Lowlight of his career, he was dominating that fight, and Rahman caught him with what I consider a very 'lucky' haymaker. Lewis handled his case 9 weeks later with no problems.
No real harm done, except to maybe Lewis' ego lol.
Mixed Martial Arts / Boxing Thread
Collapse
X
-
Leave a comment:
-
-
Originally posted by Soldier of Macedon View PostNot sure if I understand what you are saying, but in the first 21 fights there were 5 that went over 3 rounds, and the last 2 went the distance.
You're detracting from the point, if Tyson even worked out for a week he would have destroyed Douglas.
Holyfield was a good fighter, better than Lewis in my opinion, but Tyson at his prime? He was the best. That's the point here Spartan.
If you consider the end of his prime any earlier than that, then we are talking about a 'prime' of 4 years out of an 20 year career.
For me, not too convincing to be labelled as having a 'hall of fame career'.
Did he fight at a high level in his younger years - yes.
Could it be argued that he fought at the highest level ever - I guess.
Its too bad he didnt fight at this level against better competition so we could have a clearer picture.
Lol...you must have it in for Tyson
something bad to make such a fantastic statement like that Spartan, hahaha. If Tyson is a great, so then must be Lewis???
Don't do it to yourself man, I wouldn't - No, I couldn't, rank Lewis among the likes of Marciano, Tyson, Ali, Foreman, Frazier, heck, I reckon even Jack Dempsey would have dropped that British statue, lol.
Seriously, he has a good record, but I saw nothing amazing in Lewis,
if anything it is he who rose up the ranks beating bums in a power-vacuum heavyweight division while Tyson was doing time in prison.
But, I am not trying to change your mind or perception of him, I can understand how he may hold a special place for you guys up there, why, being a Canadian Olympian, hall-of-famer, and all. I remember every accent change, lol.
Tyson wasn't just about KO's, but it was a feature of his fighting ability and what he was capable of, all through his career, even during his amateur and Olympic spell, he was knocking people's heads off, there was nobody that could stop him,
and if he didn't run into personal problems nobody would have.
Lewis and Holyfield scrambled for the place to fight a guy who had done time and had been completely corrupted in several ways.
From 1996-
A New York judge this week ordered Tyson to make the next defence of his title against Lewis but after protracted transatlantic negotiations, an agreement was struck last night between Tyson's promoter Don King and Team Lewis.
Lewis will be paid [pounds sterling]4m to stand aside and allow Tyson to challenge Bruce Seldon for the WBA version of the heavyweight crown on July 13.
Quite simply, they were not fighting Tyson in champion form, nor even in near peak form, forget his body size post-prison, when he knocked out Berbick he was smaller but leaner, quicker, and just as powerful.
Is that something for Evander and Lennox to be proud of?.
Neither you or I could say definitively 'what would of hapenned' in hypothetical situations.
Spartan, you're a Lewis fanatic.Last edited by Spartan; 12-08-2009, 10:09 PM.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Originally posted by SpartanThats a record of 50 Wins, 6 Losses, 2 No Contest, 44 Knockouts
When the fight has gone beyond 3 rounds he is 13 - 5, so - so.
Frank Bruno is no Mike Tyson, but he beat McCall - And McCall had previously knocked Lewis' block off in 2 rounds. Granted, he did appear to have zoned out in the follow up fight with Lewis when he refused to get up after a few rounds, but he is still winning fights today. Was Lewis beat by a bum or a gun? The point I am trying to make here is that as a boxer in his prime, Mike Tyson is well above all of these jokers.
As to ther Buster Douglas loss, whos problem is it that Tyson decided not to train?
As for Lennox Lewis, he is easily a top 10 heavyweight of all time if Tyson is.............In fact, he beat the besty heavyweights of the time except a couple.
Great fighters!?? Who?? Spinks, lol?
Spinks had a record of 31 wins, 1 loss and 21 wins by knockout as a professional.
In addition to his success as a heavyweight, Spinks is generally considered one of the greatest light heavyweight champions and fighters in the history of the weight class.
On Ring Magazine's list of 100 greatest punchers of all time, Spinks was ranked 42nd.
On Ring Magazine's list of the 80 Best Fighters of the Last 80 Years, released in 2002, Spinks ranked 41st.Spartan, you're a Lewis fanatic.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Originally posted by Spartan View PostI agree that Tyson in his early years was very terrifying, with the potential to be the best ever. Its just that as the competition got stiffer over time, he didnt rise to the occasion so to speak.
