Vissinea, Visheni

[Risto the Great]

Svol, opinions are like arseholes ... everyone has one.
The Adelaidechanets author clearly has expressed one. Many would disagree in that instance and unless we can see what the Ancient Athenians danced like ... we might just as easily source the original dances from Macedonia. I am far from convinced about the Poushcheno being an Albanian dance.

I am also from selo Adelaide but my people are from Kotori and Vrbeni.

[Svoliani]

And aside form the original post ... What were you hoping to say about Visheni?

Sorry , the paragraph about the dances of Visheni and how they have Greek influence (kalamatiano) and Albanian (pushteno, berat) were taken from the book about Visheni, they are the opinions of the author who lives in Adelaide. But yes i do agree with alot of what he says!

Are we ever going to find out what selo you are from?
If i were to guess, you seem like a Neretchanets!! Am i close?

[Risto the Great]

And aside form the original post ... What were you hoping to say about Visheni?

[Risto the Great]

Oh the Pushcheno is Albanian now.
Thanks.
So is Athens.
Perhaps we are all Albanians ... which in turn makes us all Greek.
In Donkeyland this might make sense.

[Svoliani]

"Most of the dances in our village, as in the rest of Macedonia, show a strong Greek influence, especially the 7/8 rhythm (called the "KALAMATIANO" in Greek) is widespread. Another popular dance is the one we call "PUSHENOTO" or "BAYRACHETO" which is of Albanian origin and is written in 12/18 time. It is only known in the western fringe of Macedonia and should be called "BERAT."

OPA!!!
YouTube - Berache

[Pelister]

pelister as late as the first decade of the 20thc some people living in epiros and albania who spoke po nasha . our house in dragosh was biult by nashi maestori od yanina .

That's interesting.

One guy I was reading about lived in a village outside Debar. The local Pasha wanted to marry his daughter - and he would not give her away, so he fled - he went to the summit of Pirin, walked a few miles down and founded his own village in the early 18th century.

[makedonin]

Psofisano

Putrefaction, rotting

[osiris]

pelister as late as the first decade of the 20thc some people living in epiros and albania who spoke po nasha . our house in dragosh was biult by nashi maestori od yanina .

[Pelister]

Kranya, a village near KOZANI? A Greek speaking region of Macedonia??
This author really knows his stuff.
So the kids learned the dialect in no time!! I wonder if they grew up thinking they are Ethnic Macedonians. Looks like we just met our first Slavophone Greeks!!!

I found this part interesting.

The observant reader will have noticed that our village, and the other villages around Kastoria and Florina, cannot be more than 400-500 years old. The date given (1660) for the village of Babchor is when three settlements came together and formed it, according to GEORGE STOICHEV'S pamphlet. According to B. SHLKLIFOV, the villages of CHERESNITSA and BLATSA were near FOTINISHTA 200-300 years ago. They moved from the plain to the mountains to be far from the Turkish authorities. He also claims that the whole population in the Kastoria district could have
come from the South. This is consistent with the historical events of the past, as there was a revolt in Thessaly in the twelfth century by Slavs and V1achs against Byzantine rule, after which they moved up closer to their kin. However, I have heard DEDO FILETO KIOSEV on several occasions say that we came from EPIROS. This is also consistent with historical events of the past because there were Slav tribes settled in Albania also and could have been pushed eastwards by the Albanians later.


What do you make of the authors claims of only 400 years in Macedonia? And does anyone agree with this South to North migration?

Its possible.

[osiris]

just give it up smoliani and join the world.

[Svoliani]

Kranya, a village near KOZANI? A Greek speaking region of Macedonia??
This author really knows his stuff.
So the kids learned the dialect in no time!! I wonder if they grew up thinking they are Ethnic Macedonians. Looks like we just met our first Slavophone Greeks!!!

I found this part interesting.

The observant reader will have noticed that our village, and the other villages around Kastoria and Florina, cannot be more than 400-500 years old. The date given (1660) for the village of Babchor is when three settlements came together and formed it, according to GEORGE STOICHEV'S pamphlet. According to B. SHLKLIFOV, the villages of CHERESNITSA and BLATSA were near FOTINISHTA 200-300 years ago. They moved from the plain to the mountains to be far from the Turkish authorities. He also claims that the whole population in the Kastoria district could have
come from the South. This is consistent with the historical events of the past, as there was a revolt in Thessaly in the twelfth century by Slavs and V1achs against Byzantine rule, after which they moved up closer to their kin. However, I have heard DEDO FILETO KIOSEV on several occasions say that we came from EPIROS. This is also consistent with historical events of the past because there were Slav tribes settled in Albania also and could have been pushed eastwards by the Albanians later.

What do you make of the authors claims of only 400 years in Macedonia? And does anyone agree with this South to North migration?

[osiris]

check thi out from the book in question.

Incidentally, another despicable act that the Greek authorities did after "liberation" was to remove all the headstones from the graves of the fallen during the Ilinden uprising, which were buried at a special locality near the village of APOSKEP. Afterwards, they ploughed up the place and turned it into fields so that no trace remains of the "BULGAR K0MITAJIS." However, unwittingly, they reminded us of what our people were fighting for: Near the lake shore of Kastoria, there is a statue of the bishop GERMANOS KARAVANGELIS with the inscription that he "fought against Bulgarism" (KATA TOU VOULGARISMOU).
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The two Greek teachers, PERICLIS ILIADIS and IRINI ILIADIS, husband and wife, who came to our village in 1928 or thereabouts, had three children, HARALAMBOS, YANNIS, AND ANDROMAHI. The children could not speak a single word of our dialect when they arrived from KRANYA, a village in the district of KOZANI, a Greek-speaking region of Macedonia. Soon, however, they learned to speak our dialect quite fluently; and when they played with us late after school, their mother would come out and call them home with the remarks: "EMATHATE APTIN TIN VROMOGLOSSA." (You have learned this dirty language!)

Although she was born In Varna, Bulgaria, she would not utter a single word in our dialect, even with the women who tried to communicate with her while washing at the church well (TSURKUNATA CHEZHMA). She always would answer in Greek. I learned my first Greek letters from her. She also told us not to speak Bulgarian at home and that the Bulgarians have "one eye like the Cyclops" and sometimes "eat people!" Later on, around 1933, she devised a diabolical plan, probably to harm our village. She told the police sergeant in our village that she was often terrorized by "KOMITAJIS" at night. The sergeant contacted our priest POP KUZO MARKOV and asked him to tell the truth whether any rebels were still operating in our district. Pop Kuzo assured him that these things were of the past, and he believed that no COMITAJIS existed anywhere anymore. The sergeant was wary; whom should he believe? But, apparently, being a smart person, the sergeant devised a plan to learn the truth.

One evening he went to tell Mrs. Iliadis that something had happened in the neighbouring village of Oxia (BLATSA) and all the police personnel would be absent that night, so she should take extra care. The following morning, around 10 o'clock, the sergeant arrived at the school building where Mrs. Iliadis lived and asked her how she had gotten on the previous night. "Terrible, KYR ASTINOME, Just terrible! This was the worst night I have ever experienced! You should have seen those beards; they resembled beasts, not humans! Luckily the windows are protected by iron bars; otherwise, they would have broken in!" Policeman: "Hmmm. . . So these are the comitajis that threaten you, KYRA IRINI. . . KRIMA (pity)! You should be ashamed of yourself; you have been eating bread in this village for so many years, and now you are scheming to destroy it! I have been keeping watch outside the school with another policeman all night, and nothing of the sort you described happened!" She did not know what to say and disappeared into the other room. Afterwards, he went to see the priest and patted him on the back for his honesty. About 15 years later, she and her daughter, together with another woman, were slain by the partizans as described earlier in this discourse. Her husband had left her earlier and had gone to live in Kastoria, where he became editor of a newspaper called Kastoria. The villagers claimed that he was responsible at one time for ringing the bell at Easter one hour earlier as a hoax, and the
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people arrived at the church for the midnight mass before the priest arrived!

[MapleLeaf1]

Why would he copy and paste them here
Drvo, what exactly are you trying to prove

[El Bre]

If anyone wants to read the source of the above quotes posted by the distinguished linguist and scholar Svolianis, you can find it here;

http://mak-truth.com/vish/index.html

[Daskalot]

Thats interesting, only 3 were familliar to you.
Just so you think i wasnt making things up

I PETELO YAYTSA MU NESI. (Even his rooster lays eggs.) He is lucky.)
(We call the rooster Petno or Petino)

NE KUTSA MAGARETO OT USHITE. (The donkey does not limp because of his ears.) When you fail to see the real cause.
(We say Kutseno for limping, i believe from Kots = heel)

EM FTESEN EM BESEN. (He is guilty but goes berserk.) When you don't admit your quilt.
(Ftes means more like 'fault')

TIA GO KURSTAT TOY PURDI. (He farts while being baptized.) When you reject the advice of elders.
(Where im from we call farts ' poordes ')

OT TIA SHO BIE NA KAMBANATA. (From those who hit the church bell.) When someone is arrogant and stubborn.
(Kambana is bell in Greek)

PSOVISANO MAGARE OT VULK NE SE PLASHI. (A dead donkey is not afraid of the wolf.) When you are experienced and can handle any situation.
(Psofises means to die in Greek)

NI LUK YAL NI LUK MIRISA. (He neither has eaten garlic nor smells of it.) When you try to hide your quilt.
( Mirisa = smell , Mirizo = i smell)

I found all this interesting because the author claims that an elder told him that the roots of the village come from Epirus.

I see that you answered your own question before I managed to give you my answers.

I understood all of them, you just have to read them out loud so to say.