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Vangelovski my son one time took my wallet $450 to school whilst he was 5yr & in kindergaten.He went to the canteen & decided to shout drinks to everyone.Lucky the women stopped him because he had a lot of money on him.I had a good laugh about it.
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"Ido not want an uprising of people that would leave me at the first failure, I want revolution with citizens able to bear all the temptations to a prolonged struggle, what, because of the fierce political conditions, will be our guide or cattle to the slaughterhouse"
GOTSE DELCEV -
Phoenix,Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
Just a small note to clear up some of the confusion around evolution and adaptability issues that you raised.
Much of the confusion around the concept of "evolution" is that this word is commonly used to describe two very different things:- Micro-evolution refers to the fact that living things have a built-in variability which allows them to adapt to small changes in the environment. When scientists say that evolution is a proven fact, they mean that micro-evolution is a proven fact. No creation scientist disputes this. Indeed, this ability to adapt would be expected as a part of "good design". Textbook examples of "evolution in action" almost always describe this type of small change, such as the "peppered moth" story, or the development of resistance to pesticides. What is happening in these cases is not the creation of something new, but merely the emphasis of an already existing trait.
- Macro-evolution refers to the type of change which has created people from hydrogen gas. Evolutionists say that large scale change is possible because we have seen small scale change in action. However, the flaw in this reasoning is that living systems have limits beyond which no further change can take place.
If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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TV, where do you sit with the possibility of 'life' elsewhere in our universe, as purely a hypothetical question.Comment
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hypothetically anything is possible, theologically no and scientifically, in my view, no (because of the incalculable mathematical improbability and the information problem).Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
What do you think of the problem of information. For example, the instructions for how to build, operate, and repair living cells represent a vast amount of information (estimated at 12 billion bits). However, information is a mental, non-material concept. It can never arise from a natural process and is always the result of an intelligence. Just as a newspaper story transcends the ink on the paper, life’s DNA itself (like the ink) is not the information (the story), it is simply a physical storage facility. Modifying the DNA via mutation can never produce new genetic information to drive upward evolution, just as spilling coffee on the newspaper, thereby modifying the distribution of the ink, will never improve the story.If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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Vangelovski you have so much theological knowledge you could be a priest . It would be awesome for our non maco partners to hear our services in english . Am impressed"The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task."__________________Gotse DelchevComment
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TV, I honestly believe that our journey along this path of knowledge is in its infancy. There's another 'world' yet to be discovered at the sub atomic level (including particles and forces) where science is only just developing the technology to observe and test these findings.Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
My view of Christianity and beliefs such as creationism is its unfortunate inability to 'evolve', as mankind makes new discoveries, which one day may be the realisation that life exists beyond our planet.
It appears that Christianity of all the Worlds religions, is the poorest equipped to make this adjustment.Comment
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Agreed. But this only makes things more complex and more improbable that it happened by chance.Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
I would argue that scientific discoveries have supported Christianity and don't see why it would need to change. Besides, God is unchanging, he's not going to go with the flow everytime we change our minds about something or develop a new theory. He knows whats whatOriginally posted by Phoenix View Post
What other religion do you know of that has engaged science in order to discover how the world works? Do you know which religion the founders of modern science adhered to?
If science contradicts religion, how do atheists explain the fact that most of the great scientists of the past believed in God and took the Bible seriously? The Institute of Creation Research (USA), for example, lists 31 such scientists together with the scientific disciplines they helped to establish. They include Kepler (astronomy), Pascal (hydrostatics), Boyle (chemistry), Newton (calculus), Linnaeus (systematic biology), Faraday (electromagnetics), Cuvier (comparative anatomy), Kelvin (thermodynamics), Lister (antiseptic surgery), Mendel (genetics), and many other equally famous names.
If religion is an obstacle to science, how do atheists get round the fact that empirical science first arose in Christian Europe, three centuries before the rise of Darwinism? It did so precisely because of the almost universal belief in a Creator God. This gave the founders of modern science the confidence they needed that the natural world was orderly and therefore capable of systematic investigation. They expected to find ‘law’ in Nature because they believed in a Lawgiver. Or, to use another analogy, they assumed that the ‘Book of Nature’ had a readable ‘text’ because Nature had an Author.If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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It would be good for young Macedonians you don't understand a word of Macedonian to hear them as wellOriginally posted by julie View Post
Though, it would be good if they learn't Macedonian!If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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I'm mainly talking about Christianity and its uncomfortable fit with the prospect of other life on other worlds in the Universe...Originally posted by Vangelovski View PostAgreed. But this only makes things more complex and more improbable that it happened by chance.
I would argue that scientific discoveries have supported Christianity and don't see why it would need to change. Besides, God is unchanging, he's not going to go with the flow everytime we change our minds about something or develop a new theory. He knows whats what What other religion do you know of that has engaged science in order to discover how the world works? Do you know which religion the founders of modern science adhered to?
Current scientific (astronomy) focus is on the discovery of Earth like planets within our own galaxy...exoplanets that exist in a habitable zone in relationship to their host star where water can exist in liquid form, the belief is that there are trillions of such places in the universe...where the evolutionary forces recoginized on Earth could be replicated elsewhere...Comment
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Thats a massive presupposition that evolution is true. Evolution remains to be proven, and the evidence (such as the information problem) strongly suggests that it is false. Considering the evidence I have provided, don't you think that you are taking a huge leap of faith?Originally posted by Phoenix View PostIf my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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TV, what I can't get my head around is this concept of a divine creator who has manufactured this immense universe that modern science has shown us consists of billions of solar systems and the likelihood of trillions and trillions of planets...and yet the creator has decided to spoil us as the solitary place in the universe with diversity and complexity of life...doesn't it make you think what is the purpose of the 'void' of everything else...?Originally posted by Vangelovski View PostComment
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Well, God has created us so that we worship and serve him. If he's decided that we are all he wants, then so be it. Why does there need to be a purpose to the 'void'? If evolution is true, then everything is purposeless and there is no meaning to anything - its just random chance.Originally posted by Phoenix View PostIf my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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Can't evolution serve a purpose...?Originally posted by Vangelovski View Post
The evolution of mankind is purpose enough, from savage to a higher intelligence, a journey that could see mankind one day reach a higher plane of existence, perhaps assuming the mantle of 'creator'...I don't see that as a bad thing...Comment
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Evolution is blind chance. There is no guiding force, no intelligence, just randomness. How can there be a purpose? By definition, evolution is purposeless.Originally posted by Phoenix View Post
Man assuming the mantle of creator? You're starting to sound like the anti-Christ
If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14
The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John AdamsComment
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TV, why do you fear the progress of mankind, we're already playing a small part in the creation of life. Today many couples are able to have children because of advances in science, we've unlocked many of the secrets of the building blocks of life...slow progress will eventually become a stampede, I hope you're not left behind wearing the ill fitting straightjacket of fundementalist Christianity...Originally posted by Vangelovski View PostEvolution is blind chance. There is no guiding force, no intelligence, just randomness. How can there be a purpose? By definition, evolution is purposeless.
Man assuming the mantle of creator? You're starting to sound like the anti-Christ
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