Albanianization in Macedonia

[Niko777]

Yes but todays region of the R.of Macedonia doesnt cover up the land of ancient Macedonia...while the regions where albanians live were ancient Illyria and Paeonia!

Illyria was inhabited with Illyrians and Paeonia with Paeonians and Dardania with Dardanians. NOT Shqiptars/Tosks/Ghegs - these people came in the Middle Ages and Ottoman Empire. As for Macedonia, people from this region called themselves Macedonians for the last 2500 years.

I am done feeding this troll.

[Bugi]

You are NOT from Macedonia! So do not talk like you know the situation. Here is what the Albanians from Macedonia are saying:

"Even if we had more rights than the Macedonians, we dont really care about Macedonia, we are working on the Greater Albania Project".

Why should we invest even more? For a Greater Albania?

I know more about it than you think,I even lived in Struga for 3 years!

and you are even to 'blame' for the high birth rate in the albanian population
the state forced industrialization upon the macedonians and encouraged the macedonian population to move from the villages into the cities,while the albanians were marginalized and remained in the villages without any education and the right to it on their mother tongue.

so,as I said before,if you gave us rights and didint discriminate us back then,now we would probably be much less in number

[Bugi]

Illyria was inhabited with Illyrians and Paeonia with Paeonians and Dardania with Dardanians. NOT Shqiptars/Tosks/Ghegs - these people came in the Middle Ages and Ottoman Empire. As for Macedonia, people from this region called themselves Macedonians for the last 2500 years.

I am done feeding this troll.

Todays R.of Macedonia in terms of territory has nothing to do with the ancient region of Macedonia,this part was firstly named as Macedonia under roman occupation-under which it became a province!

Paeonians and Dardanians were subgroups of the Illirians!

every ethnic group has its evolution process,if you are ancient macedonians,how come you speak slavic?

-exactly my point,and the point and proof of the current reality on why there are Tosk's and Gheg's

[makgerman]

Looks like I have to remind you that all these incidents were started by macedonians...

macedonians-thousands of them were screaming antialbanian chants in Belgrade on the handball tournament.

reaction:albanians burn the macedonian flag

macedonians mock the islamic religion,flag and the muslim woman

reaction:muslims-many of them albanians burn the macedonian flag

macedonian policeman with a criminal background kills 2 albanian youths

reaction:what we have today

criminal act like that are done everywhere by all ethnic groups...
and ofcourse,the albanians that fought for the albanians are racist terrorists,how old is that

macedonians-thousands of them were screaming antialbanian chants in Belgrade on the handball tournament.

You are a lost cause with a typical Albanian "eye for an eye" way of thinking.
In Kosovo the shqiptars abused, threatened, swore, spat at the Macedonian junior team. Did the Macedonian burn your flag, start a demonstration - No.
How do the Macedonians mock the Islamic religion. Do we burn your mosques, do we destroy your graves?

The Macedonian flag should be respected by everyone who wants to regards themselves as part of Macedonia. If you worship the Albanian then go back to Albania.

I like many other people don't believe the current Australian flag represents the nation as a whole. There were times when a small percentage of Australians chanting racist comments against the "European Wogs". Did anyone burn the Australian flag?

Self defense against four drug dealers threatening and attacking a policeman in front of his daughter is acceptable to you?? Poor Albanian youths -four of them against a Macedonian policeman?
Imagine if it was the other way around. The shqiptars will have made sure the other two were dead also.

What you have today is what we have allowed you to have. It is time for the Macedonian people to wake up and insist on the government take the Albanian problem as a High Priority.

The Shqiptars main aim is to destroy Macedonia and none of this bullshit to live in a multicultural society where everyone will be treated equally. They are in the process of dividing Macedonia in the way they did to Serbia's Kosovo.

[Phoenix]

If the shiptari have this rabbit like reproductive capacity and have existed in Macedonia since "pre recorded history" (btw...how does he know this if it's been in a "pre-recorded" period?) wouldn't the shiptar population be much higher today, considering by comparison the lower birthrate of the Macedonians and the waves of Macedonian emigration in the period from the 1950's through to the 1970's.

Instead we have numerous accounts of outright fraud and irregularities in an attempt to quantify the shiptar numbers and recently we witnessed the failure to complete the last census.