A combination of Drugs, Imprisonment, mismanagement, and the death of his mentor and primary trainer lead to his downfall.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Spartan, I think Robbyn Givens was his wife for something like 6 months and i remember her on Oprah stating how he used to bash her and Iron Mike even admitted to it, lets not forget the rape charges he went to jail for it.
The thing about Mike Tyson is that everyone was afraid of his power and so they should, however its not just the power the true boxers will say that you need to outsmart your opponent in order to beat them while with Mike Tyson he simply overpowered his opponents which is great for the spectators however its not just about power when it comes to boxing or any other fighting sport.
Leave a comment:
-
-
SOM, Lennox Lewis proved to be the best, he is a schooled fighter he didnt come from the streets like Mike Tyson i think he has gold medals from the Olympics he was a very smart and dangerous fighter he even beat Vitaly Klitchko, however i'll never forget how he lost to that Ulichar Rahman in South Aftica, Lewis was pounding the shit out of him in the 5th round and out of nowhere Rahman comes out with a haymaker and knocks Lewis out, then in a rematch Lewis knocked him out in the 4th round with a vicious tupajnca.
Tyson ended up loosing $300 Million he had to sleep in homeless shelters, his story goes downhill from there on but i agree nobody can doubt his talent however in boxing you need more brains and thats why he struggled off the field he even bashed his wives. I remember when he said to Lennox Lewis that he was going to eat his children he just went crazy.
Leave a comment:
-
-
^^
It is possible for a peasant Athenian to resemble a Spartan when pitted against a weakling.....
I agree that Tyson in his early years was very terrifying, with the potential to be the best ever. Its just that as the competition got stiffer over time, he didnt rise to the occasion so to speak.Last edited by Spartan; 12-07-2009, 07:50 PM.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Jeez Spartan, quite an in depth analysis!
You make some solid points ... but to be honest, nobody has ever looked more terrifying to me as much as Tyson when in full steam. Hence the honour bestowed upon him. Mind you, in the same vein as guitarists who think they can play better than other famous guitarists .... "I coulda taken him". lol
Leave a comment:
-
-
Mar. 6 -- Hector Mercedes, Albany, N.Y., TKO 1
Apr. 10 -- Trent Singleton, Albany, N.Y., TKO 1
May 23 -- Don Halpern, Albany, N.Y., KO 4
June 20 -- Rick Spain, Atlantic City, N.J., KO 1
July 11 -- John Alderson, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 2
July 19 -- Larry Sims, Poughkeepsie, N.Y., KO 3
Aug. 15 -- Lorenzo Canady, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 1
Sept. 5 -- Michael Johnson, Atlantic City, N.J., KO 1
Oct. 9 -- Donnie Long, Atlantic City, N.J., KO 1
Oct. 25 -- Robert Colay, Atlantic City, N.J., KO 1
Nov. 1 -- Sterling Benjamin, Latham, N.Y., TKO 1
Nov. 13 -- Eddie Richardson, Houston, KO 1
Nov. 22 -- Conroy Nelson, Latham, N.Y., KO 2
Dec. 6 -- Sammy Scaff, New York, KO 1
Dec. 27 -- Mark Young, Latham, N.Y., KO 1
1986
Jan. 10 -- Dave Jaco, Albany, N.Y., TKO 1
Jan. 24 -- Mike Jamison, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 5
Feb. 16 -- Jesse Ferguson, Troy, N.Y., W DSQ 6
Mar. 10 -- Steve Zouski, Uniondale, N.Y., KO 3
May 3 -- James Tillis, Glen Falls, N.Y., W 10
May 20 -- Mitch Green, New York, W 10
June 13 -- Reggie Gross, New York, TKO 1
June 28 -- William Hosea, Troy, N.Y., KO 1
July 11 -- Lorenzo Boyd, Swan Lake, N.Y., KO 2
July 26 -- Marvis Frazier, Glen Falls, N.Y., KO 1
Aug. 17 -- Jose Ribalta, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 10
Sept. 6 -- Alfonzo Ratliff, Las Vegas, KO 2
Nov. 22 -- Trevor Berbick, Las Vegas, TKO 2
(Won WBC Heavyweight Title)
1987
Mar.7 -- James Smith, Las Vegas, W 12
(Won WBA Heavyweight Title/Retained WBC Heavyweight Title)
May 30 -- Pinklon Thomas, Las Vegas, TKO 6
(Retained WBA/WBC Heavyweight Titles)
