebellion.

Again I can agree with this.
Tiny Greece could not hope to completely free itself from the power of the Ottomans without some serious help from serious powers.

The borders were drawn up and a decision on a monarch to be agreed upon at a later date - Not a single leader of the rebellion was consulted during the process.

Yes, but other European nations were formed this way as well.
Almost all the royal families of Europe have German blood , as they all intermix over the years through marriage. The Queen of Spain is half Greek I believe...
The idea of an independent Greece obviously benefited some of the great powers at the time, and they acted accordingly. Their acts benefitted the people of Greece, and that is why the Greeks, and the other nationalities fought and died to achieve this vision.

No problem brother, the more we debate the more fat we cut off from the mass of information, which will result in a lean version and depiction of events as close to the truth as possible.
We wont always agree with each other, but we can always learn from one another.

Beatifully put my friend
After about a year as a member of this forum, I have learned much from you guys, and can honestly say I would stand with you in your struggle. I just hope I may have dropped a tidbit of information here and there that you never knew about us who come from the south. We are a far cry from the 'grkomani' and 'prosfyga' Greeks you have come to know....

I am going to play devils advocate here and say (in corroboration of an earlier 19th century article you have produced) that of the total population in the territory of the new Bavarian-led state, no more than 20% of the population (and most probably less) spoke Greek (Demotiki) as a first language.

Whatever the number is SoM, it is higher in the south. The Peloponnese is where the Greek language has been spoken as the overwhelming majority in any time period up until now. Now I know language doesnt = ethnicity, but for the language to continue and evolve naturally over such a long span of time, there must have been Greeks who spoke and taught the language to the various ethnicities that have been assimilated over the centuries. You see, we dont speak the 'textbook' Greek of the north. We have our own dialect that has evolved and is different from the Greek spoken in other regions.

If 'Greek blood' survived in any degree (albeit tainted like the rest of the Balkans), the Peloponnese would be the most likely place. What cannot be discounted however, is the huge influx of Slavs, Albanians and Latins in the same area, from which the current Peloponnesian stock would have been significantly drawn from.

I do not deny the many cultures that have been assimilated.
It adds to the culture and charachter of the region imo, and I see no reason to ignore it. Actually it should be honored....

If 'Greek blood' survived in any degree (albeit tainted like the rest of the Balkans),

I can agree with this, if you can as well, we have achieved something.
I dont claim to be any more 'pure' than anyone else.
Just like Macedonians, Bulgars ,Serbs and Albanians all exist, I believe Greeks do as well. We have all mixed, and assimilated different peoples, but we all remain as seperate ethnicities.
If this can be accepted by more of us, half the problem has been solved as far as Im concerned....

When the day comes where I bear witness to some Greek citizens routinely dress up in white robes and attending the Parthenon and Delphi, sacrfice animals, praying to 12 gods, etc, I will be believe in the cultural continuity of the 'Hellenes'.

My friend
You wont have to wait long my good man. There is some type of Hellenic religion in Greece, with about 2000 followers. These clowns believe in the 12 gods of Olympus, and worship at ancient temples dressed in white togas.Humerous to say the least.
Ill find some info, and post it. We can have a good laugh over it, as this topic is getting a little to serious.
Risto, Im sure , will have a great laugh over it as well. lol

[Soldier of Macedon]

Είσαι καλός άνθρωπος Σπαρτιάτη, I have Greek friends that are like you, easy going, may not agree with every fact of the last 3,000 years, but complete respect for each other as Macedonian to Greek and vice versa. We can begin to build some bridges with people like you, and I think it is fitting that you are from the extreme south of Greece and hence have had no part to play in the suffering of the Macedonians, as this ensures your objectivity. Your contributions on these forums have been respectfully received and as a member you are a regular contributor to the MTO forums, you are most welcome to continue giving your opinions on any subject.

I definetly have a new found respect for Spartan honour.

As for the looney tunes that believe in the 12 gods, I have seen something about them in the past, but by all means open up a new thread and lets see what they're all about.

[Spartan]

Euxapisto file, episis
You guys gotta help me sharpen up my Macedonian, so I can respond in your language as well, lol.
I will find this info and post it soon, it is quite humerous to say the least.

PS
Did you see the Caesar quote I found in regards to Alexander?
Sig material man....

[TrueMacedonian]

Spartan you by chance wouldn't happen to be Spartiati from Maknews would you?

[Spartan]

I am
I came out with that on my first post here-

Some of you may remember me as Spartiati from Maknews. I look forward to reading this new forum, and engaging in some interesting conversations.

-09-03-2008

[TrueMacedonian]

Spartan I actually remember having some good convos with you. Here you go it's on me. A Macedonian song with the Bouzoki lol enjoy http://www.macedoniantruth.org/forum...read.php?t=954

[Spartan]

I remember as well
Nice song too!
That sounds very similar to many of our songs, that guy definitely plays a nice bouzouki.
I also think this guy may have borrowed the instrument from a Greek buddy of his, Fotakis! lol
1:49 of the video, look at the writing at the top of the Bouzouki near his left hand.
I have the eyes of a hawk, lol......

[TrueMacedonian]

I remember as well
Nice song too!
That sounds very similar to many of our songs, that guy definitely plays a nice bouzouki.
I also think this guy may have borrowed the instrument from a Greek buddy of his, Fotakis! lol
1:49 of the video, look at the writing at the top of the Bouzouki near his left hand.
I have the eyes of a hawk, lol......

I noticed that too. However I don't think the bouzouki is a "greek only" instrument. Definitely a balkan instrument.