Ventilator - Page 3

indigen · 04-25-2010, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank

I like to not accept what Denes said in 95 especially an Austrlian rag, the truth be told we don't know how the Macedonian State Flag came into been

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bozin_Pavlovski
The owner and the then publisher of TD was Bozin Pavlovski, who today is a member of MANU (not that I respect that institution much) and is a respected author and publisher.

We do know how it came about, it was designed by SDS party hacks with the clear aim that it have no cultural or historic meaning for Macedonians and that it symbolises CAPITULATION.

Quote:

Промената на изгледот на државното знаме и на химната беа едни од барањата кои при утврдувањето на охридскиот договор ги изнел Арбен Џафери, лидер на ДПА. Меѓутоа, од страна на СДСМ и на ВМРО-ДПМНЕ тоа било отфрлено. Странските "олеснувачи" го поддржале тој став со образложение дека "изгледот на знамето содржи неутрални симболи".
Dnevnik broj 1996 (approx 2002)

Quote:

But I would state this the 8 ray sun motif is seen in thousands of reliefs and archaeological digs through out Makedonia and rock art the most significant I prefer to believe that was the story not a Slavist Communist agenda.

Wishful thinking (pravenje bajram so umot) is a nice ESCAPISM! But the hard cold reality is that it has no connection to anything Macedonian (by design).

Quote:

Again it is high time some dam Macedonians better respect the current State Flag as it is ours we have 2 let us rest at that shall we.

Do we have a state to respect? I am for the destruction of Ramkovist State and all the institutions that uphold it!

Quote:

Oh interesting dig up of the archives good to remember that stuff.

Does that mean you were an adult in 1995 and remember what happened? I was an adult then and my community ABSOLUTELY CONDEMNED IT and I can not see how I can go against my political principles and ideology, now or ever, and those of my community (not forgetting all other patriotic Macedonians around the world who are similarly opposed).

Frank · 04-25-2010, 05:37 AM

Quote:

Wishful thinking (pravenje bajram so umot) is a nice ESCAPISM! But the hard cold reality is that it has no connection to anything Macedonian (by design).

Dude do I really have to prove this to you it is a fact not fanicable thinking

Google is your firend

And again I know who really dont like the Macedonian State Flag but really please dont dishonour the Stste Flag it is just not cool Okay.

Quote:

Do we have a state to respect? I am for the destruction of Ramkovist State and all the institutions that uphold it!

That is going to get us no were really quick.

Quote:

Does that mean you were an adult in 1995 and remember what happened? I was an adult then and my community ABSOLUTELY CONDEMNED IT and I can not see how I can go against my political principles and ideology, now or ever, and those of my community (not forgetting all other patriotic Macedonians around the world who are similarly opposed).

Buddy take a deep breath I found those archives really Interesting to read, and it is good they should be preserved.

Vangelovski · 04-25-2010, 05:44 AM

Frank,

Are you going to provide us with some evidence that the ventilator existed prior to 1995 or are you just going to repeat the same old SDSM rumour?

aleksandrov · 04-25-2010, 08:47 AM

Whether you want to call it a ventilator or an 8-ray sun, raising Gligorov's flag has essentially the same symbolism as raising a white flag or your oppressor's flag. Feel-good revisionism cannot change the fact that it was adopted by people who illegally usurped the Macedonian legislature in the service of foreign puppet-masters, in order to appease Greek chauvinists seeking to suppress the existence of an indigenous Macedonian identity and the free will of the Macedonian people.

Bill77 · 04-25-2010, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

Frank,

Are you going to provide us with some evidence that the ventilator existed prior to 1995 or are you just going to repeat the same old SDSM rumour?

I don't mind the new flag, as Daniel The Great said, Novo sonce na slobodata. Well it sounds good anyway.

The only issue is, that we had to change our original. So its the "inajet" that we were made to change, But i don't think its the actual flag that is the problem, Its still a Macedonian symbol. Here are some evidence of the 8 ray sun you ask for.

These above, seem to be a religious symbol as they are found on churches and a bridal accessories. But the next one is another varient of the sun symbol that is very comon and there are many examples.

As you can see, there are much more rays and they are also curved or on an angle.

indigen · 04-25-2010, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank

Dude do I really have to prove this to you it is a fact not fanicable thinking

Yes, YOU and others like you ARE DELUDING THEMSELVES and don't like facing reality, IME!!! It is no different to the ones that say changing the state name to "North Macedonia" is a positive thing "since it will indicate there is a "South Macedonia"! IT is all crap and denial of CAPITULATION and DEFEAT - PORAZ!

Quote:

Google is your firend

Yeah, one can go and try to find "facts and proofs" to fit the current reality of ABSOLUTE defeat and degradation and play make-believe children's games but I already posted relevant info in the first post and last reply to highlight the fact that it is officially ACKNOWLEDGED by ALL "Macedonian" state and political representatives and VERIFIED by their INTERNATIONAL overlords that it has only "NEUTRAL" (i.e. NON-MACEDONIAN) representation.