If the shiptar numbers are so "high" why is there a need to manipulate the figures, surely the Macedonian landscape would resemble that of the ubiquitous battery hen farm and Macedonia would be awash with folk wearing egg shells on their heads...

[Risto the Great]

what do you have against the albanians engoying their full rights as macedonian citizens?
they pay their taxes like you do,why shouldnt they have the same rights as the macedonians?

I agree with you!
My turn:
Why should ethnic Albanians (as a minority) have more rights than Macedonians in accordance with the framework agreement?

[George S.]

AS Normal MACEDONIAN citizens they should have the same rights.If they want the same rights as Albanians they want secession & seperatist rights.Foreign rights should not exist only to extent of cultural & linguistic rights any more & you are encroaching on soveregnity of a country.The albanians when in macedonia should do what the macedonians do.Anything else is a no no.The ohrid agreement is a joke where they are IMPOSING on a sovereign country foreign citizen rights.THe best thing that albanians can hope to be macedonian citizens & enjoy the same rights of other macedonian citizens outside that you are asking for trouble.,When the soveregnity of a country is erroded you are asking for trouble.
The thing is the albanians are going beyond macedonian rights they are really asking to have their own country within a country.No one has that right at the expense of majority macedonian rule.Someone has to pull the albanians into line they can't be asking more & more & expect deliverance at the expense of macedonian citizens.

[Big Bad Sven]

deffending the etnic group that tried to asimilate you and denied/denies your ethnicity,church,language...over the albanians who recognize you in terms of everything just shows the level of antialbanian sentiment in you...

Lol albania does not recognize the macedonian republic, only as FYROM

Shiptars in macedonia dont recognize or accept our flag, want it changed, same as the name of macedonia.

In kosovo the shiptars treat the goranci like garbage and try to forcefully assimilate them.

You guys dont respect macedonia one bit.

[Big Bad Sven]

macedonian policeman with a criminal background kills 2 albanian youths

reaction:what we have today

criminal act like that are done everywhere by all ethnic groups...
and ofcourse,the albanians that fought for the albanians are racist terrorists,how old is that

LOL you are pathetic!

The policeman was attacked by DRUG DEALERS in front of his OWN house, and they also threatened his own DAUGHTER!

There is no excuse for the 4 shiptar drug dealers for intimidating a policeman, but you are so blinded by hate and nationalism that you are willing to defend drug dealer criminals just because they are albanian.

You are pathetic

[Big Bad Sven]

Todays R.of Macedonia in terms of territory has nothing to do with the ancient region of Macedonia,this part was firstly named as Macedonia under roman occupation-under which it became a province!

Paeonians and Dardanians were subgroups of the Illirians!

every ethnic group has its evolution process,if you are ancient macedonians,how come you speak slavic?

-exactly my point,and the point and proof of the current reality on why there are Tosk's and Gheg's

But ancient macedonia extended as far as kosovo at its peak bre tikvar, and skopje was part of ancient macedonia too! And when the ancient macedonian kingdom fell apart im sure many ancient macedonians still lived in most of those places. When the ottoman empire collapsed there were still many turks in the balkans and arabic lands!

What makes you shiptars so special, that makes you guys "ethnically pure"? Your starting to sound like the modern "greeks'! Let me guess, you can trace your family tree back to the ancient Illyrians lol

[Bugi]

You are a lost cause with a typical Albanian "eye for an eye" way of thinking.
In Kosovo the shqiptars abused, threatened, swore, spat at the Macedonian junior team. Did the Macedonian burn your flag, start a demonstration - No.
How do the Macedonians mock the Islamic religion. Do we burn your mosques, do we destroy your graves?

The Macedonian flag should be respected by everyone who wants to regards themselves as part of Macedonia. If you worship the Albanian then go back to Albania.

I like many other people don't believe the current Australian flag represents the nation as a whole. There were times when a small percentage of Australians chanting racist comments against the "European Wogs". Did anyone burn the Australian flag?

Self defense against four drug dealers threatening and attacking a policeman in front of his daughter is acceptable to you?? Poor Albanian youths -four of them against a Macedonian policeman?
Imagine if it was the other way around. The shqiptars will have made sure the other two were dead also.

What you have today is what we have allowed you to have. It is time for the Macedonian people to wake up and insist on the government take the Albanian problem as a High Priority.

The Shqiptars main aim is to destroy Macedonia and none of this bullshit to live in a multicultural society where everyone will be treated equally. They are in the process of dividing Macedonia in the way they did to Serbia's Kosovo.

treated equally?
so why dont albanians dont have full rights as macedonians?
why the albanian language is not official on all state levels?

What we have today in Macedonia is what we fought for and got through blood!

if it wasnt for our struggle,you wouldnt give us anything!
you are contradicting yourself with this sentcence!

do you know how many times the albanian flag was burned?
as I said,start looking at the cause!

making fun of islamic values is a insult,you should have known better!

this is not Australia,this is the balkans,things here are a little bit more complicated...

[Big Bad Sven]

When someone is pushed to the wall he doesnt have any other choice than to chose the bad but at that moment,the only choice!

Let me remind you that albanians arent just a minority in Macedonia,albanians are on those territories since pre recorded history,and they are more than 30% of the population-not exactly a minority...
serbs in Kosovo are 5% and they have serbian as official language on the entire territory of the country and in all levels of government!

if they didint take arms,the discrimination would have resumed,they only had the right to learn their language in elemantary school...
you know the protests that macedonians staged in 1997?
would you remind me what were they about?

other minorities got their rights thanks to the albanians...

You didnt answer the mans question, stop skirting around the issue with your stupid philosofical sayings and shiptars dreams about kosovo!

Tell us, what "discrimination" and "lack of rights" do shiptars face in macedonia today from the evil and nationalistic(lol) macedonian government?

Btw, its been a proven fact that shiptars dont make 30% of macedonia's population. If you take away for fabrication of cencuse results and the bullying of non-albanian muslims you get something closer to 17%, which was revealed to us last year....

[Bugi]

If the shiptari have this rabbit like reproductive capacity and have existed in Macedonia since "pre recorded history" (btw...how does he know this if it's been in a "pre-recorded" period?) wouldn't the shiptar population be much higher today, considering by comparison the lower birthrate of the Macedonians and the waves of Macedonian emigration in the period from the 1950's through to the 1970's.

Instead we have numerous accounts of outright fraud and irregularities in an attempt to quantify the shiptar numbers and recently we witnessed the failure to complete the last census.

If the shiptar numbers are so "high" why is there a need to manipulate the figures, surely the Macedonian landscape would resemble that of the ubiquitous battery hen farm and Macedonia would be awash with folk wearing egg shells on their heads...

today you have a bigger albanian-macedonian diaspora than a macedonian diaspora,so...

If it wasnt for the deportations of albanians from Serboslavian controlled Vardar Banovina,we would have been double the number we are today!

in royal and communist yugoslavia,about 250,000 albanian muslims are sent to Turkey under a series of treaties between the two states...

Skopje/Shkupi for example,before the serbian occupation in 1912,was a 60% muslim city!

[Bugi]

You didnt answer the mans question, stop skirting around the issue with your stupid philosofical sayings and shiptars dreams about kosovo!

Tell us, what "discrimination" and "lack of rights" do shiptars face in macedonia today from the evil and nationalistic(lol) macedonian government?

Btw, its been a proven fact that shiptars dont make 30% of macedonia's population. If you take away for fabrication of cencuse results and the bullying of non-albanian muslims you get something closer to 17%, which was revealed to us last year....

I told you,the right to have the albanian language on all levels!

I gave you a clear fact from 2008/2009 from the state statistics department!

If we are 17% of the total population,then how can we make up 33% of the kids on the albanian program in primary schools?

that kind of young population structure doesnt even exist in Pakistan and Afghanistan

the number of albanian students in pre-school age,primary and highschool is about 150,000 !

If we are 17% of the total population-which is 340,000,how can we have a population under 18 years of age that numbers 45%?

As I said,not even Pakistan and Afghanistan have those numbers!

so it is more like we are around 550,000 or 30% under the age of 18-which means we make up 27-28% of the total population!

[Bugi]

I agree with you!
My turn:
Why should ethnic Albanians (as a minority) have more rights than Macedonians in accordance with the framework agreement?

well why should albanians be treated as a minority?

I would like to think more about the future,and the future shows that the albanians will grow in terms of the share in the macedonian population body,which means Macedonia will have find new ways in order to make the upcoming generation feel it as their own country!

thats the main problem,albanians dont feel wanted,they feel the state/government as foreign!