Greece and Turkey Exchange Two Million of their People!

[Sarafot]

9.9% to be more accurate.

Do you mean that 1.000.000 peoples speaks Macedonian language?

[TerraNova]

Do you mean that 1.000.000 peoples speaks Macedonian language?

Not of the 2009 population of Greece but of the population of Greek Macedonia ,in 1926.


Since the vast majority of the ex Exarchists left to Bulgaria,Yugoslavia(SROM) and Australia/USA/Canada in the '30s and after the civil war ('49) ...and the rest of the ex slavic speaking population mixed and assimilated...it's reasonable that really few Macedonian speakers exist today,and even fewer people with distinct Macedonian consiousness.

[Sarafot]

Not of the 2009 population of Greece but of the population of Greek Macedonia ,in 1926.


Since the vast majority of the ex Exarchists left to Bulgaria,Yugoslavia(SROM) and Australia/USA/Canada in the '30s and after the civil war ('49) ...and the rest of the ex slavic speaking population mixed and assimilated...it's reasonable that really few Macedonian speakers exist today,and even fewer people with distinct Macedonian consiousness.

100.000 went in Volgaria,and another 100.000 were ''Begalci'',what was the entire population in that year 29?

Hard to assimilate thouse who left,what do you think, that number was aprox?

[TerraNova]

100.000 went in Volgaria,and another 100.000 were ''Begalci'',what was the entire population in that year 29?

Hard to assimilate thouse who left,what do you think, that number was aprox?

Those who migrated to Bulgaria after Neiully treaty were about 77-92.000 ,while those who left during and after the civil war,about 50.000.

I told you those who remained in Greece were -almost all- ex Patriarchists (or "Grkmani") ,so it wasn't hard to assimilate them at all-they wanted to be assimilated.

According to the League of the Nations the total population in 1926 was 1.341.000.

[Sarafot]

Those who migrated to Bulgaria after Neiully treaty were about 77-92.000 ,while those who left during and after the civil war,about 50.000.

I told you those who remained in Greece were -almost all- ex Patriarchists (or "Grkmani") ,so it wasn't hard to assimilate them at all-they wanted to be assimilated.

The number Terra? Number of whole population in that year?

[makedonin]

Do you mean that 1.000.000 peoples speaks Macedonian language?

Minority Languages in Greek Occupied Macedonia

[Bratot]

Its hillarious, we all have the numbers of the population which has been settled down 1923 in Macedonia( aegean) , reaching a number of a one million 1 000.000 Orthodox Turks, thus the Greeks are trying to convince us in... what?

That is very plastical example of how "Greek Macedonia" has been created.
With non-greek speaking Christians of Turkish origin, who are now claiming an ANCIENT MACEDONIAN descent !!!!!!
Simply INSANE!


According to a Greek historian, very respectable, admitting the Macedonians as non-Greek native inhabitants, but some forum chauvinistic arrogant Greek is gonna claim differently, because in the other Census which took place after the population exchange and taking the repression on Macedonians , there were 0% of those native Macedonians.

You have Hitler in a lil finger pal.



Anyway, in the Greek language census 1928, the number of the MACEDONOSLAVE is 81.984 !












1.La langue Macedonoslave
2.La langue Armenienne
3.La langue Valaque
4.La langue Albanaise
5.La langue BULGARE
6.La langue Tzigane
7.La langue Russe
8.La langue Italienne
9.La langue Anglaise

The same part on Greek, click me.


and the whole page, click me.



So, not only confrotated with the repression and assimilation, plus the newcomers from Minor Asia, still in 1928 Macedonian language has been evidented by number 90.000 Macedonians.

[TerraNova]

Its hillarious, we all have the numbers of the population which has been settled down 1923 in Macedonia( aegean) , reaching a number of a one million 1 000.000 Orthodox Turks, thus the Greeks are trying to convince us in... what?

Who is trying to convince you for the opposite?
Some 630.000 Greeks from Thrace and Asia Minor settled in Macedonia.
Together with the native Macedonian Greeks they consisted 88.8% of the population -(league of the Nations)

So, not only confrotated with the repression and assimilation, plus the newcomers from Minor Asia, still in 1928 Macedonian language has been evidented by number 90.000 Macedonians.

