Macedonia and Greece will meet in EuroBasket 2011

[Risto the Great]

Getting the world talking about Macedonia is, getting the world reading about Macedonia is again, getting the world interested in our little country is- which part do you not understand? It's better they did this than walked off from the game.

And as people like Vangelovski, Phoenix and myself amongst others have indicated, it would have been a great opportunity to present Macedonia's unique problem to the world. But instead we are the little country with the funnily coloured Japanese flag.

I'm still all for the black gaffer tape. I know it is confronting for many Macedonians to think like this. But I swear, if everyone did, Macedonia would not be having these problems right now. PLain and simple. That would be the revolution of the mind cicko Goce was talking about.

[Phoenix]

Wow...I can't believe the depths of insanity that this thread has fallen to...I can't believe the short sightedness of many sucked in by nothing more than some fools gold...talk about failing to see the forest for the trees.

Look at it in any measure of 'success' that you like but that 'success' is fleeting, a tiny snapshot of time that will be forgotten in even less time.

The harsh reality was that the European media were all over this story and we did fuck all about it...we didnt add any 'value' to the story...we just gazed into that shallow pond admiring our stupid reflection.

There were a myriad of 'protests' available to be exploited and to highlight the discrimination Macedonia faces in Fascist Europe...we chose to do fuck all.

[George S.]

good point phoenix ,you could almost say the world to fight is out of macedonia.Other countries would be up in arms protesting etc that would put them on the map at least.You'r right no one gives a fuck about names or flags anynore.I'm sounding like a defeatist but tha'ts the way it is.

[Makedonska_Kafana]

V.Ilievski: gyvenimas duoda, gyvenimas atima - YouTube

[Vangelovski]

Wow...I can't believe the depths of insanity that this thread has fallen to...I can't believe the short sightedness of many sucked in by nothing more than some fools gold...talk about failing to see the forest for the trees.

Look at it in any measure of 'success' that you like but that 'success' is fleeting, a tiny snapshot of time that will be forgotten in even less time.

The harsh reality was that the European media were all over this story and we did fuck all about it...we didnt add any 'value' to the story...we just gazed into that shallow pond admiring our stupid reflection.

There were a myriad of 'protests' available to be exploited and to highlight the discrimination Macedonia faces in Fascist Europe...we chose to do fuck all.

Unfortunately, many Macedonians chose to defend and legitimise the loss of Macedonian freedom and celebrate Greek oppression by condoning the very tools they use to oppress us with.

I just cannot fathom how some people think that wining a basketball game legitimises the use of the ventilator. I also cannot fathom how using the ventilator is somehow a show of protest or dissent!? How about NOT using the ventilator as a show of protest? If my neighbour were to tell me what clothes I should wear, why on earth would I consider actually wearing them as a act of protest? What on earth has happened to logic and reason!?

I would have liked the Macedonian players to have stood on that court and refused to play. Just stand there the entire time. How much of a statement would that have been. That would have generated much more press and for the RIGHT reasons.

[Big Bad Sven]

I think it has been a great effort by the macedonian players to get this far and do well in basketball. It will do a lot of good for macedonian basket ball and its also great to see it stimulate a bit of pride and patriotism amongst the macedonians in rep of macedonia.

But i think it is bit of a over exaggeration that finishing fourth in this competition has put macedonia on the map, or that it has got many people researching about our history and our struggles with grease etc, as phoenix mentioned our efforts in basketball will be forgotten in a years time by a non-macedonians, and to tell you the truth i doubt any one would take any notice or care enough to research about us just because we finished fourth. Maybe if we won the competition then yeah.

If anything, this "publicity" has done us worse, it has shown to everyone watching that we are not macedonia, but instead "FYR Macedonia" and that our "real flag" is the ventilator....

In australia in the last week there has been some articles about the racism that aboriginals faced while playing in the afl in the past and the aboriginal players that stood up for themselves and managed to help their people out because of this. I wish the macedonian basketball team had a player like a Nicky Winmar or Michael Long and stood up for the injustice and racism that has people were facing. All it had to take was one person...

[Pelister]

Unfortunately, many Macedonians chose to defend and legitimise the loss of Macedonian freedom and celebrate Greek oppression by condoning the very tools they use to oppress us with.

I just cannot fathom how some people think that wining a basketball game legitimises the use of the ventilator. I also cannot fathom how using the ventilator is somehow a show of protest or dissent!? How about NOT using the ventilator as a show of protest? If my neighbour were to tell me what clothes I should wear, why on earth would I consider actually wearing them as a act of protest? What on earth has happened to logic and reason!?

I would have liked the Macedonian players to have stood on that court and refused to play. Just stand there the entire time. How much of a statement would that have been. That would have generated much more press and for the RIGHT reasons.

Tom, it is a mistake to assume that all Macedonians think like you do and to expect them to. Phoenix makes a valid point about a missed opportunity.

[Vangelovski]

If anything, this "publicity" has done us worse, it has shown to everyone watching that we are not macedonia, but instead "FYR Macedonia" and that our "real flag" is the ventilator....

In australia in the last week there has been some articles about the racism that aboriginals faced while playing in the afl in the past and the aboriginal players that stood up for themselves and managed to help their people out because of this. I wish the macedonian basketball team had a player like a Nicky Winmar or Michael Long and stood up for the injustice and racism that has people were facing. All it had to take was one person...

