Macedonian Surnames

[Constellation]

My quote function is playing up...does this happen to anyone else - you click on the quote button but then the dialogue box is empty whereas it should have the text qouted for you?

That part does mean that. I never wrote the second part:



You also never said anything about the sentence in cyrillic.

What does it mean then? Please, explain.

As for the second part, it was more of a inference from the overall conversations.

[Vangelovski]

This does not mean “maybe he does not even know” Macedonian? What part was misconstrued by me?

My quote function is playing up...does this happen to anyone else - you click on the quote button but then the dialogue box is empty whereas it should have the text qouted for you?

That part does mean that. I never wrote the second part:

Vangelovski posits that maybe I just don't know Macedonian,and maybe that explains why I don't write in Macedonian

You also never said anything about the sentence in cyrillic.

[Constellation]

Mozno e da ne znae.

This does not mean “maybe he does not even know” Macedonian? What part was misconstrued by me?

[Vangelovski]

Vangelovski posits that maybe I just don't know Macedonian, and maybe that explains why I don't write in Macedonian.

That's not really what I said.

[Gocka]

Well then lets get back to the topic at hand shall we?

I was born in and lived in the the Republic of Macedonia for half my life, specifically the Ohrid region. In that area of all my extended family probably numbering close to a 100 people not a single one has a name with Slav in it. My friends, neighbors and acquaintances which is hard to put a number on, but maybe 5 or so people out of 200-300, have a name with Slav in it. Maybe, I find that those kind of names are more common in Eastern and Northern Macedonia, but just slightly in comparison to the almost none in western Macedonia. Overall I think in comparison to Bulgaria, and Serbia, we have by far the smallest occurrence of those kind of names, which seems to have spiked in the Yugoslav era and now a days is all but dead.

As far as names being used as far back as the middles ages, that's true, but I also would pose the question what the purpose or meaning of the word Slav in a name has. For example Miroslav, Mir which means peace, Slavish, to celebrate, so the name means to celebrate peace, I don't think it means Peace the Slavic one. It seems the names that have slav in them are names that could be verbs, and not just names of people. Vojoslav, Branislav, these names are in my opinion verbs that are being celebrated, and note meant to denote a lineage.

Macedonians and Bulgarians are distinct ethnicities. While the languages are similar, it is Bulgarian which owes its language to Macedonia, and not as the Bulgarians and the Greeks claim Macedonia owes its language to Bulgarian.

Macedonians cannot be Bulgarians, for today's Macedonians are part of the older Mediterranean cluster of nations. It is impossible, therefore, for them to have become Bulgars or to descend from Bulgars.

[Constellation]

con whils.t you mention that the macedonian language is not bulgarian.You didn't mention that the original bulgars died out a long time ago.They were replaced by tartars,turkish style,mongols.Look at these so called bulgarians with slanted eyes.Yes they are using our language and alphabet.Everything doesn't seem to be what it is.The bulgarians are not man enough to admit to this and that they are wrong in their claims tha macedonians are bulgarians.This brings us into the real picture.

So I guess this makes me Bulgarian then?

Yes, I failed to mention this, as this was not the question posed by Gocka. Moreover, the theory that they are mongols may not be true. Igenea, for example, has the following numbers for Bulgarians:

Bulgaria:
49% Thracian
15% Slavs
15% Hellenic
11% Macedonian
05% Phoenician

http://say-macedonia.blogspot.nl/2008/10/genetic-comparison-of-balkan-nations.html

There is no indication of Turkish admixture here.

[George S.]

con whils.t you mention that the macedonian language is not bulgarian.You didn't mention that the original bulgars died out a long time ago.They were replaced by tartars,turkish style,mongols.Look at these so called bulgarians with slanted eyes.Yes they are using our language and alphabet.Everything doesn't seem to be what it is.The bulgarians are not man enough to admit to this and that they are wrong in their claims tha macedonians are bulgarians.This brings us into the real picture.

[Constellation]

Don't let it get to you. People can be kind of defensive, since we get idiots posing as one thing or another on a regular basis. I didn't exactly get the read carpet treatment either at first, come to think of it I still don't nor does anyone else.

Your answer and your word is good enough for me. I wish we could all just ask you everything upfront instead of beating around the bush and then accusing. I'll admit something didn't seem right, but we also did kind of jump on your back from the get go.

I can agree with a lot of what you posted.

The only things that I want to ask you, and forgive me if it offends you somehow, I only want to get a good idea of what your beliefs are. How do you feel about Bulgaria? Do you think Macedonians are a distinct ethnicity apart from any other, including Bulgarian? Answer me this like you have everything else I asked and I wont have any more questions.

Macedonians and Bulgarians are distinct ethnicities. While the languages are similar, it is Bulgarian which owes its language to Macedonia, and not as the Bulgarians and the Greeks claim Macedonia owes its language to Bulgarian.

Macedonians cannot be Bulgarians, for today's Macedonians are part of the older Mediterranean cluster of nations. It is impossible, therefore, for them to have become Bulgars or to descend from Bulgars.

[Constellation]

George is saying that I refused to identify myself to the admin of the forum and that I keep repeating the Slav argument, and ends with “Izgledat ne i makedonec”, which basically means “it looks like he is not Macedonian”. George, how do you know this?

Lavce states for me not to worry and that we should not argue, but for me to write in Macedonian to prove I am Macedonian.

