Greek citizens are Moving into Macedonia

[Voltron]

They were weak. Most Native Americans here in the USA are in reservations drunk and are lost, It is truly a pity. I dont think the same applies to us.

On a side note, there are plenty of Natives in South America that still retain their identity, language and culture. They however are the poor class of society.

[Daskalot]

Greek terror tactics ? Its like a Jew raising his kids into the Nazi ideology. Cmon man. If someone terrorised me you can bet your life I would never allow my kids to become like them. Never.

It is more along the lines of what has happened to most native north and south Americans, how many of them stick to thier language and their native cultures and religions? Not appropriating the invaders language, culture and religion. English, Spanish and Portugese where it applies.

[Voltron]

And there’s the point Voltron if you want a society to cease to exist you can just wipe them out and such opportunities present themselves in times of war but even then it is difficult to do a complete job of it with out the world noticing and at least putting you in a bad light if not more severe action. With what’s left of the population you need to assimilate them with a carrot or a stick or both and even then it is difficult…are there not still people in Greece who think of themselves as Macedonians even with the Greek terror tactics of the past to assimilate them.

Greek terror tactics ? Its like a Jew raising his kids into the Nazi ideology. Cmon man. If someone terrorised me you can bet your life I would never allow my kids to become like them. Never.

Yeah right. I’m plenty Australianised and even I know it simply is impossible to be exactly like Anglo Australians…not that I am saying I want to be that. The only real way to completely become assimilated is to completely stop doing the things of your culture which very few people would do willingly so No I don’t believe you that your brothers are completely Americanised…its simply an illogical statement. Most people would think complete assimilation is a bad thing because All the bits of your background form your sense of identity and to entirely annihilate your identity and to replace it with anouther is a hard call. Some people do it to escape persecution and hide out but this is a rare thing so Yes overwhelmingly people would say it’s a bad thing…probably including those who have done it to escape persecution because even though it may have been an act of necessity for them they would internally resent the fact that it was.

No its not impossible. I had many Greek relatives coming here to Greece and they didnt even know how to blend in. They were sticking out like a sore thumb. Trust me when I say it is possible. Many Greek American actors out there that dont have a clue of their background. I could give you many examples. And the kicker is when you call them on it, they get offended and even alienates them more. The example you used with the "X" American is true but only to a degree. Some just omit the prefix and say American plain and simple.

There are always bloodlines in the Balkans and everywhere else for that matter…maybe not always on a DNA level but these distinctions are usually the product of centuries and many generations and not my great grandfather was Albanian and did everything Albanian and over the next 2 generations our family became progressively assimilated to by the time it got to me I call myself a fully fledged Greek who feels kinship with all the generations of Greeks for 4000 years and beyond.

No there isnt any bloodlines. You must be a romantic. Everybody was sharing each other's sisters back in the day. We are talking a span over a millenia. At the end of the day it all comes down to consciousness and what you feel you are. Look up the word Ethnos.

Its easy to feel being something perceived better than yourself or forcibly made to forget you past. Today’s Greeks are largely a bastardised mob told by the west…primarily Germany…that they are direct decedents of the famous ancient Greeks and should claim their heritage even though during ottoman days waves of Albanian migrants were brought in who didn’t have a clue about the ancient geeks let alone to be a descendent of them for 4000 years. Normally there are rare cases of people not knowing there past because it was for one reason or other hidden from them like an article I read of a Polish man who grew up not knowing he was Jewish and even got into skinhead gangs and beat up Jews and others only later to discover his roots. So in a sense your reality is based on your beliefs…in actuality you may be different…and if a suitable favourable world is created around you it is not that difficult to allow yourself to believe your new reality but it does not make it right to persecute those who have not made the same decision as you…there persecution or forced assimilation was and is real and it happens for one very good reason…they are an ever present reminder of your illusion and your active choice. It was always hoped that by assimilation people would forget the past of their predecessors and accept their new reality and become one homogenous society. In short the blender is still working but not all the ingredients have been mashed into one soup and it threatens the integrity of the soup.

I stopped reading as soon as I saw the " Made in Germany " slogan. Christ is that old. Anyway mate, have a nice day.

[fyrOM]

Guys has anybody ever heard of assimilation ? My brothers have married American women and are completely americanised. Is this a bad thing ? I dont get what some are trying to say here. There is no bloodline in the balkans, dont fool yourselves. Trying to splinter someones heritage and telling them they are a byproduct of forced assimilation is misguided. You are what you feel, simple.

