Your Opinion - What % is the Greek component of modern Greeks?

[Voltron]

I believe that there has never been a historical community anywhere on the ground that could be called distinctively 'Greek'. I havn't found any 'ethnic Greeks' yet. There are countless references to contemporary Greeks, and there are many of them that equate contemporary Greeks with the ancient Greeks, and continue to push the myth, even though often in most cases they are clearly referring to Albanians, Turks and others. There is no evidence of an distinctive 'ethnic Greek' per se.

Yet there is distinct evidence to show of a Macedonian one ? Dear God you need help.

hey anybody know how much % of milk I had in my coffee today ?

[Voltron]

Its hard to find ancient greeks in Greece, 90% of the Athenians are Arvanites (Albanians) but most of them have been assimilated in Greeks because they was Ortodox.

Ancient Greeks imprints have been dispersed everywhere. They have traveled far and wide and most likely the people of Macedonia, Epirus, Thrace, Italy (Siciily), Levant, Asia Minor, Cyprus, etc have them.
Now to argue how much is really left is irrelevent. Fact of the matter is we are a people that still speak the same language, live in the same location and continue a hertigae from the late Byzantine Empire which were inheritors of the Greek legacy. A new Christian one that is.

[Daskalot]

None in my humble opinion, to be Greek today and when the Greek state was created back in the 1830s (never existing before this date) is the same as to be an American. It is simply a national label.
Read the first Greek constitution and this will be very obvious to you.

[Soldier of Macedon]

Fact of the matter is we are a people that still speak the same language, live in the same location and continue a hertigae from the late Byzantine Empire which were inheritors of the Greek legacy. A new Christian one that is.

When you say 'still speak the same language' that only applies to a limited percentage of modern Greeks. Let's not go through the same circle again. Many of whom you consider 'Greeks' today descend from people who spoke non-Greek languages at home for centuries prior to being forced to give them up.

[Daskalot]

Greeks believe they are Greek due to the enormous propaganda perpetrated by the Greek state on its citizens via the educational system and via the church.

Greece today is comparable to Disneyland an Ancient theme park.

Just ask the Otto the first real Greek king from Bavaria, Germany.

[Daskalot]

Greece what a joke, it all will fall apart, time is up. Amazing!

[Voltron]

None in my humble opinion, to be Greek today and when the Greek state was created back in the 1830s (never existing before this date) is the same as to be an American. It is simply a national label.
Read the first Greek constitution and this will be very obvious to you.

Daskalot, on the one hand we are racists elitists and on the other our constitution is broadened to define non-Greek people as Greeks.
You choosingly want to ignore the word assimilation just in order to justify your beliefs.

Soldier of Macedon Quote:
When you say 'still speak the same language' that only applies to a limited percentage of modern Greeks. Let's not go through the same circle again. Many of whom you consider 'Greeks' today descend from people who spoke non-Greek languages at home for centuries prior to being forced to give

For the sake of the arguement even if we are to say for example a statisical figure of a quarter of Vlachs and a quarter of Arvanites which would be 50% of our modern ethnos. It would still leave half and thats not including Asia Minor, Cyprus, Parts of Italy/Sicily. No matter how much someone would try to inflate the numbers of Non-Greeks in Greece learning Greek it still comes up short.

Then you would get into the philisophical question the correctness to have the minorities go back to their roots since its most likely they have Greek background by default and dont even know it.

[Soldier of Macedon]

For the sake of the arguement even if we are to say for example a statisical figure of a quarter of Vlachs and a quarter of Arvanites which would be 50% of our modern ethnos.

A good portion of the other 50% is made up of a variety of other Christian groups. You would be hard pressed to find a genuine Greek majority in Greece, so you shouldn't delude yourself with these fantasy 'Greeks' from Asia Minor when most of them only ever heard the Greek language during church sermons.

Then you would get into the philisophical question the correctness to have the minorities go back to their roots since its most likely they have Greek background by default and dont even know it.

What are you talking about?

[Voltron]

A good portion of the other 50% is made up of a variety of other Christian groups. You would be hard pressed to find a genuine Greek majority in Greece, so you shouldn't delude yourself with these fantasy 'Greeks' from Asia Minor when most of them only ever heard the Greek language during church sermons.

What other variety ? Slavs ? (that has already been discussed), who else ? What about Tsakonian speakers ? We also discussed about Greeks in Turkey and to say that they were taught language in church sermons is false. Proof is the exsting dialects we have in Greek.
I would advise anybody to actually study Greek and the different dialects of Greek before making baseless assumptions.

What are you talking about?

I believe the Greek gene pool to have been dispersed in the Balkans. So if a Macedonian, Arvanite, Vlach were to learn Greek it wouldnt be to far off as introducing them to a language their ancestors once spoke.

[George S.]

My neighbour said being a greek is so crazy that they made them go back to school to relearn the greek language.They were taught to be proud being greek.But really were they
wre just pretending to be one.A majority of them came from someplace else.The greek language is not the same as it was in the old days.

[Onur]

I believe the Greek gene pool to have been dispersed in the Balkans. So if a Macedonian, Arvanite, Vlach were to learn Greek it wouldnt be to far off as introducing them to a language their ancestors once spoke.

This is the classic Greek allegation whenever you talk about their non-greekness and when they are out of answers. They say "so what, everyone was Greek once, it doesn't matter if they speak Albanian, Vlach, Macedonian, Turkish for the last 1000+ years because they were Greek 5000 years ago!!!" Voila, everyone happy.

But never ever ask why and how all these people switched their mothertongue without modern education systems. The only thing they can tell you is; Turks cut off their tongues if they speak Greek, thats why they spoke Albanian, Vlach languages. They really believe that crap

[Voltron]

Its true Onur. We were travellers and there are Greek cities everywhere.
They probably changed their language due to invasions, kidnappings(janisseries), socio-political change as many Macedonian friends here like to claim for themselves and so on.
Greek has been in the nieghborhood long before Albanian, Slav or Turk has been here.
Also latin for longetivity in the Balkans but thats really about it. Latin and Greek are the only surivivors of those languages back then.

[Soldier of Macedon]

What other variety ? Slavs ? (that has already been discussed), who else ?

It has been discussed, but not included in your 50%. Have you factored in the Roma? How about all of the Turkish, Armenian, etc, Christians from Asia?

What about Tsakonian speakers ?

What about them? Their particular dialect may be unique but ultimately their language also appears to be based on Koine, like all other living Greek dialects.

We also discussed about Greeks in Turkey and to say that they were taught language in church sermons is false. Proof is the exsting dialects we have in Greek.

Latin was as widespread as Greek during Roman times. Why do you think that Latin split into several languages, yet Greek only has dialects?

I believe the Greek gene pool to have been dispersed in the Balkans. So if a Macedonian, Arvanite, Vlach were to learn Greek it wouldnt be to far off as introducing them to a language their ancestors once spoke.

Overly simplistic and hardly a credible reason to force people into renouncing their true ethno-linguistic identities. Although I will give you top marks for innovation

[Daskalot]

I would advise anybody to actually study Greek and the different dialects of Greek before making baseless assumptions.

The only dialects of Greek that I am aware of are the Ancient ones spoken in the various waring city states. Do you know of any other dialects Voltron?

[Voltron]

^ There are enough to take notice Daskalot. Go to Argos then go to Pyrgos and you can easily hear the difference. This is just one example.

It has been discussed, but not included in your 50%. Have you factored in the Roma? How about all of the Turkish, Armenian, etc, Christians from Asia?

Turkish ? we filtered them out during the population exchange. So that gets disqualified by default. Armenian ? Sure how many do you think were enough to make an impact. Roma ? Roma will always be Roma they are a clan group and no matter how well they integrate they stick to their own. Who else ? What other Christians can you think of ?

What about them? Their particular dialect may be unique but ultimately their language also appears to be based on Koine, like all other living Greek dialects.

No, Tsakonian is Doric.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tsakonian_language

Latin was as widespread as Greek during Roman times. Why do you think that Latin split into several languages, yet Greek only has dialects?

Yes, it did split. Does that mean that there are no native Italians in Italy from Roman and Pre-Roman times ? Take a look at some players like Gattuso or Totti and let me know if you think the Native Italians (for the lack of a better term) have been wiped off the face of the planet.

Overly simplistic and hardly a credible reason to force people into renouncing their true ethno-linguistic identities. Although I will give you top marks for innovation

Its common sense SOM. Thats all.