Macedonian Patriotic Organization

[Vangelovski]

Meto's duties as president include daily operations, he does not have sole authority to manipulate the agenda's and policies of UMD, that is where the board of directors comes into play as a form of checks and balances.

Buktop, where does your (supposed) knowledge of UMDs internal workings come from?

[Buktop]

Buktop, where does your (supposed) knowledge of UMDs internal workings come from?

From their website, I have attended meetings, and from countless statements issued by UMD, I don't know how much more transparent they can be about how things work...

Where does your (supposed) knowledge of international legal practice (not principle) come from?

[Vangelovski]

I was asking you about your supposed knowledge of UMDs internal workings and you claim to know something about it from attending meetings, their website and their statements???? Have you read their constitution? Have you actually been a member of their board? I have. I co-founded the organisation.

[El Bre]

Should the UMD have a vetting process when choosing a leader? or is this a case of people in glass houses throwing stones?

I'm still trying to figure out if some people are just honing their cutting implements or if the President is carrying too much baggage.

[TajnataKniga]

i had to do my own research on MPO as ive heard many times the it has been infiltrated by the bulgarian secret service. their website has a resolution from back in 2007 on macedonia's name. very positive and seems to me in line with the macedonian cause. but, if you click on the MPO store link on their website they have a whole bunch of bulgarian material - not so good. i like the museum idea (has anyone been?), http://www.macedonian.org/Activities/museum.asp

MPO publishes a newspaper called Makedonska Tribina, http://www.macedonian.org/Tribune/default.asp on the page it says the newspaper focuses on 'the plight of oppressed Macedonian minorities in Bulgaria and Greece.'

has anyone read Andrew Rossos' latest book on the history of macedonians? the vmro period is quite a blurry time (bulgaria and its church waged a lot of progaganda on macedonia and many people claimed to be bulgarian). MPO seems to be founded during this period. the language is a tough thing, because prior to Koneski, and i agree with koloski the macedonian alphabet was the old church slavonic. see the australian newspaper makedonska iskra from 1946: http://www.pollitecon.com/html/maced...o_1_Page_1.jpg look at the top left australia is spelled with a backwards r. does this make the publishers of this newspaper bulgarian?

http://www.macedonian.org/media/resolution0701.asp

MPO Convention Resolutions
UN, International Recognition of the Republic of Macedonia by its Constitutional Name
RESOLUTION

The duly elected delegates of the Macedonian Patriotic Organization of the United States and Canada (MPO) who met on September 1, 2007, in Dearborn, Michigan, for their 86th Annual Convention, unanimously voted to urge the United Nations (UN) and the governments of all nations to recognize the Republic of Macedonia by its constitutional name, to employ such name in all communications with such nation and to employ such name in all international bodies and organizations, and hereby proclaim:

WHEREAS, the Republic of Macedonia became a member of the UN on April 8, 1993, and, as an independent state, has the sovereign right to determine its national identity and name; and,

WHEREAS, since the Republic of Macedonia’s admission to the UN, it has been subject as a condition of such admission, to reference at such body and in other international bodies and organizations as the “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia” or by the insulting acronym “FYROM” at the insistence of the Hellenic Republic; and,

WHEREAS, the imposition of the name “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia” as a condition for the Republic of Macedonia’s admission into the United Nations and the continued reference to the Republic of Macedonia by such name is an affront to the Republic of Macedonia’s sovereign rights, an insult to the basic human dignity of its citizens, violates the letter and spirit of the United Nations Charter, and lacks any legal or rational basis; and,

WHEREAS, after the people of the Republic of Macedonia declared their independence from Yugoslavia in 1991 and named their new multi-ethnic, democratic nation the Republic of Macedonia, the Hellenic Republic imposed an illegal trade embargo against the Republic of Macedonia, devastated its economy and demanded amendments to its constitution and changes to its national symbols; and,

WHEREAS, the Hellenic Republic continues its refusal to recognize the Republic of Macedonia’s constitutional name, has failed to participate in good faith in the UN -brokered talks over the “name dispute” while disingenuously referring to the Republic of Macedonia’s “intransigence” at such talks, has made concerted efforts to misrepresent the term “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia” as the Republic of Macedonia’s actual name, and most disturbingly, has threatened to veto the Republic of Macedonia’s admission to NATO and/or the European Union simply if the Republic of Macedonia refuses to change its name and bow to the Hellenic Republic’s demands; and,

WHEREAS, three of the five permanent members of the UN Security Council, the United States of America, the Russian Federation and the People’s Republic of China, recognize the Republic of Macedonia by its constitutional name and more than 100 additional nations, a majority of the members of the UN recognize the Republic of Macedonia by its constitutional name; and,

WHEREAS, the continued use of the terms “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia” and/or “FYROM” as a reference to the Republic of Macedonia by the United Nations, other international bodies, and certain nations is tantamount to approval of the Hellenic Republic’s outrageous, irrational, and anti-democratic conduct toward the Republic of Macedonia, THEREFORE BE IT

RESOLVED, that the MPO Urges the United Nations, all other international bodies and all nations that have not yet done so, to end their tacit approval of the Hellenic Republic’s encroachment on the sovereignty of the Republic of Macedonia and to recognize the Republic of Macedonia by its constitutional name with all haste.

