The Rosetta Stone

[Soldier of Macedon]

Thanks Julie.

Lavce, Macedonian is a Slavic language, and Slovak has never said we are ethnically Slavic. Try and inform yourself better.

Indigen, your interpretation is wrong, both of Slovak and his intent. Stop trying to create smoke where there is no fire and making false allegations because you lack the same knowledge as he does on linguistics.

[Delodephius]

And no one invited me to this gossip party?

Slovak, are you pretending to be someone your not for a reason?

I changed my username because Delodephius is the name I go by on almost every other forum, on FB, and on a hell of a lot of websites, and I have for years. I just forgot to change it here. So I'm not hiding. Why does there ALWAYS have to be an ulterior motive with you guys?

It is very simple he has stated many times that Macedonians are slavs ethnic and linguistic. I am not going to suggest to ban him he still hasnt shown hi rogoj.

I thought my horns were showing quite well. Shame on you, you should know more about your "enemies".
No, I'm not anti-Macedonian, I'm indifferent towards Macedonia and its future, as I am indifferent towards the future of every other country... well maybe except China. Anyway, I do consider Macedonians to be Slavs linguistically, but not ethnically. Actually, there are no Slavs in Europe that are ethnically Slavs since Common Slavic was a language not an ethnicity, and due to politics and trade it was spread into other Palaeo-Balkan-Balto-Slavic areas where it was adopted as a prestige dialect, due to high similarity. Much like Latin was adopted in Gaul because Gauls spoke an Italo-Celtic language that was mutually intelligible with Latin.

I'm confused - I always assumed Slovak wasn't Macedonian and that's why I disregarded most of his commentry on political matters...

Wow, now that's a good reason to disagree with someone.

He isnt he is a Slovenian living in Serbia but considers himself Serbian as he doesnt feel the contact with other Slovenians.

First of all I'm Slovak, not a Slovenian, you Bulgarian. (see how you like it), and second of all I don't consider myself a Serb, I just get the Serbs more than Slovaks from Slovakia. But, I'm moving to Slovakia in a few weeks and I won't be coming home for a few years, so all that might change.

true ancestors were and what languages we should prioritise to study.

Your ancestors are the people that lived and fought on the side of Alexander the Great. Your ancestors are the people that settled in Macedonia, whether they were Greeks, Romans, Slavs, Avars, Bulgars, Turks, etc. they all contributed to the formation of the modern Macedonian ethnicity, even though the majority of your genepool is of Ancient Macedonian descent. The same way I'm a Slovak, but my ancestors were also, Avars, Hungarians, Celts, Sarmatians, Germans, Dacians, Pannonians, besides Slovaks. Unless you live in some remote part of the world that hasn't seen any action since the stone age I'm sure you would be genetically pure.

The language you should learn in school as your classical language (instead of Latin or Classical Greek) is Old Church Slavonic. Isn't that the language of your medieval ancestors?

[indigen]

Lavce, Macedonian is a Slavic language, and Slovak has never said we are ethnically Slavic. Try and inform yourself better.

Why can't Macedonian be a Macedonic language and why should (or would) Macedonian patriots not call it that?

Indigen, your interpretation is wrong, both of Slovak and his intent.

Unless you are him, I don't know how you can speak about what his intentions may or may not be. As we have different views and perspectives on various issues, I don't see why your take on what "Slovak" has posted is to be accepted as the gospel truth. Fine with me if you think that the sun shines out Slovak's you know what but don't expect that others will all see it the same way.

Stop trying to create smoke where there is no fire and making false allegations because you lack the same knowledge as he does on linguistics.

Back in 1992 I witnessed an inspirational (and, for me, an ideological turning-point) event where (like myself, according to you) other "unenlightened" Macedonians (e.g. as Alex S, Blaze KB and Angele V.) blasted a public presentation by international "Slavists", which was organised by the Macedonian Studies Foundation in the Rockdale Illinden Centre, for designating the Macedonian language (and thereby Macedonians as well) as being "Slavic" until it ended before it really got started. A great day for the Macedonian cause, IMHO! As the visibly shaken and upset Slav Professors were departing, the key Russian Slavist made the following (or something very close to it) departing and disparaging comment: "Ako ne sakate da bidite "Slavjani", bidete Grci".