The old state flag was given up together with our rights to indigenous Macedonian (i.e. as Gligorov stated: "we are Slavs who arrived in the 6th century and have no connection with the ancient Macedonians") heritage and places us in a very precarious position vis-a-vis ALL our negators, especially the Ghegs, Bulgars and Grks!

Quote:

And again I know who really dont like the Macedonian State Flag but really please dont dishonour the Stste Flag it is just not cool Okay.

I wipe my arse with symbols of treason and as Ramkovist Macedonia is NOT a Macedonian state, the props and institutions that keep it in place need to be terminated and replaced by Macedonian ones ASAP!

ВЛАДО ПОПОВСКИ, професор на правниот факултет
http://star.dnevnik.com.mk/?pBroj=2252&stID=22720

"....Тие дури сметаат дека албанското знаме е постаро и од албанската држава. Затоа Албанците каде и да живеат, преку знамето на Албанија го манифестираат сопствениот идентитет.

l Како тоа да го сфатат Македонците?

- Друго е прашањето што Македонците немаат етничко знаме. Кај Македонците е создадена свест дека преку државното знаме се манифестира и етничката припадност. Тоа, пак, кај албанското население создава претстава дека македонскиот народ го монополизира државното знаме во насока дека државата е само на Македонците, а не на сите граѓани.

l Зарем државно знаме содржи нешто тенденциозно спрема етничките чувства на Албанците?

- Симболот на официјалното знаме е универзален, а не етнички, и се однесува на сите граѓани. Друга ситуација ќе имавме со првото знаме што беше со ѕвездата од Кутлеш, која е од времето на Античка Македонија. Тогаш со тоа знаме би се идентификувале оние што се сметаат за потомци на Филип и на Александар Македонски.

Vangelovski · 04-25-2010, 07:43 PM

Bill77,

What similarity do those samples you gave us have to the ventilator??? The first two are examples of the sonce, the others look more like ninja stars than the ventilator.

Regardless, the point is the treason and capitulation behind the ventilator, which is part and parcel of the Interim Accord and FYROM.

BigMak · 04-25-2010, 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vangelovski

Bill77,

What similarity do those samples you gave us have to the ventilator??? The first two are examples of the sonce, the others look more like ninja stars than the ventilator.

Regardless, the point is the treason and capitulation behind the ventilator, which is part and parcel of the Interim Accord and FYROM.

Vangelovski, No one agrees with the Interim Accord and the fact Macedonian has changed its flag via political force, but its undeniable the variation of the 8rayed sun has always been in Macedonian culture. Mainly in field of arts and crafts, I have plenty of photos with a 8 rayed variation, next time your in the Republic do your own research its not that hard if you can get yourself away from the local Cafana.

Risto the Great · 04-25-2010, 08:34 PM

If Greeks tell us we Macedonians MUST use the swirly symbol for our flag, should we feel better about it?

BigMak · 04-25-2010, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Risto the Great

If Greeks tell us we Macedonians MUST use the swirly symbol for our flag, should we feel better about it?

If greeks told us we can revert to our old macedonian surnames would we?

04-25-2010, 05:44 AM	#23
Vangelovski Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 8,519	Frank, Are you going to provide us with some evidence that the ventilator existed prior to 1995 or are you just going to repeat the same old SDSM rumour? __________________ If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

04-25-2010, 08:47 AM	#24
aleksandrov Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 558	Whether you want to call it a ventilator or an 8-ray sun, raising Gligorov's flag has essentially the same symbolism as raising a white flag or your oppressor's flag. Feel-good revisionism cannot change the fact that it was adopted by people who illegally usurped the Macedonian legislature in the service of foreign puppet-masters, in order to appease Greek chauvinists seeking to suppress the existence of an indigenous Macedonian identity and the free will of the Macedonian people. __________________ All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. Arthur Schopenhauer https://www.facebook.com/igor.a.aleksandrov?ref=tn_tnmn

04-25-2010, 07:43 PM	#27
Vangelovski Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 8,519	Bill77, What similarity do those samples you gave us have to the ventilator??? The first two are examples of the sonce, the others look more like ninja stars than the ventilator. Regardless, the point is the treason and capitulation behind the ventilator, which is part and parcel of the Interim Accord and FYROM. __________________ If my people who are called by my name will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and restore their land. 2 Chronicles 7:14 The Revolution was in the minds and hearts of the people; a change in their religious sentiments, of their duties and obligations...This radical change in the principles, opinions, sentiments, and affections of the people was the real American Revolution. John Adams

04-25-2010, 08:34 PM	#29
Risto the Great Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Macedonian Colony of Australia Posts: 15,639	If Greeks tell us we Macedonians MUST use the swirly symbol for our flag, should we feel better about it? __________________ Risto the Great MACEDONIA:ANHEDONIA "Holding my breath for the revolution." Hey, I wrote a bestseller. Check it out: www.ren-shen.com

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