Copies to:
Secretary-General of the United Nations, United Nations Security Council, Officials & Members of the European Union & European Communities, President of the United States of America, its Secretary of State, US Ambassadors to all appropriate countries and organizations, Prime Minister of Canada & its Minister of Department of Foreign Affairs and International Trade, Canadian Ambassadors to all appropriate countries and organizations, Appropriate US Congressional Committees, Officials and media in the Republic of Macedonia

[Prolet]

Prolet, I don't expect much out of Meto's visit. It will be the same old glitz and glamour without substance. I don't think UMD will change its position because its American board members actually believe in the Interim Accord and Framework Agreement. I'm just wondering how UMD is managing to fund Meto's globe trotting, full-time salary and Washington office?

Vangelovski, What about the office in Brussels and the new office in Paris??

You where part of the UMD im sure you are aware of their financial situation, you where one of the founding members of the UMD as i recall.

Buktop, I think i also answered your last question that you asked Vangelovski.

[El Bre]

has anyone read Andrew Rossos' latest book on the history of Macedonians? the vmro period is quite a blurry time (Bulgaria and its church waged a lot of propaganda on Macedonia and many people claimed to be Bulgarian). MPO seems to be founded during this period.

One would have to look at the history of the founders, in particular where they were from and the sphere of influence the were under at the time. A number of the original settlers to Canada and the U.S. which constituted the MPO were from the western Kostur area, that would probably be a good place to start.

[Vangelovski]

What about those offices? I'd rather one office spreading the right message than a thousand offices spreading the wrong message.

I havn't been a part of UMD for two years, so I'm no longer familiar with their financial situation.

[El Bre]

Who are these so called Bulgarian Macedonian Churches??

Prolet, the parishoners of these churches were ordinary Macedonians like you and me. You couldn't just build a church, you needed a patron. The villages that these people came from probably had a Bulgarian church to begin with. Hence the affiliation.

[TajnataKniga]

was western kostur run by the bulgarian army or bulgarian church? did people in western kostur attend bulgarian church because they had to or because they wanted to?

just found a wiki article on mpo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedon...c_Organization

read the part

MPO "Luben Dimitroff" and the unauthorized Macedonian Tribune
In the last years a former chapter of MPO from Toronto called "Luben Dimitroff",[12] which rejects the contemporary policy of MPO, splintered from the Canadian MPO and started publishing a Macedonian Tribune in the pre-World War II Bulgarian orthography, espousing pro-Bulgarian views of Macedonia and the Macedonians. This publication has been dismissed as false and unauthorized by the Macedonian Patriotic Organization. The MPO Board of Directors stated that it "disavows any statements made in this electronic publication and condemns the statements and sentiments expressed therein. Furthermore, the MPO Board of Directors states that there is no such entity as "MPO Luben Dimitroff" and that any individuals claiming to constitute such organization are not members of the MPO notwithstanding any claims to the contrary." [13]

see what the MPO used to do in 1932: YouTube - Macedonian protest-Macedonia for Macedonians-1922

in the info place on youtube it says

The Macedonian political organisation was formed in the year 1922 in Fort Vejn and fought for Macedonia to Macedonians.
In the year 1956 the Bulgarian spy Shkartov and later Lebamof too entered the organisation and started destorying it by making it a bulgarian propaganda center and by chasing away the real founders of the organisation.
In the year 1957 the Maceonian political organisation was renamed into "Македонска патриотическа организација"(Macedonian patriotic organisation) and from that time this organisation started doing antimacedonian propaganda.

[Buktop]

I was asking you about your supposed knowledge of UMDs internal workings and you claim to know something about it from attending meetings, their website and their statements???? Have you read their constitution? Have you actually been a member of their board? I have. I co-founded the organisation.

Good for you, and I am sorry but it isn't a secret how UMD makes decisions.

From the discussions we have had on these forums Vangelovski, I can only say I am glad that you left UMD. I don't see how anyone can work with someone who is so unreasonable.

[Vangelovski]

Good for you, and I am sorry but it isn't a secret how UMD makes decisions.

From the discussions we have had on these forums Vangelovski, I can only say I am glad that you left UMD. I don't see how anyone can work with someone who is so unreasonable.

Buktop, you need to become more informed. You're doing a great disservice spreading "facts" that you have made up in your head.

[Buktop]

Buktop, you need to become more informed. You're doing a great disservice spreading "facts" that you have made up in your head.

why don't you enlighten us to the inner workings of UMD policy making then? Come now surely you remember something from 2 years ago...

[Buktop]

TajnataKniga, thank you for that information, it really explains a lot.

[Vangelovski]

why don't you enlighten us to the inner workings of UMD policy making then? Come now surely you remember something from 2 years ago...

Buktop, I could reveal a lot about UMD policy making, but its not really relevant (unless you're a UMD member and then you should be really concerned) - you were the one making false claims, so I was just wondering where you were getting your information from.