Yes that's in 1928.
After the exodus and migration in Metaxas period and the civil war this number shrunk dramatically to few thousands.
And most of them had Greek consiousness -as the sources you presented clearly write.

Sowhat's the point...to prove that before 80 years there were 81.000 Macedonian speaking people in Greek Macedonia.
(80.000 / 1.340.000) Percentage?
So what?
It's over my friend.
I m sorry but you had your chance and you lost several times.

[Bratot]

Ohh my, please don't be so harsh with me... pleeaase

The percentage my pal, from your sources is variable every census, not mentioning that since Metaxas regime Greece recognizes only religious and nonethnic minorities.


Recently your media came out first with a number of 50.000 than 100.000 etc. Macedonians.



How ever you put it, the point is clear:

"Greek-Macedonia" is a madeup, artificially created claim for land and descent by your side.


Those invented "greek-macedonians" are nothing more than imposers on Macedonian land, have nothing in common with native Macedonians and thus, they have no right on what so ever history related to Macedonia.


The true and only Macedonians are being oppressively denied in order to maintain the fake Greek claim for history and land.

Even if their number is 100 today, only they can be successors on the Macedonian history and name IN CONTINUATION.

Even if they disapear tomorrow, no one else can fabricate a history and steal their identity!

[TerraNova]

How ever you put it, the point is clear:

"Greek-Macedonia" is a madeup, artificially created claim for land and descent by your side.


Those invented "greek-macedonians" are nothing more than imposers on Macedonian land, have nothing in common with native Macedonians and thus, they have no right on what so ever history related to Macedonia.

TRAGEDIES IN MACEDONIA

"A Record of Greek Victims of Bulgarian Outrages in Macedonia between 1897 and February 1903"

printed by Ede & Townsend,London ,1903.

...
inside we can read-in 1903-
Outrages committed by Bulgarian bands against Macedonian Greeks from 1897 till February 1903.

So...sure "Macedonian Greeks" is created yesterday...

Even if their number is 100 today, only they can be successors on the Macedonian history and name IN CONTINUATION.

Even if they disapear tomorrow, no one else can fabricate a history and steal their identity![/B]

Speaking a Slavic language does NOT in any case indicate any kind of continuation with ancient Macedonians.

It's not accidental that all the forts of your compatriots aim to prove that ancient Macedonians were not Greeks by blood,in the 4th cent Before Christ.
Nobody would take you seriously if you presented the theories of direct connection of modern Macedonians with the ancients.

[Bratot]

Macedonian Greeks is same as Macedonian Albanians That doesnt give you Macedonian identity nor it makes Macedonian identity equivalent to Greek.


Greek newspapers differentiate ethnic Macedonians from Greeks :

1. Δευτέρα 31 Οκτωβρίου 1905 (είδηση) • Στο χωριό Λεμπετίνα: Λιουμπέτινο / Ljubetino (Πεδινόν) του καζά Φλώρινας • Εισβολή της ομάδας του καπετάν Οδυσσέα. Σύλληψη πέντε προκρίτων Μακεδόνων. Μεταφορά τους στο βουνό και εκτέλεση αυτών [ΕΜΠΡΟΣ, 31/10/1905, σ. 3].

Monday, 31 October 1905 (news) • In the village Lempetina: Lioumpetino / Ljubetino (Pedinon) kaza Florina • Invasion of the group of Captain Ulysses. Conception five prokriton Macedonians. Transfer of the mountain and run these [FRONT, 31/10/1905, p. 3].



2. Τετάρτη 19 Οκτωβρίου 1905 (είδηση) • Κοντά στο χωριό Λόσνιτσα / Lošnica (Γέρμας) του καζά Καστοριάς • Πέντε νεκροί και πέντε τραυματίες Μακεδόνες σε επίθεση ελληνικής ομάδας [ΣΚΡΙΠ, 19/10/1905, σ. 3].

Wednesday October 19, 1905 (news) • Near the village Losnitsa / Lošnica (Germany) kaza Kastoria • Five people are killed and five injured in an attack Macedonians from Greek group [SKRIP, 19/10/1905, p. 3].



