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Old 12-26-2017, 01:36 AM   #11
Risto the Great
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I would assume most want to marry Macedonian women because they hope they can continue with much of their culture. If the younger wives can't contribute to the home in the way many of our mothers have, then they are on an equal playing field with all the other women. So, aside from genetics, I can't see the reason to marry one since they have already abandoned their culture.

I've told my sons I would rather they married someone that was deeply in love with them than a Macedonian girl who seems nice.

I was chatting to a guy from New York and he said he simply has no chance to meet women there. He isn't wealthy and he isn't Jewish. Basically no chance.
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Old 12-26-2017, 03:36 AM   #12
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I by 'contributing to the household' you mean keeping Macedonian culture alive, then being clearer about that will avoid confusion for expecting them to be a stereotypical housewife in a day and age where parents work and share parental responsibilities.

Awfully quick to just declare women the problem rather than it being a general issue within the Macedonian community itself, which from what I've seen seems to be the issue. Macedonian men are just as capable of neglecting their culture and I know for a fact that some do.

A relationship is a collaborative effort, so everyone involved needs to collaborate to make it work. You want to date/marry a woman who can help teach your children about their Macedonian heritage? Look for someone who can. You're not going to get a date while lamenting about how women are a lost cause at the same time. That kind of thing tends to be a bad sign that the person you're talking to is likely to lead to an unhealthy relationship so a lot of women who may have otherwise considered dating you would likely avoid you instead. Just give them the benefit of the doubt as you get to know them and judge all you want if you find that to be the case for that particular person. Find yourself a place where you can ask them about what they think about Macedonian culture early on and bond over that before you actually get serious.
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Old 12-26-2017, 03:53 AM   #13
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I think a modern stereotype of a woman/wife has absolutely nothing to do with the 1950's if that helps. My wife is Macedonian. Possibly the last of a dying breed. Keeps the house alive with a smile on her face and does the same with my office also. And has her tertiary qualification. And makes lovely p'lnati Piperki.

Just saying that if finding a Macedonian woman who is simply an American is the objective, it's probably not going to be worth it. If she has retained some good core Macedonian values, maybe she is worth it.

Either way, given the limited quantity, I'd prioritise true love.
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Old 12-26-2017, 11:40 PM   #14
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Macedonian women are part of the problem not so much because they don't want to be stereotypical housewives, but because they more readily do things like stop speaking Macedonian, stop socializing with other Macedonians, and shy away from their traditional customs and culture. I think a lot of it is due to a perception of Macedonianism as inferior and outdated. Macedonian men are much more likely at least in the USA, to use Macedonian as their primary language, and keep Macedonian friends. Just look at this forum from it's inception, how many female members, 5 ever? I've never met a Macedonian girl who cares about history, politics, or nationalism. That has to mean something, and it goes far beyond gender politics.

Just as our culture has raised a bunch of mama's boys, it had also raised a bunch of eniteled princesses.
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Old 12-27-2017, 12:48 AM   #15
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Well I was raised in a french community and was never told where I could find and socialize with Macedonians nor taught more than a few Macedonian words, my brother doesn't know shit or give a shit and that's pretty much my dad's fault for leaving us to manage on our own past "you have Macedonian heritage" and a few vague details on the basics. Kinda hard to keep the culture alive when you have to teach it to yourself. I didn't get the impression my uncles did much either but I haven't seen them in years. Basically I know from experience that there's some negligence going on with Macedonian men too. I have an aunt I hear is fairly active in the Macedonian community but family drama and lack of contact information's kept me from really knowing much of my dad's side of the family and it's not like I have a lot of direct relatives there to begin with.

Now, just because my personal experience is with my mostly male relatives not doing much doesn't mean I'd just declare it a problem with men and call it a day. A single person's experience is limited and not really a big enough sample pool to get reliable statistics out of. Even if we could chart out that women do have as high a rate of not caring about Macedonian culture as assumed we'd be better off treating it like a general community problem than a gender one as it's applicable to everyone and a problem that goes beyond gender even if the stats vary along them. So basically, how do we get more Macedonians to care about their culture and heritage than the ones who currently do? That seems to be the root problem here.
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Old 12-27-2017, 04:56 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gocka View Post
Macedonian women are part of the problem not so much because they don't want to be stereotypical housewives, but because they more readily do things like stop speaking Macedonian, stop socializing with other Macedonians, and shy away from their traditional customs and culture. I think a lot of it is due to a perception of Macedonianism as inferior and outdated. Macedonian men are much more likely at least in the USA, to use Macedonian as their primary language, and keep Macedonian friends. Just look at this forum from it's inception, how many female members, 5 ever? I've never met a Macedonian girl who cares about history, politics, or nationalism. That has to mean something, and it goes far beyond gender politics.

Just as our culture has raised a bunch of mama's boys, it had also raised a bunch of eniteled princesses.
Gocka I'm curious to know at what age you emigrated to the USA?
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Old 12-27-2017, 05:26 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Starling View Post
Well I was raised in a french community and was never told where I could find and socialize with Macedonians nor taught more than a few Macedonian words, my brother doesn't know shit or give a shit and that's pretty much my dad's fault for leaving us to manage on our own past "you have Macedonian heritage" and a few vague details on the basics. Kinda hard to keep the culture alive when you have to teach it to yourself. I didn't get the impression my uncles did much either but I haven't seen them in years. Basically I know from experience that there's some negligence going on with Macedonian men too. I have an aunt I hear is fairly active in the Macedonian community but family drama and lack of contact information's kept me from really knowing much of my dad's side of the family and it's not like I have a lot of direct relatives there to begin with.