Guys has anybody ever heard of assimilation ?

And there’s the point Voltron if you want a society to cease to exist you can just wipe them out and such opportunities present themselves in times of war but even then it is difficult to do a complete job of it with out the world noticing and at least putting you in a bad light if not more severe action. With what’s left of the population you need to assimilate them with a carrot or a stick or both and even then it is difficult…are there not still people in Greece who think of themselves as Macedonians even with the Greek terror tactics of the past to assimilate them.

My brothers have married American women and are completely americanised. Is this a bad thing ?

Yeah right. I’m plenty Australianised and even I know it simply is impossible to be exactly like Anglo Australians…not that I am saying I want to be that. The only real way to completely become assimilated is to completely stop doing the things of your culture which very few people would do willingly so No I don’t believe you that your brothers are completely Americanised…its simply an illogical statement. Most people would think complete assimilation is a bad thing because All the bits of your background form your sense of identity and to entirely annihilate your identity and to replace it with anouther is a hard call. Some people do it to escape persecution and hide out but this is a rare thing so Yes overwhelmingly people would say it’s a bad thing…probably including those who have done it to escape persecution because even though it may have been an act of necessity for them they would internally resent the fact that it was.

I dont get what some are trying to say here.

You are what you are and it might suit someone else’s agenda to make you think you are something else but it doesn’t make it right.

There is no bloodline in the balkans, dont fool yourselves. Trying to splinter someones heritage and telling them they are a byproduct of forced assimilation is misguided.

Rubbish.

Are there not Italian Americans and Greek Americans ect who have been in the usa for generations. Why the X in front of the word American when describing themselves.

There are always bloodlines in the Balkans and everywhere else for that matter…maybe not always on a DNA level but these distinctions are usually the product of centuries and many generations and not my great grandfather was Albanian and did everything Albanian and over the next 2 generations our family became progressively assimilated to by the time it got to me I call myself a fully fledged Greek who feels kinship with all the generations of Greeks for 4000 years and beyond.

You are what you feel, simple.

Its easy to feel being something perceived better than yourself or forcibly made to forget you past. Today’s Greeks are largely a bastardised mob told by the west…primarily Germany…that they are direct decedents of the famous ancient Greeks and should claim their heritage even though during ottoman days waves of Albanian migrants were brought in who didn’t have a clue about the ancient geeks let alone to be a descendent of them for 4000 years. Normally there are rare cases of people not knowing there past because it was for one reason or other hidden from them like an article I read of a Polish man who grew up not knowing he was Jewish and even got into skinhead gangs and beat up Jews and others only later to discover his roots. So in a sense your reality is based on your beliefs…in actuality you may be different…and if a suitable favourable world is created around you it is not that difficult to allow yourself to believe your new reality but it does not make it right to persecute those who have not made the same decision as you…there persecution or forced assimilation was and is real and it happens for one very good reason…they are an ever present reminder of your illusion and your active choice. It was always hoped that by assimilation people would forget the past of their predecessors and accept their new reality and become one homogenous society. In short the blender is still working but not all the ingredients have been mashed into one soup and it threatens the integrity of the soup.

[George S.]

Vicki do you talk in macedonian at home or have you learn't a few words??

[Vicki]

Vicki doesn't seem to know anything about anything, or she's just having fun at you. At least... she's single.

Your cute and funny. Yes, I am single and beautiful.

[Vicki]

It's not 'just' a right-wing group, it is the biggest one in Greece and connected to several neo-Nazis across Europe. Is that supposed to be ok, because other countries have them? How about the fact that the government and police often turn a blind eye to their racist activities?

Vicki, how is this group going to destabilise Macedonia? I can't see it happening.

As far as destabilising Macedonia. I can't see it happening either but the Greek government uses these organizations to their benefit. PASOK was linked to November 17th in the 80ties.

[julie]

Thank you, Mikail

Vicki, don't mind the haters out there.

Go Steelers!

You are an extremely judgemental and rude person, unless you are referring to yourself, in which case, go for it

[julie]

Hello Julie,

My parents sent us to Greek Sunday school and told us we were Greek. We learned Greek from our grandparents and parents. My sister has little connection to being Greek or wanting to be learn about her possible Macedonian background. She has married an American. I'm still trying to figure things out. Growing up in North Hills Pittsburgh we had a Greek community but there was no Macedonian connection for us.

