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  • Bratot
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2008
    • 2855

    #16
    Ima be, Esma se rasfrla
    The purpose of the media is not to make you to think that the name must be changed, but to get you into debate - what name would suit us! - Bratot

    Comment

    • Mikail
      Senior Member
      • Sep 2008
      • 1338

      #17
      GRIGORIS VALIANATOS-Makedonija i EUROVISION 2010

      GRIGORIS VALIANATOS-Makedonija i EUROVISION 2010
      YouTube - GRIGORIS VALIANATOS-Makedonija i EUROVISION 2010
      From the village of Pípezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

      Comment

      • julie
        Senior Member
        • May 2009
        • 3869

        #18
        What I would like to know what the hell does the f#$@$#$#$ en European Union recognition of the name Macedonia got to do with Eurovision song entrant choices and what is with Hell Ass permission to do so!
        "The moral revolution - the revolution of the mind, heart and soul of an enslaved people, is our greatest task."__________________Gotse Delchev

        Comment

        • Rogi
          Senior Member
          • Sep 2008
          • 2343

          #19
          Hmm, that's quite a different reaction from the Greeks to what we would have seen not too long ago.

          They are now acknowledging and somewhat agreeing that theirs is a losing battle and a lost cause, where not too long ago they would vehemently oppose the mere suggestion of this.

          I find it interesting, almost as if there is a very slow but nonetheless gradual weakening of the Greek media position on Macedonia's name.

          Truth be told, what I've just written sounds almost impossible, but it is the immediate impression I had after seeing this. From positive racists (positive in the sense that they believed they will destroy us) to negative racists (negative in that they don't believe in their ability to destroy us), nonetheless racists, but it's always important to pay attention to the changing landscape.

          Comment

          • fyrOM
            Banned
            • Feb 2010
            • 2180

            #20
            They are being consistent in their efforts to prevent Macedonia using the name Macedonia as they have in sporting events. There is nothing different.

            The individual claiming this resistance is a lost cause is the only one saying it. No one supported him but as Rogi pointed out no one opposed his statement strongly as one would have expected. A telling point - maybe.

            As a pessimist in this question I too had the impression it was a surprising they did not jump at him but drew a different conclusion to why. The recent racist rants by their military definitely put a kink in the way Greece is perceived and hence the need to rebalance perception they will try to put a positive spin on any near future confrontation to try and regain, at least in their opinion, the moral high ground. One thing I have encountered on a different site was one person putting to another could Greece voluntarily leave the EU or be made to leave and how this would effect their veto power and hence could Macedonia get in the EU under her own name. The response was Greece wouldnít leave and nor are they likely to be made to leave but for argument sake if this were to occur there is always Cyprus who would oppose Macedoniaís entrance let alone Frances position is still negative. One can present a softer face when you know you still have a knockout bomb in your back pocket. Never trust tricky Greek.

            Comment

            • Prolet
              Senior Member
              • Sep 2009
              • 5241

              #21
              Interesting video, i wonder if we see more of this? This could only be the start of it
              МАКЕДОНЕЦ си кога кавал ќе ти ја распара душата,зурла ќе ти го раскине срцето,кога секое влакно од кожата ќе ти се наежи кога ќе видиш шеснаесеткрако сонце,кога до коска ќе те заболи кога ќе слушнеш ПЈРМ,кога немаш ни за леб,а полн си во душата затоа што ја сакаш МАКЕДОНИЈА. МАКЕДОНИЈА во срце те носиме.

              Comment

              • Mikail
                Senior Member
                • Sep 2008
                • 1338

                #22
                It is interesting. Normally the "others" would shout down anyone supporting Macedonia or Macedonians.

                The fact that Grigoris Valiantos speaks with very little interruption is a mirracle in itself.
                From the village of Pípezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

                Comment

                • sf.
                  Member
                  • Jan 2010
                  • 387

                  #23
                  He didn't support the Macedonians in that clip, but was giving his analysis on the Greek position and attitudes regarding the dispute.
                  Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. - Samuel Johnson (1709-1784)

                  Comment

                  • Rogi
                    Senior Member
                    • Sep 2008
                    • 2343

                    #24
                    Grigoris Valianatos has been outspoken in support of the rights of the Macedonians in Greece many times before.

                    In fact, less than 2 years ago he was fired from his job as a Media Advisor to PASOK leader Papandreu because he expressed publicly (on TV) his views that Greece should recognise the Republic of Macedonia as the Republic of Macedonia, and recognise the existence of and respect the rights of the Macedonian minority in Greece.

                    Comment

                    • sf.
                      Member
                      • Jan 2010
                      • 387

                      #25
                      Cool. I was commenting on the arguments he presented in the clip itself. Which added to his experience in such matters, explains the response of the other participants.
                      Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. - Samuel Johnson (1709-1784)

                      Comment

                      • Rogi
                        Senior Member
                        • Sep 2008
                        • 2343

                        #26
                        I should point out that he is also a long time member of the Board and Chairperson of the Greek Helsinki Monitor for Human Rights.

                        Comment

                        • Coolski
                          Member
                          • Sep 2008
                          • 747

                          #27
                          So what sparked this several minute conversation? That our song is called "Ja imam silata" and they made up that this COULD mean "Ja imam silata da si go čuvam imeto"?

                          1. They are truly schizophrenic, making up scenarios and then complaining about them.
                          2. Everybody has the power to keep their name!
                          - Секој чоек и нација има можност да успеат колку шо си дозволуваат. Нема изговор.
                          - Every human and nation has the ability to be as great or as weak as they allow themselves to be. No excuses.

                          Comment

                          • Coolski
                            Member
                            • Sep 2008
                            • 747

                            #28
                            another thing... where did the image with the Macedonian flag with MACEDONIA written on it, come from?

                            Was it an official Eurovision trailer clip, or was this made by the Greek TV show?

                            Does anyone think that this might have been shown on the program to subliminally get greek viewers used to the idea of us being called Macedonia?

                            Last edited by Coolski; 04-14-2010, 09:09 PM.
                            - Секој чоек и нација има можност да успеат колку шо си дозволуваат. Нема изговор.
                            - Every human and nation has the ability to be as great or as weak as they allow themselves to be. No excuses.

                            Comment

                            • Mikail
                              Senior Member
                              • Sep 2008
                              • 1338

                              #29
                              I would say the flag image in the clip was placed there by televizijasonce.

                              There is no way the Greeks would do such a thing.
                              From the village of Pípezhani, Tashko Popov, Dimitar Popov-Skenderov and Todor Trpenov were beaten and sentenced to 12 years prison. Pavle Mevchev and Atanas Popov from Vrbeni and Boreshnica joined them in early 1927, they were soon after transferred to Kozhani and executed. As they were leaving Lerin they were heard to shout "With our death, Macedonia will not be lost. Our blood will run, but other Macedonians will rise from it"

                              Comment

                              • Serdarot
                                Member
                                • Feb 2010
                                • 605

                                #30
                                Originally posted by Prolet View Post
                                Interesting video, i wonder if we see more of this? This could only be the start of it
                                we will see and hear much more like this.

                                they are starting to prepare their public for such thing as "total lose", but i am sure they will try hard as never to make a "win-win" with "Severna Makedonija" (About the fact that if we accept ANY rename we are idiots i will not write here / now...)
                                Bratot:
                                Никој не е вечен, а каузава не е нова само е адаптирана на новите услови и ќе се пренесува и понатаму.

                                Comment

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