Dnevnik: Macedonian citizens need stable economy, not antiquisation

[NikodimMKD]

5 August 2009 | 14:21 | FOCUS News Agency

Skopje. Economy and people’s deteriorated living standard are more important than the process of antiquization, shows a recent poll conducted by the American International Republican Institute (IRI), the Macedonian daily paper Dnevnik reads. 59% of the respondents consider that Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski should focus all efforts on the economy and not on the Ancient Macedonia program. If the 15% of indifferent respondents are added to the above 59%, it becomes obvious that systematic referring to the ancient origin of the Macedonian nation is backed up by only 26% of all citizens.
The poll was conducted in June involving 1,106 participants and is the first opinion research showing that the country’s antiquization policy is not supported by the public.
The question regarding people’s attitude to the process of antiquization was posed with two options: whether the policy of antiquization contributes to “a strong feeling of Macedonian identity throughout history” or it represents “clouding while the best way for strengthening Macedonian identity is by setting up a stable and modern economy.”
Experts point out that the poll is a direct message from the public to the Prime Minister meaning that by far the use of setting up monuments is lacking. At the same time 43% of the people have stated that their economic situation has deteriorated over the past year.
The Macedonian government and some of the municipalities have spent millions of euros on monuments celebrating ancient times in a situation of deep economic recession.

[King Makedon]

The problem does not lie on the antiquisation of our country, it is elsewhere to be seen.
I regard you as macedonian even the others here do not, but i assume that you are one of us.
Our country has no brend, no sea horbour, no developed tourism.
We are neighbouring to countries which are not very happy with our existance due to their falsification of their identity so that they can exist as a nation.
The economical problems depend on the restricitive policy of our country and the lack of doing some risk for opening the markets.
The administration is on a catastrophical level, where nothing works smooth. For a needed document you have to get 10 different other documents and it's just waiting and loosing time. You know time is money.The infrastructure is also in a developing stage (in at least 20 years it will have european standards with this tempo)
the market is very small with 2.0 mio inhabitants so foreign investitors are not very interested in investing, despite the speeches of the governement. And of course the global crisis does not allow any investing, because no one really is investing anywhere, exclusion china, india, brasil, dubai.
Even if we get in NATO and EU nothing will especially change exept the high prices and the same low wages as we have now.
the people in RoM have to change mentally for creating their own jobs, so that the economy can grow by itself.
People are here only waiting that someone from outside will create jobs and everything gonna be fine (but that will never be the case we know why). foreigners invest for earning money. This money will be transferred to another country).
Another problem is the education, while elsewhere in the west there exist 3 types of classes
(rich, middle class, labourers and peasants) here in macedonia existed only one class. Now we have two rich and poor. If you want to work in a factory you need a diploma from universtiy f.ex..
While for example in germany if you want to learn a handcraft you need to spend three years in learning that while it takes here just 3 months. So no really quallified workers can be found. People do not really like working. they don't care if they are at work or not. They rather go to a betting office and bet for a footballteam than working. As they say they earn there much more money there or doing some illegal crap. they are not used in saving money they spend it all the time in going out for drinking and party and never have any of it. That's why every one owes everyone money in a way.

[Risto the Great]

KM, you have described most modern societies and problems with the Y generation. I believe you 100%. By creating pride in one's identity, it will do amazing things in Macedonia. For this reason, I am happy with the renewed national awakening in Macedonia. Forward planning for the next generation will be necessary and does not exist presently. We are a young country and still have time to set things right.

[King Makedon]

I do agree that national pride is one the most important things for a country. But for making jobs it's just not enough. I don't know how long you have stayed in macedonia and could investigate the administration (complete). for me as a man who tried to open a business here in macedonia (can be seen as foreign investition as a man from germany) it was horrible.
As I said too much waiting and a lot of procedures which are extremly nonsense sometimes. Police is useless. they don't take any measures to prevent. they are so lazy that you have to convince them extremely to come over to you if you got any trouble. Court is similar. everybody knows everybody and they just let you loose to go to another instance. and after averything failed you have to sew them in Strassbourg(France) to get you right.
People do see me as a person from whom can be taken money.they don't care that I worked hard for it. they just don't see me as one them but as an outsider, or what is even worse a nutty person who came to maceodonia to work on his own instead of staying in germany, where the money fall down from heaven and everybody is happy.
Maybe the visa liberation will change their minds after seeing how life is really abroad.
And I hope that people here really change their behaviour when they work, they shall work and not tell me their philosophie and begging for some extra cash, for lousy working. they just go the easy way.
These negative things about lousy working attitude is made by socialism, and transition without jobs for years. This has to be changed immediatly if macedonia wants to go forward in the economy aswell the restrictive policy and defending the oligarchs (who all got their money in doing crime) instead of encouraging honest poeple for creating jobs and make it heaven for working by less restrictions.

[Risto the Great]

You have said more in one paragraph than any economist can ever hope to convey in an entire thesis. Thanks KM.

[King Makedon]

So sad it might be. but these were my impressions i got here starting working.
and no wonder why foreign investitors are coming so rare, aswell as macedonian businessmen from outtside macedonia (like myself) who wish to help their country.
A lot of things have to be changed in this case and on other cases aswell.
but it will change sooner or later.

[Jankovska]

I agree and i have always had the worst things to say about our administration. As for the workers I disagree. People in Macedonia are hard working, the poor people work bloody hard to survive and no one can tell me that is not true. No pperson in the western contries works like some of these people. Another thing why foreign business doesn't blossom in macedonia is the fact that most of you 'businessmen' think you can throw 100 euros at someone and use them day and night. This is not China.I bet you a zillion% that if you offered a nice wage, no matter how hard the work is you will have many many people for it, hard working honest people. But if you are going to give me 100 euros so I can work on a machine for like 15 euros I can tell you where to stick it or I will come and provide as good work as per the wage.
Don't get me started on employee rights etc. You know what will happen if someone screamed or used swear words against someone in my work place? If reported it will be one big fucking mess, especially if the boss is invloved. In Macedonia you keep quiet and take it. Is that right? Fuck all the businessmen who behave like this.
Maybe you are different and you got frustrated and I understand why but you have to just realised that those people have been treated by many previos bosses like shit and they have no reason to trust you are any different.

[Risto the Great]

Jankovska, it is always wrong to generalise.
But the mentality for having a coffee, making people wait .... when work should be done etc. is prevalent in Macedonia. As it is in most Balkan countries. They have been slaves for so long, the people in administration feel a little bit of power is a wonderful thing.

As far as workers go, I agree that more money is a huge incentive.

I was needing some software programmers for a client's business. Macedonians I met online suggested some friends that were competent in the programming languages we required. I wanted to help some Macedonians rise above their situation and offered some of them some projects. The lack of interest was absolutely pathetic and we had not even discussed prices yet. I was astounded at these people's inability to seize upon business opportunity. Pathetic and to be honest, no different from the Greeks whatsoever in terms of business/work ethic.

[Jankovska]

About 90% of the private sector businessmen in Macedonia are pisstakers, that is not generlisation, that is the reality. most people are employed in these factories, workin 15 hour shifts and are treated like shit. When it comes to the administration, hospitals, banks i am right with you, they are lazy shits and a drastic change needs to happen. See people in Macedonia are split into poor and rich, the rich ones always have an easy lezacka rabota and they do business like this> A be sto se sekiras, ke bide, ne se brzaj majka mu, blah blah. However the poor people, the actual workers are not like that. They work like slaves and it brakes my heart to see them. i saw this bus taking this women to work in this factory and they were all sqashed together, the life out of their faces drained, it looked like Nazi Germany. Factory workers, counstruction workers, etc work blood hard for the 100 euros they get for their families while the rich sit on their arses and represent our country. The poor people are not protected in any way and trust me there are more of these than the lazy sods you see in banka and sobranie. Employment law has to change in Macedonia for these people.

[King Makedon]

Well I'm not one of these 90%.
As I said Icame from Germany and tried to introduce, german way of working. I was liberal and social to my employees. I payed above the regular fees inclusive assurance and payed my taxes. What i earned from them, was sitting and doing nothing drinking coffe, sitting and playing computer or chatting, customers were waiting and they always stole money and betrayed me in any possible way. After I fired them and I hired other people adn intorduced bonus cash for good turnover with the same effect, then i cut the salaries to regular fees, with the same effect. so it doesn't seem that more money will make them better work. It's their attitude towards working. A lot of people (customers) argued with me why am I not more strict to them and so on and so on, like the others 90%. Obviously only in that way they do work.
And don't tell me macedonians are hardworking people. the older generations maybe but only a few. the rest are already taken or live outside macedonia. You know how kids grow up here. Parents are paying everything to get his kid educated, which does not mean that he is really educated, just pushed by parents with (vrski) ties. It begins in school when parents go to the teachers and beg them for good grades and pay them money. In universities the same situation etc... Kids never learn to work, they only hang out on the streets with their friends and do stupid things like actually doing nothing but talking nonsense,because they know that their parent will push them agian to the right direction. I know here people who got medical doctors but read in their lifes only two pages (no joke), or someone is thinking that the moon is a star,too (no joke). these are mostly kids from rich parents, but their knowledge is lower than of a standard american highschool student. Of course there are kids with really huge knowledge. but they also have no expereince in working.
Their only experience is copying what the others do. And the others do drinking coffee. They don't care that their jobs are in danger if the business doesn not work. They live for today, what happens tomorrow they are not really interested, so they never plan their future.
I know what work means. I was educated that way by the germans.and I worked really hard to save money for running my own business. the germans never gave me the chance my parents to show up infornt of my teachers for begging them for a better grade. My parents tried it that way when i was a kid knowing macedonian customs. but not a chance.
So everything i suceeded it was by my self, not by my parents.

[King Makedon]

Jankovska, it is always wrong to generalise.
But the mentality for having a coffee, making people wait .... when work should be done etc. is prevalent in Macedonia. As it is in most Balkan countries. They have been slaves for so long, the people in administration feel a little bit of power is a wonderful thing.

As far as workers go, I agree that more money is a huge incentive.

I was needing some software programmers for a client's business. Macedonians I met online suggested some friends that were competent in the programming languages we required. I wanted to help some Macedonians rise above their situation and offered some of them some projects. The lack of interest was absolutely pathetic and we had not even discussed prices yet. I was astounded at these people's inability to seize upon business opportunity. Pathetic and to be honest, no different from the Greeks whatsoever in terms of business/work ethic.

Yeah, same situation,too. I needed some programmers for a webpage.
I let them choose how much money they want to get for the job get done. I agreed to their conditions. And I never heard again from them. Obvoiusly they were not intereseted in earning money.

[Jankovska]

Or maybe you didn't pay enough. I don't believe it. Sorry

[Rogi]

I have had a lot of positive experiences with outsourcing work to Macedonia.

The worst part is finding them - they really are hard to find, they don't seem to advertise anywhere, and I was specifically looking for programmers/developers in Macedonia. Though, this may no longer be the case, this was some 2 years ago and I've since changed career paths.

But in my experience, for over 50 very different projects, they do the job and they know their stuff and are more accommodating than most others (from various places) to whom I have outsourced some of my clients' work.

[Risto the Great]

Rogi, I am glad you had some positive experiences.
Personally, I feel like I would need a whip to keep people moving in the Balkans. Perhaps some chains tied around their ankles as well.

Most people with huge work ethics left their Balkan countries behind many years ago.

[Pelister]

What a rubbish article.

We all know that our economy is likely to strengthen with better bilateral relations with other countries.

We can have good relations with other countries, and take some pride on our history (as long as it is honest and truthful).

Our claims to antiquity can be substantiated on the basis of various Macedonian dances, traditions, songs, customs, rites and rituals - not to mention words, language ...etc - but we have to be honest about them.

Erecting statues of the heroes of a bygone era, should be encouraged, because as Macedonians we are many things. Celebrating Heraklea, is just as important as celebrating Tsar Samuil. All of it is important, so this is a bullshit article.