Dragan agrees with Lavce, and begins to posit a conspiracy theory of how I am using Google and Google Maps to deceive the forum. He then later asks why I don't know Macedonian, and ends with the request that I should yell (bekni, or as pronounced in English, “veeknee”), so it can be filmed or recorded on lenta/tape.

Vangelovski posits that maybe I just don't know Macedonian, and maybe that explains why I don't write in Macedonian.

Gocka defends me and states “ima mnogu nasi so neznat ni dva zbora”, which basically means "there are many of our own who do not know how to speak Macedonian”. I was born outside of Macedonia (stranstvo), he writes, and me being a foreigner would explain my lack of Macedonian.

Ah, but I do know how to speak Macedonian. How do you think I get by when I travel to Macedonian? You think I speak English?

Obviously, you people did not figure I know how to read Macedonian.

[Gocka]

Da,zatoa vikam,mozebi ke igra na taa karta kako opravduvanje zaso ne znae Makedonski.I da e izrasnal u mesto kaj so nemalo ni eden Makedonec,sigurno ima tatko/majka od koj da nauce...
Constellation,bekni be brat,ke mi snema lenta

To e logicno da pomislis ama za zal, ima mnogu nasi so neznat ni dva zbora. Po gotovo decava so se rodeni vo stranstvo, imat golem prosekt so neznat ni da zborvat, a ne kamoli da citet i da pisat na kirilica. A ovaj tipov, neznam, znajme site deka nesto e sumlivo, ama do sega nemat nisto receno protiv Makedonci, i site odgovori so gi davat mislam se tocni. Mislam deka e Makedonec, samo ne gledat deka nacinot so se pocna bese mnogu sumliv.

[Gocka]

Don't let it get to you. People can be kind of defensive, since we get idiots posing as one thing or another on a regular basis. I didn't exactly get the read carpet treatment either at first, come to think of it I still don't nor does anyone else.

Your answer and your word is good enough for me. I wish we could all just ask you everything upfront instead of beating around the bush and then accusing. I'll admit something didn't seem right, but we also did kind of jump on your back from the get go.

I can agree with a lot of what you posted.

The only things that I want to ask you, and forgive me if it offends you somehow, I only want to get a good idea of what your beliefs are. How do you feel about Bulgaria? Do you think Macedonians are a distinct ethnicity apart from any other, including Bulgarian? Answer me this like you have everything else I asked and I wont have any more questions.

I am not obsessed with all things Slavic. I think the Slav issue is used by Greeks and Western scholars to argue against our Macedonian heritage. Understanding who or what Slavs are is therefore paramount to understanding the truth of the Macedonian Question. Surely I cannot be the only one on this forum to see how we are denied our identity because we are called Slavs. This is a pejorative term to us, as it implies we descend from ethnic Slavic tribes from the north. It implies we first entered the Balkans in the 6th century or so, and thus outside of the lineage of ancient Macedonia. All objective scientific evidence available proves we are a Mediterranean Balkan people with roots in the land dating back thousands of years. We are not Slavs. Yet the issue is not so clear cut. How did we become Slavic speakers? Were the Macedonians always Slavic speakers? Who were the Slavs? What are Slavs? And did they migrate en mass to the Balkans and in Macedonia? I find these questions fascinating.

To the rest of you who examine me I state the following.

Why would a Greek, pretending to be Macedonian, not openly state from the beginning his fake city of origin? If I have no scruples about pretending to be Macedonian, why would I have scruples about pretending to be from Bitola, or Skopje, or whatnot? Moreover, if I am a closet Greek, why would I be so stupid as to name Gevgelija, a city on the border of Greece, as the city of origin? Why would I not state Kumanovo? Oh, maybe I because then I would be called a secret Albanian? I'm not sure what kind of Greek believes Macedonia should be called the Republic of Macedonia, and today's Macedonians are not Slavs, or Slav Macedonians, but Macedonians. But hey, I guess I really don't know, do I?

[George S.]

ovoj ne my odgovori na prashvajneto na admin.Ve;lit e makedonec od gevgelia a nemozitda zborrvat po nasi.stalno samo prasvat za sllavjanec da ni obesit.avjani.Sakat sinjir so znak slavjani da ni obesit.Izgledat ne i makedonec.

[Vangelovski]

Da,zatoa vikam,mozebi ke igra na taa karta kako opravduvanje zaso ne znae Makedonski.I da e izrasnal u mesto kaj so nemalo ni eden Makedonec,sigurno ima tatko/majka od koj da nauce...
Constellation,bekni be brat,ke mi snema lenta

Mozno e da ne znae. Brat mi vrska nema od Makedonskiot.

[DraganOfStip]

Од прво мислам дека кажа никогаш немал стапнато во Македонија...

Da,zatoa vikam,mozebi ke igra na taa karta kako opravduvanje zaso ne znae Makedonski.I da e izrasnal u mesto kaj so nemalo ni eden Makedonec,sigurno ima tatko/majka od koj da nauce...
Constellation,bekni be brat,ke mi snema lenta

[Vangelovski]

da znaese on makedonski nemase da ceka tolku postovi pred da kaze od kaj navodno bil.i site tie gradovi so gi pisa se naogat nogu lesno so google,bilo so prebaruvanje ili so google maps.sega mozebi ke kaze deka izrasnal u stranstvo pa zatoa ne si go znae jaziko.aj bas da videme.

Од прво мислам дека кажа никогаш немал стапнато во Македонија...