3. Σάββατο 15 Οκτωβρίου 1905 (είδηση) • Στο χωριό Μπίτουσα / Bituša (Παρόρειον) του καζά Μοναστηρίου • Δεκατρείς νεκροί και πέντε «αιχμάλωτοι» Μακεδόνες, μετά από επίθεση της ομάδας Τσολάκη [ΕΜΠΡΟΣ, 15/10/1905, σ. 3].

Saturday 15 October 1905 (news) • In the village Bitousa / Bituša (Paroreion) of the monastery's kaza • Thirteen people died and five prisoners «» Macedonians, after attack by the group Tsolaki [FRONT, 15/10/1905, p. 3].



4. Πέμπτη 6 Οκτωβρίου 1905 (είδηση) • «Είναι βέβαιον ότι κατά τας τελευταίας εβδομάδας πολλοί Μακεδόνες από Σχισματικών επανήλθον εις την Ορθοδοξίαν. Επί του όρους Περιστέρι (: Πέλιστερ / Pelister) εν διαστήματι δύο εβδομάδων πλέον των δέκα χωρίων εγένοντο πάλιν ελληνικά» [ΕΜΠΡΟΣ, 6/10/1905, σ. 1].

Thursday, 6 October 1905 (news) • «It is certain that during the last few weeks many Macedonians from Schismatikon epanilthon in the Orthodoxian. The conditions Peristeri (: Pelister / Pelister) in diastimati two weeks more than ten villages egenonto Again Greek »[FRONT, 6/10/1905, p. 1].



5. Τετάρτη 5 Οκτωβρίου 1905 (είδηση) • Στο δρόμο Βοδενών – Θεσσαλονίκης • Είκοσι τέσσερις νεκροί Μακεδόνες συνολικά, σε τρεις ενέδρες που έστησαν τα ελληνικά σώματα [ΣΚΡΙΠ, 5/10/1905, σ. 2].

Wednesday, 5 October 1905 (news) • On the road Vodenon - Thessaloniki • Twenty-four dead Macedonians total, in three ambushes that had set up the Greek bands [SKRIP, 5/10/1905, p. 2].


6. Τα κακουργηματα ομως των δολοφονων τουτων εν μερει εκδικουν ομαδες ενοπλων Μακεδονων γενναιος αμυνομενων κατα των κακουργων. Σημερον εγνωμη ασφαλως ενταυθα προχθες Μακεδονων ενοπλων, ανωθεν του χωριου Τσεγκου της περιφεριας Βοδενων κατεδιωξε Βουλγαρικη συμμοριαν

The crimes of the killers, however, result in part armed groups Macedonians gallant defence against criminals. Now of course Inter before yesterday armed Macedonians, above the village of Tsegkou region Vodenon pursued Bulgarian criminal group.
(1904, p.3, News paper "Ebroz")



7. Κυριακή 8 Μαΐου 1905 (είδηση) • Στο χωριό Στρέμπενο: Σρέμπρενο / Srebreno (Ασπρόγεια) του καζά Φλώρινας • Την 3η Μαΐου ελληνικό σώμα επιτέθηκε σε αυτονομιστές. Η συμπλοκή κράτησε ώρες. Οι Έλληνες έφυγαν λίγο πριν φτάσει ο στρατός. Σκοτώθηκαν τρεις Μακεδόνες και τραυματίστηκε ένας [ΕΜΠΡΟΣ 8/5/1905, σ. 4 � ΣΚΡΙΠ, 14/5/1905, σ. 1 και 23/5/1905, σ. 3].

Sunday, May 8, 1905 (news) • In the village Strempeno: Srempreno / Srebreno (Asprogeia) kaza Florina • On 3 May Greek body attacked separatists. The scuffle lasted for hours. He fled shortly before the army arrived. Three Macedonians were killed and one was injured [FRONT 8/5/1905, p. 4 SKRIP, 14/5/1905, p. 1 and 23/5/1905, p. 3].





8. Σάββατο 3 Σεπτεμβρίου 1905 (είδηση) • Κοντά στην Καστοριά • Οκτώ νεκροί και δεκαεπτά τραυματίες Μακεδόνες, μετά από επίθεση ελληνικής ομάδας [ΣΚΡΙΠ, 3/9/1905, σ. 3].

Saturday, September 3, 1905 (news) • Close Kastoria • Eight people died and seventeen wounded Macedonians, after attack of greek grups [SKRIP, 3/9/1905, p. 3].