Cheers Vicki

There is a lot of information on this forum, which will assist in "figuring things out"
My maternal bloodline is from Aegean Macedonia, Dolno Kotori, Lerin (Florina) The Greeks renamed the village to Kato Idrussa .
I also have relatives from Kostur. Which village/town are your grandparents from?
Incidentally, I am not judging you, and applaud anyone that searches for their own answers and seeks the truth, and you have come to the right place.

[Akzion]

I knew you were Greek with your first post.

The culture of the Greek 'government' is Bavarian by origin. You do know that, don't you?

Vicki doesn't seem to know anything about anything, or she's just having fun at you. At least... she's single.
Yet, I didn't know that either. What is our Bavarian culture? In economics maybe? What is the Greek "Government"? Isn't it the real Government? Do YOU really know much about our present-day politicians and their mentality?
Also, have you heard of that prospect?

Opposition Popular Orthodox Rally (Laos) President Yiorgos Karatzaferis on Tuesday expressed certainty that the country will be led to early elections probably in early April, while forecasting that the prime minister will then name his successor.

Speaking to private television, he also claimed that PM George Papandreou will be a candidate for the post of UN secretary-general.

In an unrelated development, Karatzaferis backed the extension of the repayment period for the country's entire debt and stressed that the prospect of a Greece-Israel-Cyprus exclusive economic zone (EEZ) is of major strategic importance.

Finally, referring to the spectre of illegal migration, he said everyone has now the gravity of the problem, when he was already calling for measures as early as 2000.

Karatzaferis stressed that the Dublin II Regulation should be revised, terming it "catastrophic" for Greece

[Voltron]

Guys has anybody ever heard of assimilation ? My brothers have married American women and are completely americanised. Is this a bad thing ? I dont get what some are trying to say here. There is no bloodline in the balkans, dont fool yourselves. Trying to splinter someones heritage and telling them they are a byproduct of forced assimilation is misguided. You are what you feel, simple.

[fyrOM]

Hello Julie,

My parents sent us to Greek Sunday school and told us we were Greek. We learned Greek from our grandparents and parents. My sister has little connection to being Greek or wanting to be learn about her possible Macedonian background. She has married an American. I'm still trying to figure things out. Growing up in North Hills Pittsburgh we had a Greek community but there was no Macedonian connection for us.

The all too common story of the infernal grkoman...

Do I recall a thread where Vodenka was saying her organisation produced a monthly magazine with both Greek and Macedonian script because many of the younger Macedonians in Greece were wanting to reconnect with their Macedonian roots but many didn’t know the Macedonian script adequately.

I can imaging the dissatisfaction some may have with people who are of Macedonian decent growing up thinking and expressing they are Greek…I’ve seen the type first hand…especially with those who as close as their grandparents generation spoke Macedonian. Should such people wanting to discover their Macedonian heritage be encouraged or pushed aside as someone somehow unworthy for what looks like shunning their Macedonia roots and thinking they are Greek even if it is because maybe their parents for whatever reason raised them in a Greek thinking household.

It is not the first time we at the MTO have encountered wolves in sheep’s clothing claiming to wanting to learn about their Macedonian roots or just about Macedonians in general only to spout their propaganda. From what I have seen thus far this site is good at picking the genuine ones and those who are not out quickly and dealing with them appropriately.

Its kind of fitting to end this post on Australia Day with the very Australian attitude of giving people a fair go.

[Voltron]

What does Greece do to marginalize a radical right wing group as the golden dawn?

What does the USA do to marginilize the KKK ?
And the thing is that Xrisi Avgi isnt even comparable to Skinheads or Klan members. Many of you may believe they are the holy grail to use as a reference to "racism" in Greece. In Turkey they have the Grey Wolves. In Russia, immigrants get beat downs like no tommorrow. In Germany there have been a number of recorded attacks as well. Let me ask you this, when was the last time someone was attacked and I mean serioiusly attacked by Xrisi Avgi ? Dont give them too much publicity, your doing them a favor. Nobody really takes them seriously here.

[Daskalot]

My grandparents are from northern Greece. They spoke a different language which I found out later was Macedonian.

To answer your second question: Greece's government is corrupt and from what I have been told from a source recently , Greece's government has created an organization to destabilize Macedonia.

This org. was created by the Andreas Papandreaou government.

Welcome to our forum Vicki and thank you for sharing this.

When in life did you come to understand that they spoke Macedonian?

[Daskalot]

Oh Xrisi Avgi again, I dont think thats the case Vicki. Its just a right wing group, many countries even the USA has them. BTW good luck with the Steelers this year

What does Greece do to marginalize a radical right wing group as the golden dawn?