Now, just because my personal experience is with my mostly male relatives not doing much doesn't mean I'd just declare it a problem with men and call it a day. A single person's experience is limited and not really a big enough sample pool to get reliable statistics out of. Even if we could chart out that women do have as high a rate of not caring about Macedonian culture as assumed we'd be better off treating it like a general community problem than a gender one as it's applicable to everyone and a problem that goes beyond gender even if the stats vary along them. So basically, how do we get more Macedonians to care about their culture and heritage than the ones who currently do? That seems to be the root problem here.
Reading your story full credit to you for the interest you have shown in your heritage
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Old 12-27-2017, 06:58 AM   #18
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You are right, it is a thing. Same thing in NJ, Macedonian women don't date Macedonian men. Here is why.

Macedonian men are mama's boys, they are childish and are used to their mom's cooking, cleaning, doing their laundry, picking up after them.

Macedonian men tend to be very rude, cocky and overly macho types. They don't have respect for women.

Macedonian women in the USA, tend to be well educated, more educated then the men actually. So how many well educated women are going to want to date, childish, rude uneducated men?

Then you have the gossip factor. If they date Macedonian men, everyone will know about it. If they date out of Macedonian circles they can keep relationships hidden.


So if you want to date a Macedonian woman, you have to overcome those predisposition they have about Macedonian men. If you are persistent and put your best foot forward, you should be able to overcome them. Just don't act like their fathers and you should be ok.
Geez Gocka loves to generalise.. mate if you weren't mummy's boy then why did you not marry a us macedonian or a super hot Latina with attitude rather than run off to mkd to marry a poor Village girl?

Mate reading your threads you have nothing but hatred and contempt for your fellow Macedonians and a strong tint of superiority. You are product of the system you despise, don't think somehow you miraculously came out superior and above all. I know many persons who considered themselves patriotic until they bagged the prize and got married overseas, once they got married all the sudden they lost interest in the motherland.. and become negative.. sounds familiar..?

Besides with divorce rates, Infidelity and lack of interest in the family life these days I would encourage people to find love regardless of ethnicity and pursue like minded partners.

Mate ultimately you have to let go.. you are just wasting your time on this forum.if looking for social media friends group start a Facebook page..

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Old 12-27-2017, 07:00 AM   #19
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I'm not going to lie, I am truly grateful you all gave me great advice about this. I have had to deal four Macedonian women at home in my community I tried dating. All of them date white Americans and/or Hispanics. It goes to show as some of you put it, they are entitled princess jackasses. I would love for you guys to keep giving me advice, but I will take some of your guys advice, especially the fact to find a women who would be interested in Macedonian culture. I will find love before heritage, I thank you all for that piece of advice. I will follow love within my heart. My biggest problem is I have to deal with feminist type of women, so finding a real Macedonian women or a women who wants to be like a Macedonian women is pretty hard in this society of America. Therefore, I will resort to finding a women who will and want to be a Macedonian women to the kids I want to have, mostly boys(so I can keep the Macedonian bloodline going). Again thank you all for helping me on this, I've been away from Chicago and any Macedonian community for almost 3 years now being in the Active US Army, and 9 months of that was being deployed overseas, so I could not find any time to date/nor have the energy to constantly look for a Macedonian wife in society. So when I thought about this forum, I decided to reactivate this account. It means alot that I can relate to people like myself who love being Macedonian, being prideful of being Macedonian, people who speak Macedonian, who know our culture, who know our traditions, and foremost, understand the struggles of being a Macedonian. I would to keep telling you all to keep giving me advice. I am so glad you guys give me a lot of information. I was just going to be stupid at some point and go to Macedonia to find a women like my dad suggested. I don't understand, I guess it's true about Macedonian women, they don't care about being Macedonian. They'd care less about their upbringing. It's pretty common I guess. Again, thank you all my friends I'll still keep reading this form. Also I'd like to say overall, I will keep continuing to find a women who respects our culture, tradition, and language. I really do appreciate all the advice from all of you, we are a strong group of people. Lets keep carrying ourselves like our previous generations have kept going.

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Old 12-27-2017, 03:59 PM   #20
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Can you clarify if they actually said or did anything beyond not want to date you to be called entitled princesses? Because that kind of rhetoric sounds a lot like the kind of rhetoric I've heard women complain about in men who feel entitled to their affections.

Like, sometimes you just find someone you like who isn't the same ethnicity as you. It happens. Patriarchal stuff like valuing men over women based on preconceptions like that is exactly the sort of thing that would drive women away. It could very well be that a number of them just don't like those notions and getting distant from the culture was just an unintended by-product of that due not being able to socialize with other Macedonians as much as a result.

If someone wanting to date me said stuff like this I wouldn't give a damn if they could help me preserve my heritage because such a person wouldn't really give the impression of caring about me as a person, which is the recipe for a bad relationship all around. I think you should all re-examine the way you're approaching the issue and consider your part in it.
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