Couldn't agree more!

[Bij]

That is the "I know what I am" line. Which means you accept another name for Macedonia because deep down you know what you are in your heart and mind.


I would take the flag, name and constitution of Macedonia over the feelings I get when Macedonia smash Greece in an international tournament like Euro Basketball. Perhaps I am in the minority though. I can see how winning the basketball match has more of an enduring effect than the flag, name and constitution of Macedonia.

Maybe it is late but is everything alright Bij? I mean, you live closer to Vangelovski than others do .... maybe we can organise a jelly wrestling competition for the 2 of you. If you win, you get a basketball jersey. If Vangelovski wins, Macedonia gets to keep its name, restore its flag and have a real constitution. Wow, I'm not even sure who I want to win .... it must be late.

The constitution, flag, national anthem and name can be changed, but this cant.

I don't know what tomorrow holds for Macedonia, and I hope to God we do return to our original flag and can proudly scream we're MACEDONIANS without any prefixes or conditions attached, but I will not waste today in sorrow in hope of what may be tomorrow.

Today, we're the fourth best basketball team in Europe, and the best in the Balkans, in spite of our oppression, in spite of the ventilator, in spite of the constitution. We've had everything taken away from us but our pride - and today I am a proud Macedonian.

Spit on me if you will, insult me, tell me that I don't live in reality, but I don't care.

[Jankovska]

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogspot.com/2007/03/australia-human-rights-party-and-rights_1084.html

Vangelovski the patriot- God help us all.
PS check out the flag on the site but than I will not ask questions, he never replies with an answer but a questions.
You should all know you arer dealing with a twisted manipulative person and refuse to get in conversations with him

[Vangelovski]

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogs...ghts_1084.html

Vangelovski the patriot- God help us all.
PS check out the flag on the site but than I will not ask questions, he never replies with an answer but a questions.
You should all know you arer dealing with a twisted manipulative person and refuse to get in conversations with him

You really are pathetic Jankovska. That article was written for the Human Rights Party. David Edenden had nothing to do with that now deregistered party. Anyone can see that David Edenden has reposted it from Maknews (who also posted it) by clicking on the title. I have no control over his PRIVATE Blogspot or what he has posted up.

Perhaps if one day the Greeks over at AMAC post some of your rubbish (we know that they repost some of the posts from here), we can all claim that you write for them? That's how stupid of a claim you have just made.

[Vangelovski]

Look Jankovska,

Makfax Vesnik also writes for Edenden's private Blogspot:

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogspot.com/2007/03/european-commission-takes-greece-to_7926.html

And Interfax:

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogspot.com/2007/03/jaap-de-hoop-scheffe-is-loopy-on-kosovo_6065.html

And SETimes:

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogspot.com/2007/03/jaap-de-hoop-scheffe-is-loopy-on-kosovo_6065.html

And ABC news:

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogspot.com/2007/03/abc-news-misses-point_6691.html

Or maybe David Edenden just copies and pasts articles from all over the net!?!?!?!?

What a genius you are!!!! You really got me this time!!!

[Vangelovski]

Hey Jankovska,

Look, the New York Times also writes for David Edenden's Blogspot:

http://the-macedonian-tendency.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2011-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-05%3A00&updated-max=2012-01-01T00%3A00%3A00-05%3A00&max-results=48

This is a massive conspiracy you've uncovered!!!! You're really onto us now!

[Jankovska]

You really are pathetic Jankovska. That article was written for the Human Rights Party. David Edenden had nothing to do with that now deregistered party. Anyone can see that David Edenden has reposted it from Maknews (who also posted it) by clicking on the title. I have no control over his PRIVATE Blogspot or what he has posted up.

Perhaps if one day the Greeks over at AMAC post some of your rubbish (we know that they repost some of the posts from here), we can all claim that you write for them? That's how stupid of a claim you have just made.

Why not boycott it you patriot? Have you done anything about it or just accepted it? Or do you just take the easy approach and critisize everyone else for not doing so.
Man up or shut up. Pathetic, ha ha wonder who is pathetic and become the laughing stock of the forum. Mr double standards

[Volk]

The new flag is being more widely adopted and as the new generation grows up the old one will be forgotten except by those who have a brain and know what has happened.

I can never accept the new flag, I've tried to come to terms with it, but even though it was chosen by the country independently, the way in which the first flag of our independence the 16 ray sun was torn from us can never be accepted by any self loving honest person, only by the ignorant.

Macedonia needs an organisation which soley seeks to maintain our real national flag and pushes for its adoption, even if its by the general population and not immediately the state. By its mutilations its obvious the state has washed its hands of it and handed it over to greece as some kind of 'mutual celebrated history'.

A statement should have been made by the basketball team, it could have been as simple as the captain dedicating the wins to our rightful name which we have been forced to cover up

Nevertheless there are big positives that came with Macedonia's performance, perhaps the inferiority complex that so many suffer from in MKD has taken a small battering.

For the first time since Independence there has been pride felt by the people, which is very needed in defending our nation and her interests.
Hopefully this pride and love of country will help the process of people waking up to themselves and realising we are under attack all around the world and only we have the cure for it.