9. Πέμπτη 30 Σεπτεμβρίου 1904 (είδηση) · Έξω από το χωριό Όστιμα: Όστσιμα / Osčima, (Τρίγωνον) του καζά Καστοριάς · Σύγκρουση της αποτελούμενης εκ δεκατριών μελών ομάδας του Θύμιου Καούδη με την τσέτα του Μήτρου Βλάχου · Εννέα νεκροί και είκοσι τραυματίες Μακεδόνες. Από τους Έλληνες πληγώθηκαν οι Μανόλης Σκουντρής και Γιάννης Σεϊμένης [εμπρος, 30/9/1904, σ. 4 και 1/10/1904, σ. 1].

Thursday, September 30, 1904 (news) Outside the village Ostima: Ostsima / Osčima, (Triangulum) kaza Kastoria Conflict, consisting of thirteen members of the team sports Kaoudis with tseta Mitrou Vlachou Nine of the dead and injured twenty Macedonians. Of those pligothikan the Manolis Skountris and John Seimenis [Front, 30/9/1904, p. 4 and 1/10/1904, p. 1].




10. Σάββατο 18 Σεπτεμβρίου 1904 (είδηση) · Σύγκρουση ελληνικού σώματος και τσέτας, κοντά στη Νιζόπολι: Νιζέπολε / Nižepole του καζά Μοναστηρίου. Σκοτώθηκαν δέκα επτά Μακεδόνες και τέσσερις Έλληνες [σκριπ, 18/9/1904, σ. 3].

Saturday, September 18, 1904 (news) Conflict Greek body and tsetas, near Nizopoli: Nizepole / Nižepole the monastery's kaza. Seventeen were killed 7 Macedonians and 4 Greeks [Skrip, 18/9/1904, p. 3].





11. Δευτέρα 30 Αυγούστου 1904 (είδηση) · Στο χωριό Ντέμπενη: Ντέμπενι / D’mbeni (Δενδροχώριον) του καζά Καστοριάς · Από επίθεση ελληνικής ομάδας, πέντε νεκροί Μακεδόνες, μεταξύ των οποίων και ο εξαρχικός δάσκαλος · «Το χωρίον Ντέμπενη είναι ολόκληρον σχισματικόν, τούτο δε αναδεικνύει έτι μάλλον το θάρρος του ελληνικού σώματος, του οποίου το κατόρθωμα επτόησε τον σχισματικόν πληθυσμόν και ενεθάρρυνε τον ορθόδοξον» [σκριπ, 30/8/1904, σ. 3].

Monday, August 30, 1904 (news) In the village Ntempeni: Ntempeni / D'mbeni (Dendrochorion) kaza Kastoria From Greek team attack, five dead Macedonians, including the teacher exarchikos «The chorion is Ntempeni overtake schismatikon, this it illustrates once more the courage of the Greek corps, which deserves credit for the eptoise schismatikon plithysmon and encouraged the Orthodox »[skrip, 30/8/1904, p. 3].

[TerraNova]

If i post 20 times the number of passages you posted,speaking about Bulgarians and not Macedonians..will i get banned or not ?

[Bratot]

I believe so, even if we say you do that, what will you prove?

Does that will deny your own Greek newspapers?

I don't think so, I proved my point here.

Now stay sober and don't try to take the discussion in other purpose. Read the title of the topic and the first post of mine.
If you can't prove its wrong, dont waste our time.

[TerraNova]

I believe so, even if we say you do that, what will you prove?

Does that will deny your own Greek newspapers?

I don't think so, I proved my point here.

Now stay sober and don't try to take the discussion in other purpose. Read the title of the topic and the first post of mine.
If you can't prove its wrong, dont waste our time.

Really Bratot...what do you believe?
That by Macedonian ,the Greek newspapers meant a distinct nation,or ppl living in the Geographical region of Macedonia, long lost misguided,slavic speaking Greeks ?

[Bratot]

LOL

And I guess the language was the reason why the Greek bands killed the Macedonians ( slavophone Greeks ).

Than by all meanings, if we keep our name Macedonia and Macedonians, why you are upset?

We might be just slavophone Greeks dude, give us the chanse.


aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhaaaaaahhaaaaaaaaaa