1916 Grk Magazine article upset that soldiers in grk army speak Albanian

[TrueMacedonian]

Originally Posted by Voltron

Negative. Koundouritis was an Arvanite. They consider themselves different from Albanians proper. That said, to say that the majority of Greece's Armed Forces spoke Albanian is just false. He just mentions the Navy.

You should be ashamed of yourself by denying what language was the dominant language in your country's armed forces. Arvanite? Albanian? Ok let us examine something here:


Collective memory, by Victor Roudometof page 155. Hell man if the president in 1925 was proud of being Albanian I am certain Koundo and his sailors were just as proud of being Albanian:


The Albanians, by Edwin E. Jacques. page 328

My gosh this topic is a nightmare for you people.

[julie]

Love your work TM, denial is rampant amongst them, keep posting

[Voltron]

TM you dont get it. Arvanitika was spoken as a majority only in certain areas of Greece. You can look at any map. Its not denial, its historical fact.

[TrueMacedonian]

Originally Posted by Voltron

TM you dont get it. Arvanitika was spoken as a majority only in certain areas of Greece. You can look at any map. Its not denial, its historical fact.

I don't care what map you toss up in front of me. Do these maps take bi-lingualism or tri-lingualism into consideration?

[TrueMacedonian]

Let's now re-iterate again where we are at with this debate (not really a debate just reality):

]








page 352


Collective memory, by Victor Roudometof page 155

The Albanians, by Edwin E. Jacques. page 328

[Epirot]

We have been accustomed with the groundless claims of our southern neighbors to diminish the influence of Albanians in the creation of Greece. But their madness has no boundary: they are trying with all means to obscure the Albanian origin of the Suliotes. Let take us a look what they have wrote in Wiki:

Markos Botsaris (Greek: Μάρκος Μπότσαρης, c. 1788 – 21 August 1823) was a Souliote captain[1] and a hero of the War of Greek Independence. Markos Botsaris is among the most revered national heroes in Greece.

Botsaris was born into one of the leading clans of the Souliotes, in Epirus.[2] He was the second son of captain Kitsos Botsaris, who was murdered in Arta in 1809 under the orders of Ali Pasha. The Botsaris clan came from the village of Dragani (today Ambelia), near Paramythia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markos_Botsaris

Marko Boçari was of course a Suliot, but what article fail to mention is that Suliotes were just a branch of Albanian chams, one of the most warlike Albanian communities in south. Their name probably derives from the Albanian word suli, meaning "mountain summit" as Babiniotis ascertained: G. Λεξικό της Νέας Ελληνικής Γλώσσας. Athens, 1998.

Souliotes (Greek: Σουλιώτες, also spelled Souliots or Suliots) were a warlike community who became famous across Greece for their resistance against the local Ottoman Pashalik of Yanina ruled by the Muslim Albanian Ali Pasha. After their defeat in 1803, the Souliotes were forced to move to the rest of Greece, and many of them played a prominent role in the Greek War of Independence starting in 1821, under leaders such as Markos Botsaris and Kitsos Tzavelas.
The Souliotes originally spoke their own sub-branch of the Cham Albanian dialect and eventually became bilingual in Albanian and Greek. After their assimilation, a language shift to Greek occurred, while the Souliotic dialect became extinct.[1][2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Souliotes

Again the Greek editors of Wiki have manipulate the content of article because the Albanian language of Suliotes never became extinct.

Even a modern researcher with Greek sympathies like Katherine Elizabeth Fleming admits kindly that:

“The Soultioes, who are of Albanian origin but usually are grouped separately, also had ancestors who served as exemplars for the community of Souli” (The Muslim Bonaparte: diplomacy and orientalism in Ali Pasha's Greece: 62).

"A Turkish force of four thousand men was surprised one summer night in 1823 by Marco Botsaris, one of the ablest champions of Greek independence, and three hundred and fifty Suliots, a warrior tribe of Albanian descent" (The companion guide to mainland Greece, Brian De Jongh :1983).

In the prerevolution period, Ali Pasha of Joannina in northwest Greece attacked the villages of Souli (1792–1804). Its inhabitants, orthodox Albanians, strongly resisted, and women played an important role.

Women and war: a historical encyclopedia from antiquity to the present: Volume 1 - Page 255: Bernard A. Cook - 2006

[TrueMacedonian]

page 430

[George S.]

Voltron i know of heaps of greeks who were albanian background & spoke albanian.You can't hide it.You must be ashamed to admit it is true.

[TrueMacedonian]

The heavily underlined "A Greek cannot rule Greeks" made me laugh instantly. Why? I wonder if there ever was a "Greek" that ever ruled this land:

Just one example

page 262



Balkan Background by Bernard Newman

[SirGeorge8600]

Originally Posted by Risto the Great

The difference is that they are not Albanians any more .... they are "Arvanites". And the "so-called" Greek national dress .... is still a dress .... and is Albanian.

It's of Turkish influence just like most cultural dress in the Balkans.