Aug. 1 -- Tony Tucker, Las Vegas, W 12
(Won IBF Heavyweight Title/Retained WBA/WBC Heavyweight Titles/Became Undisputed World Heavyweight Champion)
Oct. 16 -- Tyrell Biggs, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 7
(Retained Undisputed World Heavyweight Title)
1988
Jan. 22 -- Larry Holmes, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 4
(Retained Undisputed World Heavyweight Title)
Mar. 21 -- Tony Tubbs, Tokyo, Japan, TKO 2
(Retained Undisputed World Heavyweight Title)
June 27 -- Michael Spinks, Atlantic City, N.J., KO 1
(Retained Undisputed World Heavyweight Title)
1989
Feb. 25 -- Frank Bruno, Las Vegas, TKO 5
(Retained Undisputed World Heavyweight Title)
July 21 -- Carl Williams, Atlantic City, N.J., TKO 1
(Retained Undisputed World Heavyweight Title)
1990
Feb. 11 -- James Douglas, Tokyo, Japan, KO by 10
(Lost World Heavyweight Title)
June 16 -- Henry Tillman, Las Vegas, KO 1
Dec. 8 -- Alex Stewart, Atlantic City, N.J., KO 1
1991
Mar. 18 -- Donovan Ruddock, Las Vegas, TKO 7
June 28 -- Donovan Ruddock, Las Vegas, W 12
1995
Aug. 19 -- Peter McNeeley, Las Vegas, W DSQ 1
Dec. 16 -- Buster Mathis, Jr., Philadelphia, KO 3
1996
Mar. 16 -- Frank Bruno, Las Vegas, TKO 3
(Won WBC Heavyweight Title)
Sept. 7 -- Bruce Seldon, Las Vegas, TKO 1
(Won WBA Heavyweight Title)
Nov. 9 -- Evander Holyfield, Las Vegas, TKO by 11
(Lost WBA Heavyweight Title)
1997
June 28 -- Evander Holyfield, Las Vegas, L DQ 3
(For WBA Heavyweight Title)
1999
Jan. 16 -- Francois Botha, Las Vegas, KO 5
Oct. 23 -- Orlin Norris, Las Vegas, NC 1
2000
Jan. 29 -- Julius Francis, Manchester, England, TKO 2
June 24 -- Lou Savarese, Glasgow, Scotland, TKO 1
Oct. 20 -- Andrew Golota, Detroit, NC 3
2001
Oct. 13 -- Brian Nielsen, Copenhagen, Denmark, TKO 7
2002
June 8 -- Lennox Lewis, Memphis, Tennessee, KO by 8
(For WBC and IBF heavyweight title)
2003
Feb. 22 -- Clifford Etienne, Memphis, Tennessee, KO 1
2004
July 30 -- Danny Williams, Louisville, KY, KO by 4
2005
June 11 -- Kevin McBride, Washington, DC, TKO by 6
Referee Joe Cortez stops the fight when Tyson doesn't come out for Round 7. Tyson announces his retirement after the fight.
2006
Oct. 20 -- Corey Sanders, Youngstown, OH, EXH. 4
Thats a record of 50 Wins, 6 Losses, 2 No Contest, 44 Knockouts
When the fight has gone beyond 3 rounds he is 13 - 5, so - so.
Also, after going through these fighters Tyson has faced, I challenge anyone to pick out an actual boxer. 90% of his fights have been against class A bums.
The Bruno dominations you show are impressive until you look at who its against - Bruno, an above average fighter at best. Razor Ruddock I consider decent as well. He also beat an over the hill Holmes, again, not that impressive.
As to ther Buster Douglas loss, whos problem is it that Tyson decided not to train? Not training is not an excuse imo. He should of trained, he didnt...too bad.
Also, regarding the Hollyfield fights, you say he was out of his prime, well what was Hollyfield? A youngster, lol. He was older, and even further removed from his prime, yet thrashed Tyson pretty easily.
As for Lennox Lewis, he is easily a top 10 heavyweight of all time if Tyson is. Dont forget Tysons people dodged the Lewis fight for years, why? I'll tell you, Lenox Lewis size, weight and tecnichal skill would have been a nightmare for Tyson(and most boxers actually).He does not match up vs the giant that is LL. If Lewis wanted, he could sit back, pick off Tyson with jabs for the entire fight if he wanted, and take it on the cards. His reach and speed have made him one of the best boxers of the modern era. He just didnt do it flashy like Tyson. Hes an actual boxer, who would outbox most of his opponents.
Remember when Riddick Bowe threw his one belt in the garbage can? Well that was to avoid fighting Lewis.
Also - Lewis defeated every professional opponent he faced, one of only three World Heavyweight Champions to do so, with Ingemar Johansson and Rocky Marciano being the other two. Gene Tunney and Riddick Bowe avenged their professional defeats, but had "no contest" fights against fighters they never defeated.