Well, the arrogance of the "Slavist" Russian professor was not only racist but it was contemptible and is something that is thrown at Macedonians on a daily basis by all our so called international "friends" (Friedman, Borza, amongst others) and almost ALL academics in the western world, ones that some here on MTO would deem as "esteemed" and praiseworthy but never really criticised for being completely unscientific and baseless. The criticism aimed at Macedonians such as Tentov, IMO, is much more venomous than is warranted and appears to be of a self-hating Macedonian type when none of it is ranged in similar passion against those that insist we are "Slavs" and can't be connected to the ancient Macedonians.

[Delodephius]

Slavists are dickheads. I know, I worked with them. That's why I quit college and started studying Chinese.

[indigen]

And no one invited me to this gossip party?

You are not that important to most of us (except maybe SOM) but some people thought there was a new guy in town and I simply set them straight.

Your ancestors are

What makes you so qualified as to tell me and Macedonians who our ancestors were/are? Shouldn't you at least qualify it with something like "in my view" or "according to so and so"? Rude Sloavk - BARBARIAN!

even though the majority of your genepool is of Ancient Macedonian descent.

I like this part!

Unless you live in some remote part of the world that hasn't seen any action since the stone age I'm sure you would be genetically pure.

True! Who said anything different?

The language you should learn in school as your classical language (instead of Latin or Classical Greek) is Old Church Slavonic.

It is rude to tell people (another nationality) what they should learn at school, IMO! You might have had a better reception if you designated a different (and more appropriate) label for the Macedonian language in question!

Isn't that the language of your medieval ancestors?

Here is where the critical thinker will see an issue with your line of thought (whether intentional or subconscious), IMO! But maybe this is not the right thread to debate it in.

[indigen]

Slavists are dickheads. I know, I worked with them. That's why I quit college and started studying Chinese.

Well, that is (good) news! I climbed the Great Wall once, before it became fashionable to do it!

[Delodephius]

Your language is a Slavic language. That is how your ancestors called it in 862 AD. Today we call it OLD Slavonic to distinguish it from modern Slavonic/Slavic languages. When this language was brought to Macedonia it was accepted by the Macedonians because there was little difference between Macedonian and Slavic. The language family cannot be called Macedonic because it wasn't Macedonian that spread throughout Europe, it was Slavic. In the Middle Ages they didn't speak of a Macedonian language in Germany, they spoke of Slavic (Wendish). They didn't speak of Macedonian in Russia, they spoke of Slavic. They didn't speak of a Macedonian language in the Balkans, they spoke of Slavic. Who were the Slavs then?

[Vangelovski]

Wow, now that's a good reason to disagree with someone.

I didn't disagree with you because you are not Macedonian, I disregard you because you are not Macedonian. If you follow my posts, you may notice that I'm interested in freeing Macedonians from their slave mentality rather than convincing non-Macedonians of something they have no interest in.

Btw, do you have any professional qualifications? I'm asking a genuine question because you seem to be knowledgeable in the field (not that I can make that assessment as I know nothing about linguistics).

[Delodephius]

I don't have any qualifications nor am I interested in attaining any. Basically what I'm talking about you can find in any comparative grammar book of Slavic languages or even in any grammar of Old Church Slavonic. I studies Slavic linguistics in college for one semester. It's really not that advanced science, all you need is to read this stuff, and most people don't even open the damn books. I should know, I own a bookstore.

[Delodephius]

What makes you so qualified as to tell me and Macedonians who our ancestors were/are?

It is rude to tell people (another nationality) what they should learn at school, IMO!

Egh... that's how I talk.

[Vangelovski]

I don't have any qualifications nor am I interested in attaining any. Basically what I'm talking about you can find in any comparative grammar book of Slavic languages or even in any grammar of Old Church Slavonic. I studies Slavic linguistics in college for one semester. It's really not that advanced science, all you need is to read this stuff, and most people don't even open the damn books. I should know, I own a bookstore.

Fair enough.

[lavce pelagonski]

Relax Tom I forgot to put a smiley face I know who you are and I know what you mean.

The word Slav/Slavic has become a disease for the Macedonians as it portrays us in a negative light by the Greeks.

[Vangelovski]

Relax Tom I forgot to put a smiley face I know who you are and I know what you mean.

The word Slav/Slavic has become a disease for the Macedonians as it portrays us in a negative light by the Greeks.

Do you mean Indigen?

[indigen]

Do you mean Indigen?

It says Tom, so I think it means you!

[Vangelovski]

It says Tom, so I think it means you!

I know, but I didn't post anything to him...?