Macedonian and Slavic Placenames in Greece and Albania

[Risto the Great]

Oh ... ok, take that one out.

[Soldier of Macedon]

The rump lot under the list at the top is there specifically for this kind of discussion to take place where we can eliminate any names that shouldn't be there.

I can't believe the Russian linguist is still on about the same garbage.

At the beginning of the thread, I clearly stipulated that:

Included here will be Slavic placenames, and placenames of a Slavic nature which have been 'mutated' or formed into a hybrid consisting of Greek and Albanian words also, for afterall, it demonstrates clear Slavic influence.

Khrisovitsa is a placename that clearly demonstrates Slavic influence. Greeks would not name it Khrisovitsa, they would rather Khrisou or Khrisos.


In respect to Souvlani's hometown we will take Donkey Island out of the equation. Feel free to continue with your suggestions Souvlanitsa.

[Svoliani]

Soldier, dont mind me , im just gonna filter out a bit more here

Argyrochori - argyro = silver chori - village
Elatorchori - elato = pine,fir chori - village
Anthochori - anthos = blossoms chori = village
Vrakhonisidha - vrakho = formed rock nisi = island
Dhiavoloremma - diavolo = devil remma = creek = devilscreek
Drepanon - drepano = sickle
Drosochorion - droso = wet, dew chori = village
Drosopigi - droso = wet, dew pigi = well
Galatista - Gala = milk
Grammeni Petra - grammeni = written petra = rock = writtenrock
Kalogeritsa - kalogeri = monks
Kastanitsa - kastana = chestnuts
Kremasto - kremasto = hung or suspended

A few Turkish ones on the list
Dherveni - derven = a narrow street in Turkish
Baryamitsi - Baryam = a common name, possibly meaning gift
Kucuk koi - kucuk = possibly means small(not certain) koi = village

[Вардарец]

Soldier, dont mind me , im just gonna filter out a bit more here

Argyrochori - argyro = silver chori - village
Elatorchori - elato = pine,fir chori - village
Anthochori - anthos = blossoms chori = village
Vrakhonisidha - vrakho = formed rock nisi = island
Dhiavoloremma - diavolo = devil remma = creek = devilscreek
Drepanon - drepano = sickle
Drosochorion - droso = wet, dew chori = village
Drosopigi - droso = wet, dew pigi = well
Galatista - Gala = milk
Grammeni Petra - grammeni = written petra = rock = writtenrock
Kalogeritsa - kalogeri = monks
Kastanitsa - kastana = chestnuts
Kremasto - kremasto = hung or suspended

A few Turkish ones on the list
Dherveni - derven = a narrow street in Turkish
Baryamitsi - Baryam = a common name, possibly meaning gift
Kucuk koi - kucuk = possibly means small(not certain) koi = village

Galatista - Gala = milk

What does Galatasaray means in Turkish, hence Gala there too. But the ending sufix is ITSA/ИЦА

Kalogeritsa - Kaloger/Kaluger - monk (i suppose the ones that don't get married) + the sufix ITSA / ИЦА

[toothpaste]

Galatista - Gala = milk

What does Galatasaray means in Turkish, hence Gala there too. But the ending sufix is ITSA/ИЦА

Kalogeritsa - Kaloger/Kaluger - monk (i suppose the ones that don't get married) + the sufix ITSA / ИЦА

About Galata(s).

It s probably either Greek (gala=milk ,Galatas=milkman,milk producer) or Italian/Genoese (calata=stairway) ,as in some time it was inhabited by Italian merchants.

Saray is the palace.(turkish)

The sufix is -ISTA not -ITSA . (Galat-ista) ,and the village was inhabited by Greek speaking population only.


Kalogeritsa
Kalo(s)(=good)+ ger(os)(oldman) +itsa.

A suffix cannot prove the origin of a word ,but the root.Moreover when this suffix (itsa) passed in Greek and is used together (although not so often) with the other suffixes that mean "small" (eg -aki ,-idi(o) etc)

[El Bre]

A Kalogeritsa is a nun.

[toothpaste]

A Kalogeritsa is a nun.

Literally the etymology is as i wrote.
Of course "kalogeros" (lit."good-oldman") is used instead of "monachos" (literally "alone") too,both meaning "monk".

Nun is kalo(good)+gria(oldwoman)=kalogria.

[Delodephius]

This can go ad perpetuam.

[toothpaste]

Hm..it s quiet useless ..

So whats the conclusion ?
There were slavic place names in Greece? Thats known.

[Delodephius]

You started it. Go back to page one.

[toothpaste]

You started it. Go back to page one.

Not really..

My post in p.1 was:
"So i guess slavic toponyms in Southern Greece mean that Slavic migration really happened...Isn't?

Or was there an ancient Macedonian migration to Peloponnese ?"


So...exactly ...i asked for a conclusion an explanation,but didn't get any real answer.

[Delodephius]

I know, I know. But you should have learned by now how things operate. If I asked the question I would get a real answer. But you are a Greek, you don't deserve a real answer because when you ask the questions your heart is not in the right place.

Let me then give you the answer to the question (in a form of a question):

"So I guess Slavic toponyms in Southern Greece mean that Slavic migration really happened... Isn't it?

What is the alternative explanation, if there was no Slavic migration yet those toponyms are indeed Slavic?

[toothpaste]

I know, I know. But you should have learned by now how things operate. If I asked the question I would get a real answer. But you are a Greek, you don't deserve a real answer because when you ask the questions your heart is not in the right place.

Let me then give you the answer to the question (in a form of a question):

What is the alternative explanation, if there was no Slavic migration yet those toponyms are indeed Slavic?

Comment n.1 looks like prejudice..isn't?
Of course my question also revealed my doubt-this is clear.

Yes they are slavic. They have common root with similar words of all slavic languages.

So..if i got it right-Do you believe that these toponyms pre-existed?
If yes...why they are nowhere mentioned before 7th-8th century AD,but only AFTER that??

[Delodephius]

Because something was not mentioned before a certain point, it does not mean it did not exist before that point. My own village was not mentioned before the 13th century. Does this mean it did not exist? Or it just didn't appear in records? Or that it was known under a different name by the authors who kept records? These factors always need to be remembered by a good historian who keeps to the principles of historic methodology.

In the same way, no nation was born when it was first time mentioned in the written records.

[toothpaste]

Because something was not mentioned before a certain point, it does not mean it did not exist before that point. My own village was not mentioned before the 13th century. Does this mean it did not exist? Or it just didn't appear in records? Or that it was known under a different name by the authors who kept records? These factors always need to be remembered by a good historian who keeps to the principles of historic methodology.

In the same way, no nation was born when it was first time mentioned in the written records.

Slovak...in the beginning of the thread a Huge catalog of place names was presented (although with many mistakes it remained really big).

On the other hand we have mentions-HUNDREDS or EVEN THOUSANDS for all of Greece,on stone or sources of ancient toponyms of the region-and these toponyms DO NOT include the previous HUGE catalog.

Is there a logical explanation?

I would say yes-Simply they didn't existed.

Also the "slavic migrations" are dated exactly before these slavic toponyms start to be mentioned in the sources.
A coincidence again..or just the same reasonable simple explanation...?