Lennox lewis has a better record than Tyson at 41-2-1 with 32 KOs, and he fought much tougher boxers. In fact, he beat the besty heavyweights of the time except a couple.
Against common opponents -
LL TKOd Ruddock in the 2nd round - Tyson beat him in 7 rounds
LL beat Holyfield twice(badly), although for some reason the judges called 1 of their fights a draw, one of the biggest fixes ever.
Tyson lost twice Evander.
They both beat Bruno with ease.
Both lewis' defeats and draw were avenged in the rematches, unlike Tyson.
Some of Lewis victories include - Tyson, Holyfield, Morrison, Briggs, Klitchko, Golota, Mccaul, mercer, Tua, Botha, Bruno(7)
Much stiffer competition.
BANG!!! -- He made great fighters look like amateurs, and good fighters look like they shouldn't be in a ring.
Great fighters!?? Who?? Spinks, lol?
Go through the list, they are all bums.
I agree that he made bums look like they shouldnt be in the ring, but against decent to good fighters, he never impressed me.
People love the raw power, and the big KOs add to the hype, but as an actual pugilist, Lewis was far superior to mike.
Didnt Iron mike lose to Buster Mathis Jr? lol
I think he had the potential to be a top heavyweight of all time, and he did impress when he was young. But at the end of the day, the people around him, the death of his father figure (gus domato??), his complete lack of any sense or brains, and that c$%nt of a wife Givens all contributed to one of the worst dissapointments in boxing history.
Personally, I dont think his name belongs in the same sentence as an Ali or a Marciano.
As for the best pound for pound boxers in the world, other than Ali and Roy Jones, I think the middleweights are better suited for such a title.Last edited by Spartan; 12-07-2009, 11:16 PM.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Spartan, just to clarify:
Lost to Buster Douglas ( who can hardly be considered a 'good' fighter)
What happened to Douglas afterwards? He did what Tyson did, and did not carry out a decent minute of training, so when he came up against Holyfield, he was slaughtered. Big difference there too, Tyson lasted well into the fight and still managed to floor Douglas, whereas Holyfield absolutely mauled Douglas.
Lost to Holyfield twice
Lost to Lennox Lewis (twice too, i think).
No doubt that in his prime he was a devastating puncher, but did he ever win a fight that went past 3 rounds?
Just watch what he does to another great fighter and champ (I promise it will take little of your lifetime):
Tyson vs Spinks - 1st Round Knockout - YouTube
BANG!!! -- He made great fighters look like amateurs, and good fighters look like they shouldn't be in a ring.
Personally, I think that on their best day, Ali and Lewis were better heavyweights.
There is even an argument to be made for Evander I would think.
For your further perusal:
Bruno destroyed the first time
YouTube
Bruno destroyed the second time
YouTube
Spartan, I stand by my sentiment; pound for pound, Iron Mike is the most devastatingly clinical and overwhelmingly powerful fighter there has ever been. In his prime, i'd back the guy against a bear, lol.
Leave a comment:
-
-
The earbiting was Tyson - Holyfield 2. In Tyson-Holyfield 1, Tyson was the overwhelming favorite, yet was bullied, and beaten to a pulp badly by Evander, resulting in a 9th(I think) round TKO and a huge upset.
I'll never forget that fight. Evander came with a gameplan, and executed it to perfection, smothering Tyson in the process. He was in control for the whole fight, and didnt give Tyson a moment to breath.
He was still regarded as a top fighter prior to this fight. After... well we all know how that story ends.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Originally posted by Spartan View PostThe only thing with Tyson though, is did he ever beat a good boxer??
Alot of his wins were vs no-namers in my opinion.
Lost to Buster Douglas ( who can hardly be considered a 'good' fighter)
Lost to Holyfield twice
Lost to Lennox Lewis (twice too, i think).
No doubt that in his prime he was a devastating puncher, but did he ever win a fight that went past 3 rounds?
Personally, I think that on their best day, Ali and Lewis were better heavyweights.
There is even an argument to be made for Evander I would think.
Leave a comment:
-
-
The only thing with Tyson though, is did he ever beat a good boxer??
Alot of his wins were vs no-namers in my opinion.
Lost to Buster Douglas ( who can hardly be considered a 'good' fighter)
Lost to Holyfield twice
Lost to Lennox Lewis (twice too, i think).
No doubt that in his prime he was a devastating puncher, but did he ever win a fight that went past 3 rounds?
Personally, I think that on their best day, Ali and Lewis were better heavyweights.
There is even an argument to be made for Evander I would think.
Leave a comment:
-
-
Can't say I have seen them all but Tyson was an absolute zhivotno in his day. Watch his documentary.
Leave a comment:
-
Leave a comment: