Ventilator

[julie]

Seeing cultea aka thessa aka10 other alias banned each time and each time for countless times one of which he called me a downright liar for what my family suffered at the hands of the Greeks under which name can't remember , I shall leave the forum in the capable hands of the admin and the Greek who liberated the Macedonians in the Aegean

[Risto the Great]

Seeing cultea aka thessa aka10 other alias banned each time and each time for countless times one of which he called me a downright liar for what my family suffered at the hands of the Greeks under which name can't remember , I shall leave the forum in the capable hands of the admin and the Greek who liberated the Macedonians in the Aegean

Julie, Macedonia is suffering right now at the hands of its own Macedonian leadership.

I genuinely believe that Macedonia's sovereignty is the key to all of Macedonia's woes.

[Vangelovski]

Seeing cultea aka thessa aka10 other alias banned each time and each time for countless times one of which he called me a downright liar for what my family suffered at the hands of the Greeks under which name can't remember , I shall leave the forum in the capable hands of the admin and the Greek who liberated the Macedonians in the Aegean

Julie, you've been critical of the MTO approach many times in the past. Perhaps we can use your posts as a guide?

[EgejskaMakedonia]

That's up to you EM. However, I disagree. I think you will find that the anti-Macedonians among us will be just as (if not more) poisonous towards our cause than a Greek will ever be. Further, I think you will find that their views can be set in concrete just as much as any Greek.

Maybe so, but even anti-Macedonians among the Macedonian people may have a glimmer of hope or values that resemble ours. Most Greeks on the other hand will have absolutely nothing in common or show no signs of sympathy for our past and current hardships. Your also forgetting that a lot of Macedonians need a timely 'reminder' of the threat to their sovereignty. I'd say these people far outnumber Macedonians who may be labelled as 'anti-Macedonian.'

I don't label you as an anti-Macedonian EM. Far from it in fact. I am amusing myself with the consultative approach though. I genuinely can't see why we need to be nice to anti-Macedonians.

I can listen as good as any other bloke.

This approach would be predominantly used for those who lack knowledge or need to be reminded of the current circumstances. They are by no means 'anti-Macedonian.' Your forceful approach may be effective against these so called 'anti-Macedonians,' but as for the masses, I believe my approach is more appropriate.

If not, I'm prepared to accept a 'Plan B,' something you lot don't seem to have. What makes you so confident that your approach is the only one that will succeed and the ultimate key to Macedonia's sovereignty. What if it fails? Do you have a Plan B? No.

[Vangelovski]

EM, what makes you think we haven't already gone from plan A-Z and back?

[Risto the Great]

What if it fails? Do you have a Plan B? No.

Looks like Todor Petrov is on his plan B at the moment.

[EgejskaMakedonia]

EM, what makes you think we haven't already gone from plan A-Z and back?

Time to start the alphabet again then.

Looks like Todor Petrov is on his plan B at the moment.

So he must be 'anti-Macedonian' then?

[Risto the Great]

So he must be 'anti-Macedonian' then?

We can't be sure about people with inconsistent ideology. They certainly shouldn't be leaders.

[blackcactus]

You divide and insult Macedonians with your games, you both (Vangelovski & RtG) are acting poorly, showing a lack of respect for people who should be your friends

Your ridicule is an apt example of how it alienates people, you are not openly aggressive, but your aggression is there to see in your sarcasm, and it doesn't work, this post is an example of that

Thanks for lowering my view of you both

You pick on EM like school yard bullies, trying to push him into loosing his temper, maybe you both where bullies as kids, but grow up for the sake of us all

The Greeks must be loving this BS

I am not going to comment further

[EgejskaMakedonia]

We can't be sure about people with inconsistent ideology. They certainly shouldn't be leaders.

They are only leaders if we make them leaders.

[Vangelovski]

Time to start the alphabet again then.

EM, I would suggest you actually start the alphabet for the first time, rather than preaching to those who have already gone through it. Only then will you be in a position to advise on successful "approaches".

[Vangelovski]

You divide and insult Macedonians with your games, you both (Vangelovski & RtG) are acting poorly, showing a lack of respect for people who should be your friends

Your ridicule is an apt example of how it alienates people, you are not openly aggressive, but your aggression is there to see in your sarcasm, and it doesn't work, this post is an example of that

Thanks for lowering my view of you both

You pick on EM like school yard bullies, trying to push him into loosing his temper, maybe you both where bullies as kids, but grow up for the sake of us all

The Greeks must be loving this BS

I am not going to comment further

BC, thanks for offering not to comment any further. I really appreacitate it.

We actually see a lot of potential in EM and hope that we can guide him into being a much more active and effective activist for the Macedonian cause. He's a young guy and full of youthful enthusiasm, espousing wonderful sounding theories of communication, activism and group mobilisation. We have carefully explained to him our views and he has respectfully declined to accept them. We are now genuinely offering him the chance to test his ideas out.

[Sputnik]

You divide and insult Macedonians with your games, you both (Vangelovski & RtG) are acting poorly, showing a lack of respect for people who should be your friends

Your ridicule is an apt example of how it alienates people, you are not openly aggressive, but your aggression is there to see in your sarcasm, and it doesn't work, this post is an example of that

Thanks for lowering my view of you both

You pick on EM like school yard bullies, trying to push him into loosing his temper, maybe you both where bullies as kids, but grow up for the sake of us all

The Greeks must be loving this BS

I am not going to comment further

Well said. I find some attitude in here disgusting. Very sad.

[EgejskaMakedonia]

You divide and insult Macedonians with your games, you both (Vangelovski & RtG) are acting poorly, showing a lack of respect for people who should be your friends

Your ridicule is an apt example of how it alienates people, you are not openly aggressive, but your aggression is there to see in your sarcasm, and it doesn't work, this post is an example of that

Thanks for lowering my view of you both

You pick on EM like school yard bullies, trying to push him into loosing his temper, maybe you both where bullies as kids, but grow up for the sake of us all

The Greeks must be loving this BS

I am not going to comment further

Don't worry blackcactus, I am more resilient than that. I agree with your general point and it's proof that this 'argument' has become almost ridiculous. I'm not prepared to 'compromise' my views because a few 'big boys' tell (or in their terms, 'force') me to.

[Vangelovski]

Well said. I find some attitude in here disgusting. Very sad.

Sputnik, you said you were going to comment on this thread. I assume it was in relation to the ventilator?